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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think her her need for respect doesn’t trump mine?

243 replies

Tonightsthenight91 · 27/08/2023 10:11

Prefacing this by saying I know this isn’t the end of the world and it’s not a war but it’s just really getting on my tits if I’m honest.

I have a family member (let’s call her H) who is very very religious, married an equally religious man, and is raising equally religious kids. Fine, I respect that - our beliefs are different but that’s more than ok, I am actually deeply interested in other peoples religions and cultures and find it makes for interesting conversations 95% of the time.

however, I feel like my whole family feel like everyone should dance to her tune just because of her beliefs.

example: a family holiday has been proposed. H won’t be happy for me (an adult and a mother) to drink/get drunk, wear anything revealing such as a tie string bikini, swear, listen to non-secular music within her ear shot, watch your average TV with her in the room etc. and the rest of my family will expect me to tow the line “because I have to respect H”

H doesn’t respect or listen to my beliefs (which I don’t try and force on anyone or even bring up, it’s only if it comes up in conversation). Says my beliefs are witchcraft and a sin.

other examples are:

  • won’t come to family parties as she doesn’t want to be around alcohol
  • Has opinions on everyone’s clothing (her kids have been known in the past to say people should be ashamed for their short skirts)
  • censors photographs of teenagers in our family with emojis (e.g if they’re wearing a tight T-shirt she’ll put a big flower emoji over the chest area on her social media)
  • tells me she’ll pray for me and actively prays for me to “see the light” and open my heart. I don’t feel comfortable with this.
  • wont allow me to stay over with my partner as we’re not married but we’ve been together 12 years and have 2 kids (which is absolutely her right as it’s her home, but it kind of sets the undertone for other settings)
  • Thinks being gay is absolutely wrong and sinful and there’s no two ways about it. Despite us having gay people in the family whom she also prays for.
  • has very blatantly spoke about other religions in a less than acceptable way

Whilst I do respect her and her beliefs, AIBU to think she should let me be too? Why should I have to change how I behave just because her religion disapproves? Aside from religion, H as a person is funny, sporty, interesting and outgoing. I know none of what she says is through malice but I’m just feeling really irked at the thought of being censored on this holiday

OP posts:
ThanksItHasPockets · 27/08/2023 13:35

I’m a practising Christian and based on what you have said I wouldn’t spend any time with H if I could possibly help it.

Can you go to the holiday destination but get your own accommodation? Absolutely do not stay with them.

Freddiefox · 27/08/2023 13:36

The problem is your mum and dad who are basically asking you to put up and shut up and not rock the boat. Your sister whilst nasty and bigoted is entitled as you say to think and act how she wants to, but you are not given the same rights by your parents who place the blame of any conflict on your shoulders. I think you should make it very clear to them when you say you aren’t going that they are a big part of the reason.

I had similar with a sibling who had quite conservative views and would judge people harshly. If I ever disagreed I would be asked by my mum to stop. She hated him being challenged because of her fear that she would see him even less, so he could say whatever he liked so he would come round again.

The outcome was that she saw me and my family less.

billy1966 · 27/08/2023 13:37

LightlySearedontheRealityGrill · 27/08/2023 13:06

I wouldn't want my children anywhere near people with such adherence to patriarchal superstition. So the feelings would be mutual.

This.

I would 100% feel my children need protection from her.

Could you go to the same destination but different accommodation and set up a rival holiday where family members can sneak off to indulge in all the carnal sins of the flesh?

MaryJanesonabreak · 27/08/2023 13:38

Could you not go on the holiday but stay in a different hotel so you can enjoy some distance and some family time?

JenWillsiam · 27/08/2023 13:39

Tonightsthenight91 · 27/08/2023 12:00

Thanks for all the responses. I agree it is bigotry.

I suppose it’s a difficult dynamic because she’s the only one in the family to follow “religion”. So similarly in not wanting to offend minorities, everyone just says this is the life H lives and we all must respect that and not poke the bear for want of a better word.

Whilst I would undoubtedly continue my holiday as I would if they weren’t there, I know I’d get aggro from the rest of my family for doing so and be seen as being goady. Also, I don’t doubt she would remove herself and her children from the setting if I were for example to be drunk or swearing during the night (which is absolutely her right to as she can decide what she wants her children to be around). I just know for fact that I would then be getting told I’m ruining everyone’s holiday by making H have to leave and it’s upsetting everyone.

I am generally quite outspoken and a bit of a free-love kind of person. I understand how crass I’m portraying myself to be, I must sound like some drunken lout that shouts profanity over dinner but I promise that’s not the case 😂

I think I’ll just have to not go, which is a shame!

Why must you respect a set of beliefs that involve actively harming vulnerable groups? She shows you absolutely no respect and frankly sounds obnoxious.

Neiiighbour234 · 27/08/2023 13:42

To my mind, it's the hypocrisy of your family pandering to her beliefs, but not respecting yours.

I think if you want to go, you have to say to your family that it is your holiday as much as H's and you have as much right as she does to enjoy the holiday as you see fit - as they do too. Why are they allowing her beliefs to take away your freedoms to make your own choices?

Natty13 · 27/08/2023 13:42
  1. I would 100% not be going on holiday with these circumstances
  2. All the major religions teach tolerance of others in some form. I'd be pointing that out as regularly as i needed to. Maybe even tell her her prayers were answered and you had a look at the religious text, you loved the part where it said "XYZ" about not judging people. Trust me, there is a line about this for them all.
ladyvimes · 27/08/2023 13:42

You don’t have to respect her beliefs at all! She is allowed to believe what she likes but that doesn’t mean you have to agree or do anything to support said beliefs. If she’s says grace before a meal and you don’t believe in that then just start eating! Wear what you bloody well like and tell her to sod off if she starts shaming you! Definitely don’t go on holiday with her. Anyone trying to impose their religious beliefs on me would be given short shrift!

LifeExperience · 27/08/2023 13:42

I'm a devoutly religious person and you are not unreasonable at all. Respect must flow in both directions. I would skip the holiday.

AblationQ · 27/08/2023 13:42

Are your gay family members invited on holiday?

Andthereyougo · 27/08/2023 13:42

This holiday has disaster written all over it.
She’s not going to change her opinions and having an audience will just fuel her fire.
I’d start planning your own holiday and leave her to hers.

Auntpodder · 27/08/2023 13:45

I'd go on holiday with the gay members of your family. And work out ways of gently introducing H's children to the fact that there are different ways of living their lives. At lease some of them will thank you in the long run...

CurlewKate · 27/08/2023 13:47

You absolutely don't need to "respect" her views if that means changing your behaviour. You do have to be polite. No more-no less.

peachypudding · 27/08/2023 13:49

The main thing Jesus taught was love and tolerance. And that no one is better than anyone else. Ergo she is not actually a Christian, whatever she might like to think.

WanderleyWagon · 27/08/2023 13:51

'A family holiday has been proposed' - but you don't have to go. I know you say she's lovely except for the oppressive religious beliefs (and I respect religious faith but not people's right to order other people around on the basis of it) but tbh she sounds like a PITB.
It would be perfectly OK to say a cheerful 'thanks! but I don't think our holiday styles mesh, so you guys go, and we'll sit this one out'. If there are particular family members you'd love to spend time with, maybe suggest a weekend away with them at a different time of year?

mangochops · 27/08/2023 13:52

I'm Christian and I wouldnt go on holiday with her either- she sounds absolutely insufferable! I dont care what others do, wear or drink because its absolutely none of my business. I respect others life choices and I would expect that they respect mine which means, not commenting negatively on how others choose to live their lives. I suspect that this is less about her religion and more about her judgey and unpleasant personality, using religion as a front to be unkind. You get people like this in all walks of life, religious communities included.

Lemondrizzleandacuppa · 27/08/2023 13:55

If you like the holiday destination, could you book your own accommodation away from your sister? That way you can drink, swear, watch TV, listen to music and wear whatever you want. Just meet up with her and her family a few times for an hour or two.

I can sympathise because I have family who are extremely religious. At least your sister doesn’t insist on all food, crockery and glassware being strictly kosher!

Helpmeimtired · 27/08/2023 13:55

Tell her to go fuck her self

Uterusbegone · 27/08/2023 13:56

everyone just says this is the life H lives and we all must respect that and not poke the bear for want of a better word.

Exactly. That is the life H lives and you should all respect that. However you do not share their beliefs, and that is the life you live so H should equally respect that

You aren't asking H to drink or to wear clothing they find lacking in modesty, so H should get their nose out of your business

Puzzledandpissedoff · 27/08/2023 13:57

I wish I’d have done a name change for this as there’s so many details I could give about the specific church (pretty certain that it’s not known as being extreme?)

Even mainstream religions can spawn extremist offshoots, OP; for example Opus Dei, the Westboro Baptists, wahhabism and to an extent the evangelical wing of the CofE

Out of interest, is this a newfound conviction for your "H" - such folk can sometimes be the most fervent of all - or is it a more longstanding thing?

gillefc82 · 27/08/2023 14:00

Wasn’t it Jesus himself who said “let he who is without sin cast the first stone”?

I was raised Catholic, but would now consider myself to Agnostic/leaning Atheist. I have a family member who does believe, but she isn’t preachy or bombastic about her beliefs. Religion and the morals it imbues should be able teaching acceptance, inclusivity, love, respect and forgiveness. It sounds like H’s moral compass has spun so far away from her true north and in the act of trying to be a “good Christian” she is forgetting how to be a decent human being!

Personally, I would see if it’s feasible to go on the holiday but stay somewhere separate, so you can choose how/when you engage with the wider group and H in particular.

I would also have to pull her up if she started preaching or certainly making homophobic remarks. This can be done perfectly politely - “Respectfully H, we’re lucky enough to live in a democracy where we can each decide (within the bounds of the law) how we want to live our lives. I don’t judge you for your choices. Please show me the same consideration. Thank you.”

joanne2020 · 27/08/2023 14:00

She is entitled to her belief and you yours but they are at odds and will make holidaying together very challenging

Alopeciabop · 27/08/2023 14:02

Is your family’s treatment of her new since she went ultra religious? Or have they always treated her as more special?

Mischance · 27/08/2023 14:02

Who has proposed this holiday? Just say No and go on your own holiday. If you say no and people ask why, just say you will not be able to relax and enjoy yourself in H's company.

daliesque · 27/08/2023 14:04

Life's too short to nit drink, wear sensible clothes and not swear. The idea of holidaying with this person sounds horrendous.

No one will enjoy themselves...go with like minded people,only...it's the Christian thing to do Halo

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