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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

"Give nanny a kiss goodbye"

406 replies

coverp · 07/08/2023 23:40

Looking for impartial views on whether I am letting my generally strained relationship with MIL impact my response.

Whenever MIL sees the kids (aged 4 and 2), she tries to insist on big kisses and cuddles to say hello and goodbye. Sometimes they are cuddly kids and other times they are not - they interact with her well. I've always said "do you fancy a hug, high five or a wave?" And let them choose.

Today, MIL tried to insist on kisses - "why don't you want to kiss nanny, you're making nanny feel so sad, nanny is going to think you don't love her if you don't kiss her". To which I said "Enough". 2yo then said "how about a wave" and waved and blew a kiss. Which I thought was adorable.

Anyway, MIL has just texted saying "Hi, you really hurt me earlier. Its not too much to ask for the kids to cuddle their grandmother, your approach is ridiculous and they'll end up being rude brats".

I haven't replied, but am spitting. I know she'll have been drinking so definitely won't be engaging tonight. But sense check - AIBU to say they can choose to interact with her on their own terms?!

OP posts:
LookItsMeAgain · 08/08/2023 08:13

@coverp - in reply to this comment "Anyway, MIL has just texted saying "Hi, you really hurt me earlier. Its not too much to ask for the kids to cuddle their grandmother, your approach is ridiculous and they'll end up being rude brats"
I would be hard pressed not to send a reply like "Oh, was that how you were taught to say bye bye to your grandmother too then?" or some cutting reply that shows you know that your MiL is being ridiculous and making a mountain out of a molehill.

When you see her again, I'd sit her down and say "The parenting techniques that both DH and I use are working fine for our children. We are teaching body autonomy so that our children will know what sort of touching by another person is acceptable and what is not, for them. They make the call. Fist pump, handshake, wave or on the odd occasion a hug and a kiss but they are the exception and not the rule. This is no reflection on how much the kids love you and you shouldn't equate or conflate the two things. That's very wrong."

Would that be possible?

matchamate · 08/08/2023 08:19

I would be livid with her response. How dare she.

Personally I'd get her child to respond if they are the children's other parent. If they aren't then take a deep breath and explain its fine for her to disagree with your parenting decisions it's not ok for her to use emotional manipulation on you and it won't work.

matchamate · 08/08/2023 08:20

Presumably she wouldn't force an adult to kiss or hug her?

SyncopatedRhythm · 08/08/2023 08:21

legalseagull · 08/08/2023 07:20

"How would you feel if someone was forcing you to kiss them with phrases like "you're making me sad". No one should force or guilt someone in to physical contact. Girls are constantly told they're 'rude' if they don't do everything to make someone else happy. Being polite does not require unwanted physical contact. I'd appreciate it if you didn't try to guilt the kids in to physical contact when. In the future, god forbid, it could be someone else putting pressure on her and I want her to have the confidence to say 'no'.

Really good.

SyncopatedRhythm · 08/08/2023 08:21

response template.

Hungryfrogs23 · 08/08/2023 08:35

YANBU. Their body, their choice. Incredibly dangerous to teach children that guilt/obligation/blackmail is a good enough reason to kiss/cuddle or do something that makes them uncomfortable.

Absolutely ridiculous of your MiL.

muchalover · 08/08/2023 08:40

My grandson only hugs on his terms, as it should be.

We do a wiggle instead.

We all do the wiggle too.

HalloumiLuvver · 08/08/2023 08:40

CornishTiger · 07/08/2023 23:51

Dear MIL I’m sorry to hear you think teaching children body autonomy and consent is ridiculous. The only bratty thing about this afternoon was your guilt tripping and refusal to accept No as the first and final answer. Please do not do that again or we will not be able to visit.

Ooh love this!

Whattodo112222 · 08/08/2023 08:41

I will never enforce kissing and hugging on my children.. ever. You are definitely not be unreasonable.

VictoriaVenkman · 08/08/2023 08:44

Times have changed. When I was growing up it was unacceptable for kids not give granny a hug and kiss etc and refusing was seen as being rude and having no manners. I suspect your MIL was brought up the same and does not realise that thinking around this has changed.

Original poster
coverp · 08/08/2023 09:07

Thank you for all the thoughtful replies. I think it was the language around it which really bothered me. She has form for that type of thing - "we aren't going to be friends anymore if you don't start choosing me to push you on the swing" when DS asked for his grandad to push him (I wish I was joking). My usually very secure DH still has huge issues with wanting to please his mum at all costs, having had similar comments throughout his life.

I still haven't replied, and have just had a "Aren't you going to respond to me?" message, to which I'm extremely tempted to reply "No."

OP posts:
readbooksdrinktea · 08/08/2023 09:10

CornishTiger · 07/08/2023 23:51

Dear MIL I’m sorry to hear you think teaching children body autonomy and consent is ridiculous. The only bratty thing about this afternoon was your guilt tripping and refusal to accept No as the first and final answer. Please do not do that again or we will not be able to visit.

This.

You are not at all unreasonable.

Greenpin · 08/08/2023 09:11

I absolute agree that children shouldn't be made to hug or kiss an adult.
However some elderly people living on their own crave human touch. My mil was a widow and lived alone for 30 years , so the only hugs she had were from us and her grandchildren.
So perhaps we should remember the situation our elderly relatives may be in and give them a hug ourselves.
Human touch is so very important.

Moccasin · 08/08/2023 09:13

“MIL were you forced to kiss the elderly as a child and that’s why you’re a rude bitch?”

The message from her infuriates me more than trying to get forced affections from your kids. Well done for telling them they don’t have to if they don’t want to. Have you responded to her message?

AllAboardTootToot · 08/08/2023 09:14

coverp · 08/08/2023 09:07

Thank you for all the thoughtful replies. I think it was the language around it which really bothered me. She has form for that type of thing - "we aren't going to be friends anymore if you don't start choosing me to push you on the swing" when DS asked for his grandad to push him (I wish I was joking). My usually very secure DH still has huge issues with wanting to please his mum at all costs, having had similar comments throughout his life.

I still haven't replied, and have just had a "Aren't you going to respond to me?" message, to which I'm extremely tempted to reply "No."

I would choose not to for a while yet, let her implode!

Horrible when people do this with children!

Moccasin · 08/08/2023 09:15

Sorry OP, just seen that you’ve not responded to her yet. Let us know if and when you do!

Wetandhorrible · 08/08/2023 09:15

coverp · 08/08/2023 09:07

Thank you for all the thoughtful replies. I think it was the language around it which really bothered me. She has form for that type of thing - "we aren't going to be friends anymore if you don't start choosing me to push you on the swing" when DS asked for his grandad to push him (I wish I was joking). My usually very secure DH still has huge issues with wanting to please his mum at all costs, having had similar comments throughout his life.

I still haven't replied, and have just had a "Aren't you going to respond to me?" message, to which I'm extremely tempted to reply "No."

"no: there is nothing to discuss as I have told you I expect my children to be able to assert their boundaries" (Bite me!)

Mummy08m · 08/08/2023 09:18

Just don't reply and let her squirm. She knows that if she falls out with you entirely she might see her grandkids (and possibly son) a lot less.

Mummy08m · 08/08/2023 09:19

I don't mean squirm for what she said to the kids... willing to give the benefit of the doubt that she's just misguided about how to speak to kids... but giving you a hard time afterwards is just hankering for a fight. Don't give it to her

Amybelle88 · 08/08/2023 09:20

We are a kissy and cuddly family and I've genuinely never thought of doing things your way - I think it's a brilliant way to teach them bodily autonomy. It's brill.

Some people are more tactile than others and even being brought up giving kisses and cuddles, my kids can't be arsed sometimes and that's ok. We never force them if they don't want to and my mum would never try to emotionally blackmail them into it, either.

YANBU and saying enough was perfectly fine.

KnittedCardi · 08/08/2023 09:21

These threads always amaze me. With an Italian heritage, I honestly cannot get on board with the narrative of touch being grooming or paedopholia, it's nonsense. My DC's were hugged and kissed by all and everyone, including randoms in restaurants, hotels or on the beach.

Perhaps we need more hugs and kisses in the UK to prevent us being so miserable and isolated in old age.

AdoraBell · 08/08/2023 09:21

YANBU at all.

FlamingoQueen · 08/08/2023 09:24

‘Not spoilt brats mil, just ones who aren’t forced into doing things they may not wish to do’.
‘I don’t want my children to have that stereotype of always having to give granny a kiss (like the olden days!), but rather if they want to give you a hug, then they will’. ‘Rude would be forcing them to give you a kiss - which is kind of gross when you think of it’. ‘Look forward to seeing you soon x’

autienotnaughti · 08/08/2023 09:25

My ex mum use to say similar things. Even to me! So if I got dd hair cut she might say to dd "we will have to smack mummy's bum if she does that again" really wound me up but I was very young with a useless dh so I just put up with it. Now ( 20plus years later and more than 15 years since I split with her son) she's lovely to me but she also knows I don't have to/won't tolerate her anymore.

Honestly the only way to manage it is to be firm and clear it's unacceptable

monsteramunch · 08/08/2023 09:29

KnittedCardi · 08/08/2023 09:21

These threads always amaze me. With an Italian heritage, I honestly cannot get on board with the narrative of touch being grooming or paedopholia, it's nonsense. My DC's were hugged and kissed by all and everyone, including randoms in restaurants, hotels or on the beach.

Perhaps we need more hugs and kisses in the UK to prevent us being so miserable and isolated in old age.

With an Italian heritage, I honestly cannot get on board with the narrative of touch being grooming or paedopholia, it's nonsense.

It's not about every touch being grooming or paedophilia. It's about unwanted touching being normalised and validated, children being guilt tripped or peer pressured into it. Because if their parents teach them that they should accept being touched / kissed by people even when it's making them uncomfortable then how do they know when it is ok to say no? And how does that translate when someone with ill intent wants to touch and kiss them against their will? How do they have clear boundaries if sometimes it's ok?

My DC's were hugged and kissed by all and everyone, including randoms in restaurants, hotels or on the beach.

And if they were happy with it, fine.

If your child had been a child who really didn't like being hugged and kissed by all and everyone, who tried to wriggle away or say no, would you really have told them they had to accept hugs and kisses from all and everyone? Don't you think it's weird for an adult to demand / expect a child to let them kiss and hug them even when they make it clear that kiss or hug is unwanted and making them uncomfortable?

How would you feel as an adult if someone wouldn't stop hugging and kissing you when you were trying to squirm away / you were saying no? What would you think about someone who wouldn't let you squirm away and who wouldn't accept your 'no'? Would you they were being nice and kind?

We're talking about unwanted hugs and kisses being forced on people. Those people happen to be children. Why does that mean they should accept unwanted hugs and kisses that make them uncomfortable / stressed?