To be scared of my nearly 6 year old?

[itsreallymylife]

Dd is nearly 6 and her behaviour seems to get worse every day, she has angry outbursts multiple times a day and hits and screams.
She's recently discovered the F word and repeats it and screams it at everyone, no amount of discipline seems to work in fact the more I try the more she fights.
She's not an only child I but she is the youngest and the others are not like this.
She deliberately urinated on the kitchen rug last night because she wanted to play a board game one time after I'd said that's the last game.

She literally won't let anything go she had just smashed the twister board over my head and hit her sister until I peeled her off because I said she wont play if she keeps swearing now she is screaming at the top of her voice and swearing repeatedly.
She's just hit her sister again and is now kicking the lounge door.
This is every day as soon as I get her from school, she won't go to bed or do anything I ask and I have no way of controlling her.
Dh tries but she is exactly the same with him.
She can scream relentlessly for ages and ages and won't be soothed or she'll lash out.
How am I meant to manage her?

Have a look on the national autistic society website for information about autism in girls. Keep a diary relating to anything that points to on if the traits in girls. Also see if you can work out what triggers the behaviour so you can keep a note of it and also what happens after the behaviour. This will all help to form a picture for the specialists. You mention friendships are an issue. This is also a huge red flag in the direction of autism.

From experience with our neurodevelopmental pathway, many referrals are rejected from GPs as they don’t have enough evidence to submit with their referral - because they can’t get enough info in a 10 minute GP appointment. School should refer with lots more detail about how she is at school and can add in what you’ve said about how she is at home. If she is accepted for assessment they’ll likely send someone to observe in school. As with many girls all they often see is a typical child (who is masking). So if you get this far then insist on a home observation too. We had several due to the school being adamant nothing was going on. It took several visits at home as well. I’m not a fan of photos and videos but have resorted to that myself for extra evidence - to show the mess made when my house was trashed and the marks she made on her sibling when she lost it and was hitting her.

sorry you are going through this but some LAs the waiting time for assessment can be long so the sooner you can get a referral the better. They might refer to ‘early help’ first. Play the system and see the people you’re recommended to see. Fill in the forms - some aren’t nice. It’s hard.

Really helpful response 🙄 what would you suggest the OP does, just get rid of her Dd?!!! 🤬 Op if it’s any help I had similar (although not as extreme as the urination) this must be so hard for you. My Dd has now moved up a year and we have seen a complete improvement in her behaviour at home, hopefully yours will grow out of this like mine. But agree with others I would try and get an assessment purely based on the urination issue as that does suggest some underlying issue you all need help with. Sending hugs 🤗

Op, you have been give some fabulous advice.

1. a diagnosis can help but won’t change the behaviour . Behaviour is communication- what is she communicating to you?
2. you can help by implementing the positive advice (learn about her triggers, give her time to decompress, you learn about autism in girls to better understand even if she doesn’t have a diagnosis
3. reduce the demands - give notice in advance eg dinner in 20 mins, 10mins etc now and next is great, emotion cards. Lots on google, Amazon. Screen time if she wants.
4. accept she may not be able to manage/be highly anxious- and respond with care

refer via gp, autism assessments can take a year or longer so start working on supporting her behaviours to improve.
good luck.

My son was like this at this age. He really struggled moving from reception to year 1, as the rules change at school and he found it really tough. He was incredibly anxious but teachers just saw a quiet child. Once back at home he would literally explode to the point my youngest and I used to lock ourselves in the downstairs loo for safety as this was the only lockable room in the house.
We struggled along to the end of KS1 just about managing. The move to KS2 tipped him over the edge. We sought help at this point (wish I had done it earlier)
He was diagnosed with Autism, Oppositional Defiance Disorder and ADHD. (I suspect PDA but this is not an official diagnosis pathway currently)
School were very helpful once we had a diagnosis, but were useless leading upto this as he masked so much.

Please seek help. Your daughter sounds overwhelmed and needs help.once you know what you are dealing with it will help you put strategies in place at home and school.

My son has remained in mainstream school and I think being diagnosed in primary school age range has really helped.

My previous post was meant to reply to @OhcantthInkofaname don’t know why it didn’t work

https://www.pdasociety.org.uk/

Just to give you another outlook. My daughter was similar to this. She would wee on the carpet in rage. She was vile at 6. We saw Psychs, all sorts - i was at breaking point. Fast forward 6 years, i have the most lovely, sensible, funny and sensitive girl. No autism, adhd diagnosis. She just had one hell of a temper and slowly grew out of it.

I would go to the dr, for a little reassurance it’s not another condition going on, like autism. Or if it is bad behaviour which is easier to manage.
personally it sounds like she has something like autism and is having meltdowns and lack of understanding of others feelings or wants needs. I could be completely wrong, I have 3 kids, 2 have autism one of which is non verbal. My middle goes to mainstream school, he was well behaved in school and explosive when he got home, that was until p4, p4/p5 he can no longer keep calm at school and has frequent meltdowns there now as well. It’s not an easy condition to live with for child and can be extremely stressful for rest of family. But on flip side when clam and not over loaded they can be the most loving children.

Until you have seen dr, diagnosis can take a very long time especially for girls ( the diagnosis criteria is based on boys symptoms and not girls unfortunately) you could try a calm down area, like a sensory tent with some lights in and some fidget/sensory toys. Even if she dost have autism it could be something like ADHD, the calming space could also be beneficial.

Sounds horrible. but to be honest If I were you I would start saving up for private doctors, she needs a doctor ASAP, consult, diagnoses, everything IN, and sadly NHS will take you foreeeeverrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! think 3- 4 years living like that. Go private, research, get the school to do something, Get your GP on it now. its money and a LOT, but nobody needs to be suffering in your house ( meaning your other 2 kids, watching that) Best of Luck

itsreallymylife

I am really sorry. I feel extremely sorry for you. I went through it. I can't say too much but it sounds as though it was so similar to my child.

Of course everyone will advise you to get help. But I have to say that it may not be very forth coming. Just so you don't get your hopes too high. I simply had to plough through. I tried to keep sane and never give in. It went on throughout teenage years - doing things that caused real dramas. I asked to talk to somebody and eventually was given a place at a family therapy unit but she refused to go. However, I went without her and the Psychologist really helped keep me going, just by listening and giving me a place where I could open up and talk about how hard it was.

Now she has her own family and beautiful children and is in a profession that required good qualifications. I just pray she and her family are OK.

I shall think of you a lot now, knowing there is another mum with a child who is like this. It might help you to know you are not alone. I know it is nothing you have done. They come out of nowhere. We still love them so much.

This might be an out there suggested but please take her for an ADOS assessment as this can be a sign of autism!

Hi

I’m not saying this is definitely the case here… but your daughter is reminding me a lot of my eldest daughter.
Now, I’m neurodivergent, and was only diagnosed a few years ago. Looking back, I realise now that there were a lot of things that I missed because I’m not neurotypical myself. A lot of things I didn’t realise could point towards autism/ADHD. My eldest is now awaiting her assessment.

My advice would be to go to your GP and speak with the school - let them know of your concerns and what’s happening at home with your daughter. Request a referral for the children and adolescent mental health services (camhs if you’re in UK).

I’m doing my dissertation on ADHD, and one thing I’ve found that I think is important for others to know is that girls with adhd/autism tend to present differently to boys- especially at school age. It often gets missed because a lot of key adults like parents, teachers, carers, even clinicians don’t always know or take into account of inattentive traits as opposed to the more overt/stereotypical symptoms they typically look out for. Girls are also very very likely to mask. So even if her teachers are insisting there’s nothing going on at school that’s concerning them - that doesn’t mean there isn’t something going on.

Editing this to say - there’s still quite a bit to go in terms of understanding ADHD/autism so when I say it’s not always taken into account - I’m not blaming parents. I didn’t even realise with my eldest as I didn’t know at the time. There’s a long way to go still, and it’s very common for girls to slip under the radar. Sorry if I at all offended anyone! :)

Don’t assume autism like everyone above wants you to.
she may respond better to consequences for particular bits of behaviour. I would stick to 2: Destruction and violence. Tell her in advance the new house rule but when they happen don’t explain/cajole etc just take her to her room and leave her there. She’s 6 so for 6 minutes.

( I should say make sure she gets a snack/ drink as soon as she gets home)

@itsreallymylife

I’m in my thirties and working on an autism diagnosis and this sounds familiar. Sounds quite typical autistic meltdowns and shutdowns. As PP have said masking all day means it has to come out at home. I learned this about myself in lockdown and I wish someone knew what to look for when I was 6!

So sorry to hear of your troubles. Please get your DD checked over. Contact GP, Health Visitor, school to get help. Good luck.

This sort of behaviour seems something like ASD ADHD maybe PDA and a child not coping. Not trying to diagnose but do get help for her. The normal parenting advice may not work. The behaviours are often because the child is not able to deal with it. Specialist help vital.

It is not your fault. There are ways of coping with it, understanding and putting in boundaries in different ways. Feel free to message if you need some pointers.

Great thread with loads of good advice & hard won knowledge. I am saving this thread for my SIL as my niece has these traits.

I second @mathanxiety& others suggestion to discreetly record your DD - as a sound file as this is unobtrusive & less likely to vex her more.

Also keep your own video blog, describe to the camera how the day or events have been & how you are. Be honest with yourself so that you can give a vivid account later on.

Have both the sound ‘poem’ & your vlog with you as you formally request a professional assessment. Play them to show how your DD is & how this is affecting you.

I'm normally not one to say someone needs an assessment straight off the bat but this sounds very much like she may be neurodiverse. If it's safe to do so (I.e. it can be done discreetly and won't upset her more) it would be good to try and video her behaviour so that you can show this to school/professionals etc. I would also see if you have a parenting support line locally so that you can get some support as this sounds so stressful.

This can be the behaviour of a child who is being abused.Please take her to g.p.

You need to get school involved as soon as possible to organise some professional support.

I work in a school and this year I am in my friend's daughters class and she is honestly the happiest and most well behaved child in the class. She to me seems so happy and content, she is very academic she doesn't struggle accademically at all. But at home she is violent rude and aggressive... I ve now seen both sides to her. School will not help because she is perfect and if I had to write a report on her at school I would have glowing things to say about her. I witnessed for myself her after school outbursts and she is so different - it really is a weird thing to see how a child can be so different. The one time she is well behaved at home is the morning because she is so excited to be going to school. She is a very fast learner and adores learning she also loves her friends and being around people. Her mum thinks she is probably masking at school but if she is she is doing it so well because her school persona seems so genuine. Her mum is desperate for help at home - her grandad used to pick her up after school and look after her until her mum finished but he can't cope with her anymore. I really don't know if she is masking because she genuniely seems to love school - I think she is very very bright and unfortunately at home they are unable to give her the stimulation she needs, - she is ok when doing activities ie swimming, rainbows etc so I think her mum is going to try and fill her weekly schedule to keep her busy as this is the only time she really seems happy.

Sounds similar to my six year old son. We’re currently awaiting an appointment with the specialist but the waiting list is 4 years!! He masks in school too, I’ve spoken to his teachers several times and they are very surprised when they hear what’s he’s like at home. He has some ADHD symptoms, some ASD, sensory processing issues and a lot of ODD symptoms. It’s very hard.

Have a look at a book called 'the red beast' it's a story book and really good at explaining anger/fear and different ways to control it by way of a child friendly story.
Also again incredible years book or audio book - I still listen to it and my youngest is 10

There's fight, flight & freeze. Could be that she's 'freezing' at school & keeping 'it' in & she feels safe with you so can then let it out! Like a bottle of fizzy pop, the lids on until she safe with you.
Get a professional that's not school staff to have a day just observing her. They will see what school staff don't.
We had this with our youngest. School was the problem, she changed schools, completely transformed her.