AIBU to not want DH to engage with homeless man while baby DC is in his arms

[Fieryflips]

DH always tries to give charity when he can (a trait I have always admired) any time he sees a homeless person he will give if he has some loose change.

Yesterday we were in a London food court in a shopping mall and a homeless man came up to our table for change. Our 3 month old baby was sat on the side of the table the homeless man came to and DH was also on that side. The man was approaching all the tables, I said we didn't have any change. I really didn't have any change but also I was a bit nervous because DC was right there. DH said for the man to wait and gave him change.

I told DH not to engage people like that when DC was about because it makes me nervous and you don't know what could happen but DH thinks I'm being unreasonable. AIBU?

This. You have zero idea why some of these men are on the street. Yes it could be as a result of mental health or a relationship break up that led to a spiral. However, it could be a sex offender chased out of their home town.

There’s a local homeless guy. He always makes an effort to say hello as I walk past with my DC. I smile and say hi to be polite but I don’t linger (I remind DC of stranger danger when we’re out of earshot) as the guy is a bit over familiar and gives me a ‘gift of fear vibe’. One day my DC will be old enough to go to the local shop the man hangs outside alone so I don’t want him to think this man is his mums friend and get into a conversation.

Yes there are predators dressed well in nice houses, however, a guy in his 30s living on the street in a foreign country (he sounds Eastern European) without obvious substance abuse issues must have a hell of a backstory and it’s not one I’m taking a risk on with my DC.

I also would be nervous about this, OP. A really high % of homeless have substance abuse/untreated psychiatric issues of some kind.

I get that there is an understandable desire to "destigmatise mental health issues" etc. and it's reasonable to an extent, but it's also reasonable (not bigoted) for the average human being to feel considerably more nervous when in the company of someone who has a serious psychiatric disorder. Take a look at this chart, for example (it shows fairly typical values found by the kind of studies in question). Annually, about 1 in 7 untreated schizophrenics and around 1 in 10 undergoing-treatment schizophrenic patients commit an assault annually. These are not inconsiderable figures, and are utterly different to the kind of figures you'd see for an average person without schizophrenia.

In addition, it's not a good idea to hand out cash to people who are likely to use it to buy illegal drugs.

I don't know about London, but in Yorkshire a lot of the homeless eat first born babies.

In my early 20s I ended up getting trapped in a flat with a man who was schizophrenic. Long story short he was a friend and I didn’t know he had mental health issues before I Went to his house for lunch, but he had a felt bad episode which spiralled to the extent of me thinking that day I was going to get raped or killed. After about an hour he snapped out of it and I was able to get out of his flat. It was THE most scariest experience of my life. My friends dad had schizophrenia too and he was nothing like that so I know it doesn’t affect everyone the same but the difference is my friends dad was being treated and he had a very responsible and committed wife who no doubt made Sure he took his meds.

However, it could be a sex offender chased out of their home town.

Were they wielding pitchforks as they chased him off? Presumably they robbed him as well if he has no cash.

In my early 20s I ended up getting trapped in a flat with a man who was schizophrenic. Long story short he was a friend and I didn’t know he had mental health issues before I Went to his house for lunch, but he had a felt bad episode which spiralled to the extent of me thinking that day I was going to get raped or killed

I’m sorry that happened to you but schizophrenia does not make you more likely to commit violent acts than people who don’t have mental illness.

long-term homelessness is a difficult balance of personal freedom. Do we force people into treatment for the underlying issues that make them non-compliant with the social constraints of provided housing

I wish people understood this more. It’s not a simple case of they can’t be housed somewhere as not enough houses, it’s the substance abuse that is the root cause. Which is why I say You are not helping by funding their drug habit.

And since we are talking about “promoting stereotypes” can we remember most homeless people are not street beggars. The two are not synonymous. This conversation isn’t actually about “homeless “ people as a whole. It’s about a specific section of people who spend a large part of their days, And something they’re nights, on the streets. And some of them aren’t even homeless.

People diagnosed with a serious mental health illness are much more likely to be victims of crimes/ assault than they are perpetrators. Half the time you wouldn't even know you were talking to someone who had Schizophrenia.

Get back in the sea with your bloody stigmatising, bigoted comments.

Annually, about 1 in 7 untreated schizophrenics and around 1 in 10 undergoing-treatment schizophrenic patients commit an assault annually. These are not inconsiderable figures, and are utterly different to the kind of figures you'd see for an average person without schizophrenia

There aren't any figures for people without Schizophrenia in that chart you posted so there’s nothing to compare them to. It doesn’t really prove your point does it?

YABU

Years ago, when my DD was smaller I gave her a few quid to give to a homeless man while we were watching a street musician. He went into a shop and came out with some food for himself and a drink for DD,

It was so nice of him

I have friends with schizophrenia who are excellent, loving parents I would be happy to have look after my child.

A stranger in the street approaching me for money or conversation I'd always be wary of, though, whatever conditions or not they might have.

Er.....if you think that the likelihood of committing assault, homicide etc. are even remotely similar for the population as a whole, you are really, really wrong.

The rate of committing homicide is around 1 in 600 (annually) for untreated patients, falling to 1 in 10,000 for treated patients. But for the population as a whole, it's less than 1 per 100,000 people in the UK.

Over here in deepest darkest Cambridgeshire they prefer second borns. Unless they're a twin and they'll pass.

People diagnosed with a serious mental health illness are much more likely to be victims of crimes/ assault than they are perpetrators.

If I'm talking to someone with untreated schizophrenia, comparisons of whether they are more likely to be a victim or perp of crime is irrelevant, because the odd that they are going to be subjected to a crime by me are zero (I don't go around assaulting people).

The only comparison that matters and is remotely relevant is "Is Jim (who has untreated schizophrenia) more likely to assault me than Ben (standing over there, who doesn't have untreated schizophrenia)?"

The data shows extremely clearly that Jim is many times more likely to assault me than Ben. Hence, yes, sorry, but I am always going to be a lot more wary and much, much more on the alert when I'm in the presence of someone who appears to have a psychiatric condition.

So is everyone else, too, by the way, even if they're pretending that they wouldn't because people say silly and not-true stuff on Mumsnet to make themselves look like the most caring person in the room.

It’s easy to be cool online. Would be interesting to see how you would react IRL if your DD started dating a man of ‘no fixed abode’ though.

I love the subtlety of your language .

homeless, simply have no money , re homed quickly

unhoused,universally mentally unwell, persistently unhoused

Do they wear clear labels so you don’t accidentally speak to an unhoused thinking they are a homeless?

It’s easy to be cool online. Would be interesting to see how you would react IRL if your DD started dating a man of ‘no fixed abode’ though.

I don’t think the homeless guy is dating OPs daughter.

Er.....if you think that the likelihood of committing assault, homicide etc. are even remotely similar for the population as a whole, you are really, really wrong.

Prove it

Did you look at my last post?

Here are some more very basic and well-established sources.

Genetic and environmental determinants of violence risk in psychotic disorders: a multivariate quantitative genetic study of 1.8 million Swedish twins and siblings | Molecular Psychiatry (nature.com)

HCR-20-Annotated-Bibliography-Version-12-January-2014.pdf

Actually that was me missing an edit. Homeless is what I am used to saying and it was I originally wrote throughout, but I know unhoused is now considered the proper term so I went back and edited. I apologize for missing one.

I try to be respectful of people and speak to them and about them with preferred language, but it is hard to get it right all the time.

I will try to do better.

Did you look at my last post?

Yes. It was gibberish.

Oh dear me.
Karma is not far away.