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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Not allowed to make threats?!

272 replies

PickleConfused · 19/08/2023 13:29

I would like some outsider opinions as I need to know if I’m being unreasonable.

I’m currently dealing with a stressful situation regarding my FIL who lives with us. He is complete nightmare to live with and despite repeated attempts to get through to him, it continues.

I’m now at the end of my tether and I’ve told my DH that I cannot live with FIL anymore. I gave DH an ultimatum that either we convert part of the house into an annexe for FIL to live independently or I leave for the sake of my mental health.

BIL has told me that I’m not allowed to make threats about leaving as they are unhelpful and I’ve been told I have to find another way to solve the situation. DH agreed with his brother.

AIBU?

OP posts:
JenWillsiam · 19/08/2023 15:20

WiddlinDiddlin · 19/08/2023 15:08

That depends on whose money was used to buy out BIL and pay FIL his added 25% 'gimme' (since he did not have a quarter share or indeed, any share, of the property at that point).

If that was marital or OP money... then she may well be due 50% of the 75% she and her 'D'H have paid. If the gift of 50% of the property was given to her DH after they were married, then yeah, she might well be entitled to 50%.

It is as clear as mud unless the OP comes and sets everything out clearly though.

Show quote history

It’s not because she hasn’t confirmed market rate was paid. The whole thing sounds like an amateur inheritance tax scam.

IWantOutDoI · 19/08/2023 15:21

Jesus… I don’t think I would take that comment well if it came from my mum, much less so from a BIL, if he is concerned you have to put up with him and your spineless husband he may as well take both to live with him.

MonkeyChiselTree · 19/08/2023 15:24

Goldbar · 19/08/2023 14:21

I agree with pp above. I'd fix this by leaving, serving divorce papers on your H and claiming your share of the marital assets. H and BIL can sort out FIL.

This I'm afraid.

You have been properly screwed over by BIL who got 50% of the value for doing nothing. FIL had to be paid another 25% so you and your DH paid 75% whereas your BIL received 50%. No wonder you walking away is a threat he doesn't want you to carry out. It will all unravel when you get half in the divorce.

Original poster
PickleConfused · 19/08/2023 15:25

Legally DH and I own the house. Although he was gifted 50% of the house so I wouldn’t lay claim on that in event of divorce.

It all made sense at the time and everything was dealt with via solicitors. We agreed to give him a cash gift because he felt like he was losing out on selling the house despite it not being in his name. I feel like a fool but we all thought it was the best solution at the time. We hoped he would use the money to enjoy himself and go on holidays.

FIL is in good health for his 70s and I assumed he would continue living independently like he had for years before we moved in. But living with him has been really hard. I didn’t realise I would be taking on another dependant. I simply thought we would work together.

OP posts:
rwalker · 19/08/2023 15:26

Do the annexe if FIL doesn’t move into to it you do

saffronsoup · 19/08/2023 15:30

WiddlinDiddlin · 19/08/2023 15:15

Sorry, where has the OP 'massively benefited'?

She's moved into a property that comes with a lazy entitled arsehole, and a ton of repairs/renovations, who has demanded 25% of the value of a property he does not appear to own, and who has changed the goalposts AFTER she's moved in and paid out all that money.

Unless OP was actually living in a storm drain under some damp cardboard, this doesn't sound like a massive benefit to me!

The drip feeds may be irritating but the wilful mis-reading of the given facts really makes the discussion pointless!

Show quote history

She did say she was previously homeless.

None of us know enough of the ins and outs to say how has or hasn't benefited.

Threats are generally illegal as their intention by definition is to inflict suffering, harm, injury or damage.

Testina · 19/08/2023 15:32

So as you’re back @PickleConfused why did he ever gift it to his sons in the first place?

babbscrabbs · 19/08/2023 15:32

Honestly in that case I'd move out temporarily and then say you'll move back in once the issues are sorted.

Testina · 19/08/2023 15:34

“Threats are generally illegal as their intention by definition is to inflict suffering, harm, injury or damage.” Oh don’t talk rot @saffronsoup 🤣

Original poster
PickleConfused · 19/08/2023 15:35

MIL didn’t take any of the house in the divorce on the basis it would go to the sons. So FIL gifted it to them after the divorce.

OP posts:
Autieangel · 19/08/2023 15:36

@JenWillsiam it depends on wether dh 50% is protected and who paid bil his share

amicissimma · 19/08/2023 15:37

With all this 'gifting' and 'buying out' going on the first thing I'd want to do is have a look at the Deeds of the house to see who actually legally owns it. You can download a copy from The Land Registry for £3.

Op, you don't tell us your financial position, but if I were you I'd get some money from somewhere to have a session with a solicitor. Then at least you'd know where you really stand in eyes of the law.

Search for land and property information

Find a property and get its title plan, title register and see who owns it

https://www.gov.uk/search-property-information-land-registry

saffronsoup · 19/08/2023 15:37

Testina · 19/08/2023 15:34

“Threats are generally illegal as their intention by definition is to inflict suffering, harm, injury or damage.” Oh don’t talk rot @saffronsoup 🤣

What do you disagree with? The definition of a threat?

Or that making threats is generally illegal?

Ofcourseshecan · 19/08/2023 15:37

It was FIL’s house but we bought it and FIL continued to live here. FIL keeps telling BIL he feels I’m trying to push him out of his home.

He sold his home, ffs! FIL really is taking the piss. No wonder he insists on living with you as his unpaid maid-cook-housekeeper! Your DH should defend you. FIL may live another 20-30 years: don’t be carrying him till you drop.

I would leave, and get a solicitor to make sure I got a fair deal in the divorce. You sound as if your good nature would let them deprive you of the money you’re entitled to.

saffronsoup · 19/08/2023 15:38

What money and assets did you bring to the marriage OP? What percentage of living costs have been contributed by you? What percentage of the 75% to BIL and FIL came from your own income or assets?

FireflyJar · 19/08/2023 15:40

PickleConfused · 19/08/2023 13:35

House belongs to DH and I. It was FIL’s house but we bought it and FIL continued to live here. FIL keeps telling BIL he feels I’m trying to push him out of his home.

Its not his house. I would leave though. If it leads to divorce than so be it - maybe DHs brother would babysit their father for a bit?

JenWillsiam · 19/08/2023 15:40

Autieangel · 19/08/2023 15:36

@JenWillsiam it depends on wether dh 50% is protected and who paid bil his share

You cannot protect anything if it’s done to avoid tax.

Testina · 19/08/2023 15:40

saffronsoup · 19/08/2023 15:37

What do you disagree with? The definition of a threat?

Or that making threats is generally illegal?

Show quote history

I disagree with you taking a word used in its common non-legal meaning and insisting that it has a legal status. That’s just ridiculous.

knobheed99 · 19/08/2023 15:41

I gave DH an ultimatum that either we convert part of the house into an annexe for FIL to live independently or I leave for the sake of my mental health

Well DH has not done that so that means you need to leave. That was your ultimatum and you should stick to it because you obviously thought about this a lot before making the ultimatum.

BIL has told me that I’m not allowed to make threats about leaving as they are unhelpful and I’ve been told I have to find another way to solve the situation. DH agreed with his brother

It wasn't a threat though. It was an ultimatum which is a different thing. I presume you meant in seriously and just stated what would happen if the annexe was not built. BIL shouldn't be interfering with this anyway.

You should leave because FIL, BIL and DH are all ganging up on you to force you to do what they want - ie. FIL gets to live in the house and you get to care for him.
If it's damaging your mental health you need to go ASAP.

A good solicitor will sort out the mess of the gifting and whatever else went on regarding the house and get a decent and fair divorce settlement for you.

JenWillsiam · 19/08/2023 15:42

PickleConfused · 19/08/2023 15:35

MIL didn’t take any of the house in the divorce on the basis it would go to the sons. So FIL gifted it to them after the divorce.

This means inheritance tax will due as he’s still living there.

Also check the deeds. The whole thing is a mess.

VivaLesTartes · 19/08/2023 15:42

Did they really use the term your not "allowed". Ask them if they think that's a reasonable way to talk to an adult. Or just leave.

Testina · 19/08/2023 15:43

PickleConfused · 19/08/2023 15:35

MIL didn’t take any of the house in the divorce on the basis it would go to the sons. So FIL gifted it to them after the divorce.

Is MIL still alive, and did your husband also give her 25% of some mythical value? 🤨

saffronsoup · 19/08/2023 15:44

Testina · 19/08/2023 15:40

I disagree with you taking a word used in its common non-legal meaning and insisting that it has a legal status. That’s just ridiculous.

Show quote history

What is your definition of a threat? Not a legal definition but where do you get your definition of the word from?

Amethys · 19/08/2023 15:44

The big problem here is your marriage. You are miserable with things as they are: DH is refusing to change anything.

As you are married and a property owener, you are not as powerless or as vulnerable as you feel. Secretly see a divorce solicitor and find out what your financial position would be if you divorce. I suspect you’ll be much better off than you are now.

Why leave and allow FIL and DH to have your house? Why not instead see a lawyer, get a divorce and buy a nice flat somewhere?

Purditnin · 19/08/2023 15:47

So, nothing had really changed since you posted about this in January asking if leaving was your only option. The answer is still
’yes’.

It basically comes down to whether or not you’re willing to actually do something about the situation. If you are, you’d be wise to speak to a solicitor asap. The business with house ownership sounds complicated.