To think having XL bullies around children is child neglect?

[Eaglemom]

To think that parents who have XL Bullies in the house with children should be investigated for child neglect. Its the same as leaving a child with a loaded gun to play with. What the hell is wrong with people that are willing to take this chance with their children’s lives?

U just choke a dog out, no need to stab it or hurt it but use a lead or by the collar twist it until the dog is out. Then u can get it on a lead or owner can then control it. I dont believe any dog should be off lead nowadays, I've walked my own dog a couple of times and another dog (not a bully's breed) has attack my dog which left me to pick her up off the ground. You have more control over ur dogs wen on leads, end off!!

I don't know what the solution is but some of the recent media pictures of those dogs snuggling up to babies and children are really chilling.

Of course all dogs can bite if provoked but just one bite from these large breeds could easily kill.

The "but my dog would never attack" brigade are so naive as any dog when in pain or getting a fright can turn in an instant.

Same with the "it's not the dog it's the owner" - it is the dog mauling people regardless of the owner.

what a ridiculous statement 🤦🏻‍♀️

Is the answer to licence dog owners? Understand this may not be a popular view, but I honestly feel the owners are the key. Have seen small aggressive dogs and large ones. To me it's the owner who must be responsible for training and managing their dog.

Totally agree, you used to have a license when you had a dig, don't know why it changed. The onus should be on the owners , and no dog big or small should be off lead , simple

^ This
More children are harmed by humans than dogs.

As a dog owner myself to a cross breed ( collie/ springer ) with 2 very young children, i would not leave my child nor advise anyone else to leave a child on their own with any dog due to the understanding that any dog has the potential to get violent and children could always do something wether intentional or unintentionally hurt the animal causing a reaction.

I do though believe that certain dogs should always have a muzzle on in public only down to the fact of how much harm they could cause to a member of the public and that certain people should not have dogs of certain breeds of they cannot control them. For example I have seen an elderly man in my area with an akita who is unmuzzled and only on a standard neck collar and lead, this dog could be really friendly but members of the public won't know this and will see a huge animal with a frail man who will not be able to pull back a dog of that size/strength.

When it comes down to it for certain breeds of dogs like the XL bully, akitas and other dogs of high strength that people who are wanting one should under go extensive training and made sure that they have the correct wear for these animals to aid in control in public while always wearing a muzzle in public for the assurance of public safety.

Some will say my views will somehow be unjustifiable to the dogs in question but it would be more unjust to the animal to place them in unsafe situations where it could possible hurt someone and have it's life cut short as a result of bad ownership.

I have heard stories about dog attacks where a dog that previously could be trusted suddenly attacks a family member out of the blue. most of the stories are about bully breeds but other breeds can have aggression issues.

The truth is, dog attacks happen so quickly and sometimes out of the blue that having parents or family members around doesn't prevent it happening, it only means the person gets help faster. A dog can do a lot of damage in a few split seconds before someone can react and intervene.

So to answer your question- of course leaving a child alone with a dog is not safe or wise. But realistically, for many people there may not be an alternative. Without generalizing it is partly a social class issue- the socioeconomic status of people more likely to own bully breeds are perhaps also the people with less money for childcare/ dogwalkers/ support in general, and I don't know who is going to help these families, or what can realistically be done to control who is allowed to own dogs.

I didn't mean literally lock. It was a figure of speech.

Absolute refusal to let go then. Or however you want to frame it.

Yes. Extremely selfish

@sadsack78 These people find the money to buy the dog in the first place! It’s not money that’s the issue it’s attitude. It’s belief that these dogs give you status in your world.

@Devilsmommy because we were burgled four times in two years due to what we do for work. Our dogs are trained to bark at our fence lines and since we have had them we have not been targeted. There are far more dangerous things then a well bred and trained dog doing the job it was born to do.

It is very rare for a well bred and well trained dog to "snap" out of nowhere. Normally there are literally hundreds of signals dogs are giving out saying that they are uncomfortable or not happy with the situations they have been put into which are ignored by people that have no clue of dog behaviour or communication.

Not really...

I mean yes it would give authorities more power to act after an incident (though typically, they run away and hide and often ditch the dog anyway)...

It would catch out the generally decent but chaotic people who are disorganised and forget to sort out paperwork.

The generally decent but ignorant of the rules - this covers quite a lot of people.

The decent but made a mistake/had an accident/freak one off events.

These are not the categories of people causing the real problems. They're not the people intentionally breeding human aggressive dogs, or training dogs to attack people, or intentionally owning dogs to use as weapons.

We already have laws that come into play AFTER an incident, and when dogs killing people was rare, this was deemed 'enough' (I disagree actually, particularly when so many cases were children killed by a dog the parents brought home, and little to no action was taken as 'they've suffered enough' and 'public response would be dire if we did that...')...

So the chances of licencing owners to own dogs actually reducing attacks/deaths is really low - and it would cost a lot of taxpayer money to set up, we have literally none of the systems/databases/infrastructure necessary.

It's been 7 years since chipping dogs was mandatory - not only is it not enforced, we still do not have a single central database, we have nothing insisting all the databases work the same way, or that they talk to each other properly! Effectively... useless.

I personally don’t believe any small child should be left alone with any dog let alone the ‘dangerous’ breeds. I was bitten by a scotty as a child just walking past a shop it lunged at me and I was always taught not to go near dogs I didn’t know. The police told us at the time the dog had bitten the owners grandchildren several times previously but the owner refused to do anything about it.
I think allowing any animal unsupervised near a small child is a form of neglect not only to the child but towards the animal. It’s not the animals fault the adult is incapable of training or appropriately monitoring the animals or children.

I am a huge animal lover but dog ownership culture seems very strange to me (although I admit I’ve never lived with a dog, I’m a cat lady through and through). It almost seems to me that people feel they have a ‘right’ to own and breed these animals, regardless of whether that’s the best thing for their lifestyle or the animal itself (talking about XL bullies or pug dogs which are so disabled they can barely breathe or walk) just because the owner wants it. I live in central London and I used to work with someone who owned multiple husky dogs (she worked full time and obviously didn’t not live rurally) and although I am sure they were majestic animals, I wondered what sort of life they actually had.

I am sure this comment will attract someone who owns multiple husky’s who lives in Dubai and doesn’t have a sled to pull for miles and they’ll insist that their husky dogs have the best mental health ever and actually I’m wrong because they were actually bred to live in a built up area and middle eastern desert climate, but honestly my mind boggles, and I wonder how much social media has to play in it. Same with the recent trend of XL bully dogs posing with very young children. In general, I think humans should just make more sensible decisions and not just have because they want, certainly where other living and sentient beings are involved. I don’t know how you change that culture though.

Dogs that attack "out of nowhere" is usually because people are oblivious to the signs the dog is showing that it isn't happy. The majority of "cute" videos that I see of dogs and toddlers online have the dog showing clear signs of discomfort.

The other thing that can happen, is that dogs are punished for warning signs, such as growling, so they stop doing that and just go straight to biting.

I'm not sure that banning the XL bully is the answer. Not because I don't think they are a problem (the fatality figures speak for themselves) but just because it hasn't proven to be an effective way of reducing dog attacks. The XL bully has really come about in answer to the ban on American pit bulls. What will come next if they are banned? I think the answer has to lie in stronger regulation of breeding/selling/owning dogs. Stronger penalties for having a dog that attacks someone or another dog. Hopefully, better regulation would improve welfare for the dogs as well.

There's no reason why, in order to get a dog license, people shouldn't be required to do a simple online course about dog care and behaviour and legal responsibilities with a quiz at the end that needs to be passed. The cost could be covered by the license fee. Then there would be no excuse for ignorance.

Also it could be made mandatory for dog attacks requiring medical treatment to be reported. Then we could have some real data to back up moves to manage specific breeds.

The idea that these types will register their dogs snd do associated courses is for the fairies. Responsible people would but we have an underclass of owners who won’t register because they can get away with it! As they did before the license was scrapped decades ago. They want to be under the radar of sensible dog ownership.

@TizerorFizz agree and that is partly why I would support a ban on a limited number of breeds.

It won't completely stop it no. A bit like people drive without licenses and insurance now. It doesn't mean it isn't worth doing though or that it won't make any difference.

@LlynTegid And how do you police that? And then another cross breed comes along and? It’s not listed. It’s the people who own such dogs and breeders that need to be controlled. Maybe prosecute breeders? If you can find them. Or dob in the owners? And then who kills off the dogs? Who rounds them up?

It will do for the moment. No legislation is permanently watertight. Everything becomes less effective over time.

Meanwhile several lives could be saved while we fanny about trying to think of a better system.

Lots of things can kill children of they're mishandled / left unattended. A bottle of Naproxen. A hot kettle. Knives. If you leave a 3 yo unattended with any of those, there's a massive risk. But you don't charge parents with neglect for having them.

A tiny dog if it was on my child and I could get my hands around it's neck I pretty sure I could kill it quite fast ( I'd be highly motivated to find the strength). I'm not sure I could with a bully xl. I'd have to get my arm.around it's neck. It could just turn and rip my face off. A Yorkshire terror? No chance at all I couldn't strangle one in under a minute. If it was bleeding my child out, any thin necked dog. I'd kill it easy.

It honestly isn't the same. Xl bully looks stronger than my dh. I wouldn't win if dh wanted to kill me and pretend I could is dim.

But the things you have mentioned are necessary items. And yea they should be kept out of reaching distance of kids.
Somebody I know left some iron supplements out and they were eaten by her toddler.who was absolute fine.. social services did get involved.
Having a dog capable of killing a grown man in the house is totally unnecessary, there is absolutely no need for it. Also I don’t believe they have to be mishandled in order for them to turn.

Yes ban them! I'm sick of people making excuses for this breed. It's bred to be an aggressive killer! Bull dogs were bred to bring down a bull! So what chance does a person have against an XL one, if they attack?! Oh, but "Other, smaller dogs attack" Yes, but you could get them off before they kill you or your child! There are bad dogs AND bad owners. This is the case with XL's, so it's a perfect storm! And yes, if you have an XL, which is more than capable of killing your child, while you watch on helplessly, you are a bad parent. Oh, but "The bad dog breeders will just move onto another breed and that will be the same" So, we will ban that breed too!