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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Not to give desert…

253 replies

Mumof3premies · 30/07/2023 19:55

So my step daughter is a complete nightmare with eating anything healthy or remotely good for her.
Every Wednesday and weekend she comes we have dinner, we all sit and the table and eat together.
I always add two portions of veg and some meat on the meal whether it’s a roast dinner or curry, chilli etc there’s always veg and all the children have to eat it (I only ever put on veg I know they will eat and I don’t overload the plates with it.
So tonight as usual we had the usual drama that she didn’t want it my step daughter pulls the worst faces and she refused to eat the veg and meat stating she was so full she couldn’t eat another bite….
shes quite a large girl, she’s 10, is in 13-14 clothing and eats until it comes out of her ears she couldn’t have been full as 10 minutes before she ‘was starving’
we had a roast dinner we have it all the time and she likes it but today just didn’t want it.
my husband said if she didn’t eat any more because she was so full that she couldn’t have desert and nothing else tonight as we can’t afford to just throw food away…
so an hour later she’s kicking off because she wants desert so I said no as her dad already told her and she could have a piece of fruit or slice of toast but she wasn’t having cake and ice cream as she didn’t eat her dinner.
now my husbands in a mood with me because apparently I’ve singled her out!
mom so annoyed as I was sticking to what he said!

OP posts:
Miajk · 31/07/2023 13:22

Justrolledmyeyesoutloud · 31/07/2023 11:36

Only on MN are you unreasonable for encouraging healthy eating and exercising some discipline.
Of course yanbu op.

Forbidding certain foods and applying conditions on them is not encouraging healthy eating. People here are bonkers with their idea of what it means to encourage a healthy relationship with food.

Let the kids serve themselves whatever type and quantity of veg is available. Encourage them to try at least one of each. Dessert is available without any drama. Dinner leftover is left for when child gets hungry again later.

No drama needed. No unhealthy emotional attachment or thoughts about specific foods. FFS how you lot are having kids out there with zero consideration of basic psychology while deciding you're 100% correct baffles me.

CrazyHedgehogLover · 31/07/2023 13:23

Personally what we do is we give the children dinner and just let them crack on with it! When it comes to finishing up, they’ll say there full, if they’ve shown they’ve tried to at least eat some of it then we’ll offer something afterwards..

I don’t get this “must eat everything on your plate” nonsense tbh, you said she ate her Yorkshire pudding, mash and roasted potatoes? For me that would have been enough.. if she’d have sat there and outright refused to eat anything I’d say fair enough, but she did eat some of it?

I don’t think it’s healthy to create this much drama over food tbh, in future instead of it being cake/ice cream it could be a desert that’s more nutritious/healthy? I would start encouraging healthy desserts and getting her to understand healthy/non healthy foods.

my children have cake/ice cream as a treat tbh, or when they stop at there nans (which isn’t often) otherwise there free to have some fruit after dinner, a yoghurt.. etc

you and your husband need to start looking at your own actions with this (so does the mum) but in your care it’s your guy’s responsibility.. I have stepdaughters who often have takeaways at their mums, practically lives off them there! They come here and ask for takeaways I just simply say not today and explain what we’re having for dinner, as long as they’ve eaten some of it I’m not bothered and they can have something after!

I think you need to not be focused on “you need to eat all of it” it causes unnecessary anxiety tbh, let them eat what they want and when they say there full, as long as they’ve eaten something on there plate then offer them some fruit etc when there belly have settled..

Flounder2022 · 31/07/2023 13:23

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 31/07/2023 12:31

I'm amazed at the reaction on here. Yes, eating disorders are a terrible thing, and certainly not something you would want to give to your child; but what is the alternative when a child deliberately leaves the healthier parts of their meal - which they like - because they just want the cake?

There has to be some parental autonomy exercised as, we all know, children will make bad, short-term choices without an adult to sensibly guide them.

Would people say that it's dangerous to give a child a set bed-time, in case you give them a sleep disorder by not letting them stay up until 1am, because they're having too much fun and aren't thinking ahead to how much this will wreck the next day for them? Wrong to tell them to tidy up after themselves, in case you give them a neatness OCD?

I really am struggling to see what OP has done wrong here - even aside from the fact that her DH set the rule and then blamed her for upholding it. Maybe that's a big part of the problem: if she knows that her Dad makes idle threats, she can safely ignore them and still get what she wants anyway?

IMO if cake is part of the meal then people - children included - should be allowed eat whatever parts of the meal they desire, including the cake, until they feel satisfied. If it's only available IF you achieve certain things then it shouldn't be made available as part of the meal. That doesn't mean no encouragement or conversation about eating vegetables etc. but don't have something on the menu that is conditional.

drinkuptheezider · 31/07/2023 13:30

This is why we didn't have desserts when DC were little. They only had desserts at my DGM.
They ate their meals or waited until the next meal. No fuss, no drama. No comments made. But no desserts or snacks.

Original poster
Mumof3premies · 31/07/2023 13:31

ConnieTucker · 31/07/2023 11:57

I’ve been her step mum for 8 years she’s 9
crikey. So very many men mentioned on mumsnet cannot be independent for even one year. Poor kid.

and for this to be going on for 8 years with the ex?!?! What has your dh tried to do about it?

you’re not the issue, op. Not having dessert is perfectly reasonable. Offering fruit instead is perfectly reasonable. Having the same rules for all children is perfectly reasonable. maybe suggest to your dh that he considers looking into counselling for his dd. Her father left her when she was a tiny baby and moved on very, very quickly. Food could be her way of gaining some control over losing that stability of family life. She will be learning more now she is older that her siblings have a very different, and more stable life to her.

My step daughter was conceived from a one night stand hun, we were together for 5 years in school we split up and got back together 5 years later and my step daughter was 1 years old he didn’t leave her he’s always tried to have her but her mum used her as a weapon hence going to court! This isn’t on him at all, he’s done his best!

we have had to get the police involved from harassment and have been to court to get set days and times.
my husband is a brilliant dad but he does pussyfoot around her a little as he knows how awful her mum is and her behaviours at home are so he overcompensates!

OP posts:
artishard · 31/07/2023 13:39

Does it also insert all the excessive exclamation marks and emojis for you?

Original poster
Mumof3premies · 31/07/2023 13:45

artishard · 31/07/2023 13:39

Does it also insert all the excessive exclamation marks and emojis for you?

Yea it does sometimes

OP posts:
FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 31/07/2023 13:52

IMO if cake is part of the meal then people - children included - should be allowed eat whatever parts of the meal they desire, including the cake, until they feel satisfied.

I take your point. Maybe it's a case of framing what we actually see dessert as, which will of course probably differ between people.

IMHO, I think there's a reason why the cake isn't served up at the same time as the main meal, and is virtually always served after the main meal - I've never known anybody sit down to a plate of cake and ice cream (or other sweet foods), finish it and then have a plateful of meat, veg, protein, carbs etc. afterwards.

The way I see it is that the dessert is a treat/reward, planned based on the assumption that you will have eaten your main meal already, without fuss or protest, so it's a kind of unwritten contract, based on balancing the high percentage of 'healthy' food with a small percentage of sweet, sugary food.

I do know that, as an adult, I have very often stated (truthfully) that I am full after the main meal and thus have declined any of the offered dessert - because I am indeed full and so cannot eat more.

caringcarer · 31/07/2023 13:55

You were perfectly reasonable up until the point you gave her toast and fruit. I cook a meal DC eat as much as they want if they say they are too full to eat it all then fair enough they can leave it, but if they don't eat it they don't get given toast and fruit half an hour later. I'd remind them they were full.

caringcarer · 31/07/2023 13:56

Livinginanotherworld · 30/07/2023 21:14

100% this

Show quote history

This. It isn't rocket science.

Hufflepods · 31/07/2023 14:00

@Flounder2022 IMO if cake is part of the meal then people - children included - should be allowed eat whatever parts of the meal they desire, including the cake, until they feel satisfied.

A young child should just be allowed to eat as much cake as they want, in place of a meal, until they decide they feel satisfied?

Honestly wtf am I reading on here??

Keyworks · 31/07/2023 14:10

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

kdmott · 31/07/2023 14:11

Hufflepods · 31/07/2023 14:00

@Flounder2022 IMO if cake is part of the meal then people - children included - should be allowed eat whatever parts of the meal they desire, including the cake, until they feel satisfied.

A young child should just be allowed to eat as much cake as they want, in place of a meal, until they decide they feel satisfied?

Honestly wtf am I reading on here??

No they should be allowed to eat the portion that was intended for them

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 31/07/2023 14:22

He shouldn’t have flip flopped. That’s issue no 1.

He shouldn’t have said no pudding if he was going to back on it.

However, I agree that it is using pudding as a reward or punishment. If there’s something that kids will inevitably see as special, you don’t have it unless everyone can have it. More importantly, try not to see it as special - it’s more “there are these options now” than “ooooh we’re all looking forward to our special Sunday cake”.

I don’t really agree with “plating up” food for children at all. It all goes on the table in this house and people can choose what they want - my ds will eat much more in the way of veg if it’s on the table and he can help himself to it. And he is / has been a picky eater - with ADHD - this is the tactic that works in getting picky eaters to eat well, not something that’s “all very well if your kids like veg”.

You don’t say “no cake if you don’t eat that”. But you can say “not until everyone if finished”. That way they might as well eat what’s currently on the table as they’ve got to wait for everyone else to eat anyway.

Original poster
Mumof3premies · 31/07/2023 14:23

kdmott · 31/07/2023 14:11

No they should be allowed to eat the portion that was intended for them

Show quote history

The portion was a SMALL portion enough for her to eat based on the 8 years I’ve watched her grow! She had to eat the broccoli chicken a few sliced carrots and then she could have it but she was fat too ‘full’ so didn’t get any. She took it home today so she didn’t miss out.

OP posts:
GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 31/07/2023 14:24

But that is so wrong.
{Eat dinner and you get dessert}
{Don't eat dinner so no dessert}

This means that if you really fancy the dessert, you're going to push yourself to finish dinner just to get the dessert.

This is what causes the overeating.

^^
This

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 31/07/2023 14:29

Most of the time we have fruit or yoghurt for pudding though, as who has cake or similar in all the time?

Mariposista · 31/07/2023 14:29

Too full for the healthy stuff? Sorry love, then you’re too full for the crap.
Nobody NEEDS dessert.

Smellslikesummer · 31/07/2023 14:36

Flounder2022 · 31/07/2023 13:23

IMO if cake is part of the meal then people - children included - should be allowed eat whatever parts of the meal they desire, including the cake, until they feel satisfied. If it's only available IF you achieve certain things then it shouldn't be made available as part of the meal. That doesn't mean no encouragement or conversation about eating vegetables etc. but don't have something on the menu that is conditional.

Show quote history

But how does it teach the children healthy eating habits? If they can eat just potatoes and then cake for a meal for ex.

I agree that forcing to finish off plates is not right either, but there is a middle ground : eating a reasonable amount of food needed for health before filling yourself with food that the body doesn’t need.

Smellslikesummer · 31/07/2023 14:40

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 31/07/2023 13:52

IMO if cake is part of the meal then people - children included - should be allowed eat whatever parts of the meal they desire, including the cake, until they feel satisfied.

I take your point. Maybe it's a case of framing what we actually see dessert as, which will of course probably differ between people.

IMHO, I think there's a reason why the cake isn't served up at the same time as the main meal, and is virtually always served after the main meal - I've never known anybody sit down to a plate of cake and ice cream (or other sweet foods), finish it and then have a plateful of meat, veg, protein, carbs etc. afterwards.

The way I see it is that the dessert is a treat/reward, planned based on the assumption that you will have eaten your main meal already, without fuss or protest, so it's a kind of unwritten contract, based on balancing the high percentage of 'healthy' food with a small percentage of sweet, sugary food.

I do know that, as an adult, I have very often stated (truthfully) that I am full after the main meal and thus have declined any of the offered dessert - because I am indeed full and so cannot eat more.

Yes!
It all goes back to people wanting to pretend that there is no treat/reward food. Of course there is, food that we eat for taste despite nutritional value/calories is a treat, why pretend it isn’t?

Duckmylife · 31/07/2023 14:47

In my opinion, you can have dinner and dessert. And you don't have to eat a large amount, but you can't have desert without any dinner. So if you aren't as hungry as normal but still want desert, then that's fine! You have half of each, so you don't overfill yourselves, but get a bit of both.

Original poster
Mumof3premies · 31/07/2023 14:54

I said she had to eat all the veg on the plate, I didn’t say she had to eat the whole plate ffs

OP posts:
LookItsMeAgain · 31/07/2023 15:06

Actually @Mumof3premies - Why did your DH think that you were singling your SD out? Has he given you a reason why he thought/said that you were when you were actually backing up his statement that only kids that had eaten some chicken, broccoli and potatoes (and the yorkshire pudding if they wanted one) could have icecream and cake. As she hadn't eaten the chicken and broccoli she decided herself that she wasn't going to have icecream and cake but there were alternatlives (probably less appealing to a child) to fill up on (such as fruit and toast).

The only thing I would have done differently is offer cheese and crackers (as opposed to toast as the alternative to fill up on, or to offer a sandwich.

Zimunya · 31/07/2023 15:15

drinkuptheezider · 31/07/2023 13:30

This is why we didn't have desserts when DC were little. They only had desserts at my DGM.
They ate their meals or waited until the next meal. No fuss, no drama. No comments made. But no desserts or snacks.

Yes to this. I also did not serve dessert when DD was little. She had to try everything at least once. You can't say you don't like something if you haven't even tasted it. But if she tasted it and didn't like it, I didn't cook it again. Small children have preferences the same as adults. I also tried to cook healthy meals, so the majority of options were healthy. Then she could eat as little or as much as she wanted. But supper was not replaced with treats. If she wasn't hungry and didn't eat much, she knew she couldn't expect chocolate instead. She was free to make herself some plain toast or a bagel if she got hungry later. Much easier with just one, I know. Teaching kids to make healthy choices is hard. I feel for all parents trying to do that!

Hibiscrubbed · 31/07/2023 15:19

NothingWrongButTheFire · 31/07/2023 08:18

She was asking if she was unreasonable to persist with the rules because her husband was in a mood with her and accused her of singling the SD out, despite her own children having the same rule.

Then, imo, you are both being unreasonable - you and your husband need to agree an approach together. Your SD sounds like she has had a really tough start to life and your and your husband are the closest thing to stability she has; she's going to need you both to be aligned, even if it means one of you compromising your ideals. It doesn't help for him to sulk, you both need to be able to talk this one out and come to an agreement.

HE is the one singling the SD out. For preferential treatment! The shared children were subject to the same rules. And all but one chose to eat their dinner, and the one who didn’t happily stashed her cake in the fridge for another day.