Can I just say that life as an ugly woman is horrible.

[SundayMorningTeaForOne]

I’m going to get very personal, so I’ve name changed for this one.

I hope we can be grown-up about this topic and no one’s going to hit me with the ”everyone’s beautiful in their own way” or claim that I have self-esteem issues.

Anyway, when I was younger boys really wanted to let me know how ugly they found me, so often made comments when I walked by.

When older I was loading some stuff in the car and men walked by and made those truck in reverse beeb-beeb-beeb sounds, you know letting me know I’m fat.

When out, men don’t talk to me, I’m not saying they have to be interested in me - this isin’t even what I mean, they complitely ignore me, talk to everyone else around us/ table, I’m air apperently.

I’m turning 40 next year. Never been on a date, never even been asked out on a date. So if anyone here want to argue my ugliness must be in my head, what more proof do you need.

Getting older has woken me up to the fact that I’m not going to have kids, I don’t have enough money and only family members I have I my prent and the way that they are, they are not going to support me with a child, so I can’t have a child on my own.
I don’t have enough resourses.

I can’t ger over the fact that I’ve went through life and never been loved.
No one’s ever cared about me, no one saw me as someone they’d (at least try) want to share and build a life with.
Always doing everything on my own, how tired I have become, I didn’t even notice it until I felt totally broken.
My cat died almost two years ago, she was the only one I’ve ever said good morning and good night to, now I just say to an empty room.
How sad is that?!

I honestly don’t know what keeps me here, why did I stay here for all these years. To still be alone.
Everyday I get up and go for a walk, no matter the weather, and feel like an idiot for doing that.

And in case someone wants to jump and say I must have depression, I just want to remaind that this is my life, had been always.
I’m just getting it all out. I think anyone would be very extatic if this is how their life had gone.
I had hope when I was younger / was happier, years / decades roled by and it wore me down.
That’s it.

Hi OP, really sorry to hear you feel this way. That is awful. Looks are not everything, personality makes someone much more attractive

I’d look for a different jobs and or social things like a local walking group or knitting group?
it sounds to me like you’re lonely and even if it’s just friendship you’d be happy with I think it would do you good.

Lots of ugly people seem to do well, and lots of attractive people can end up lonely and childless. I wouldn’t get hung up on it if you can help it!

Very beautiful women get hit on, decline a man's advances and are called stuck up bitches.

They also get nasty, derogatory comments about their appearance etc. ... anything at all the man can focus on (or even just make up) to try to score a point on her because she rejected him.

Long, thin legs that might have been complimented are now;

"Seen better hanging out of a nest" and

"Those are lucky legs; lucky they don't break hahaha" ....

Both comments made to my long legged, extremely pretty in her youth, sister.

A shit man's behaviour is not any nicer to conventionally attractive woman than it is to a not conventionally attractive woman ... If he doesn't get what he wants.

In some cases the comments and negging are done to conventionally attractive women without even having been rejected; just because they think they would be rejected, think she's out of their league etc. or they hate attractive women for having (they think) lots of options and being the gate keepers of sex.

*things the men make up, I mean ... Not their . makeup

You have two issues here OP that are linked, but not the same. It might help to see them as separate.
Firstly you are ugly. That's very unfortunate, but if you feel there's nothing you can do it improve it, then its something that has to be accepted. No one gets a perfect hand in life. Some of us are poor, lack intelligence, have poor health. Trite as it is, what can't be cured must be endured and we have to play the cards we have been dealt the best we can.
Second issue, you are lonely and don't have a relationship. While problem 1 is a contributory factor to this, it isn't a defining one. Ugly people are in relationships, that's a fact.
OK, their pool of options may be smaller, but its not non existent. They have to cast their net as deep and wide as possible and be prepared to consider less conventional ways of meeting someone. I'd be extremely surprised if there's not dating sites specifically for people who aren't conventionally attractive for example.
When things are rubbish it helps to focus on what you may be able to change. Your face, you can't. Your loneliness, possibly.

Looks fade for everyone ( Unless they spend a fortune on cosmetic surgery)
Weight can definitely be lost
Pets are wonderful companions, and outlast many a marriage.

Kids can be difficult- Grass isn’t always greener.
Definitely some average looking people in good marriages- It does go beyond mere physical “Attractiveness”

I once worked with a man who complained non stop that he couldn't get a girlfriend. He wasn't good looking nor was he exceptionally unattractive. He was just a fairly average looking dude. But his attitude - which occasionally bordered on a quite incel-ish bitterness that he couldn't 'get' a wife and have children - I think really did put women off. He also made no secret of the fact that he was frustrated. I'm not saying for one minute that the OP is like this - women don't tend to be. His continual self-pity was an absolute turn-off though. So when people aren't attached as the years go on - it's not always about looks.

Unless you have been an ugly woman you literally have zero idea what you are talking about. I was ugly but I had a lot of plastic surgery. Everything OP says about how she is treated is true.
it’s NOT her attitude

You can have a truly fabulous life without getting married, having children or being beautiful.
You have loved a cat, although it has now passed, the time you had with your cat showed you that you have the capacity to care and love. That was your cat's gift to you. There is another small animal that needs your love, go and find it.
You don't need to be beautiful to make friends, go and join a group of people who like the things you do. Join a Knit and Natter group. Volunteer for an animal shelter, whatever you find fulfilling. and friendships will appear. You need to be brave to do things alone too, just smile and be friendly.
Be fun, count your blessings.
Forty is still young, get living!

@SundayMorningTeaForOne

As I said before - get a new cat for company. It’s time.

You do not need your parents, or anyone, to have a baby. Sperm donor/adoption/fostering are all options if you want them. Most women take on the vast majority of child rearing (while some men are good…. They are few and far between). Most also have full time jobs and juggle this with children using childcare facilities… a few have parents helping but it’s an overnight here and there or an afternoon or two. You have a part time job… oodles of time to support a child. This “lack of resources” you speak of is a mirage of your own creation dependant on idealism. Think outside of the box and realise that what is depicted on tv or handed to you as hearsay in terms of dependable husband/family is not always the case!!

You’re coming across with a negative mindset and that you can’t be bothered doing much. Don’t want to lose weight, get nails etc done, don’t want to work full time or progress your career, don’t want to go out there and get involved with hobbies that involve other people as a self confessed introvert. How on earth do you expect someone to consider you as an attractive relationship/marriage prospect of you can’t even be arsed putting effort into life for yourself? Relationships are a tonne of work and men want a partner who is prepared to put effort in or give them something in return for their efforts. Again it is not the physicality here that is the problem but what you are projecting out into the world in actions/attitude that potential partners are seeing.

How many people would actually have high self-esteem, if they’d never been asked out?

Are you for real?? Why is your self esteem based on men wanting you, or what men think of you? You should be building up your self esteem with things like your career, hobbies, friends, travel, LIFE. You do not need a man. You need to love yourself.

As for the hormones, yes it could be perimenopausal issues so speak to your gp to get some tests done.

But honestly, go and make yourself happy.

I agree with this.

My sister got so much more attention than me. I used to be jealous, but now I am grateful.

I am happily married. She is single because she attracted the wrong sort of men.

I don't have an answer to how you feel about yourself, but I am 50 and I have rarely ever seen anyone who was genuinely ugly (and even then I think the woman concerned just needed new glasses). Most people will look better with a new hairstyle, losing weight, clothes that suit them better etc. There are really very very few ugly people - if they are it's because of transient details. Plain or not beautiful, yes. Ugly, no.

And many boys are just rude and nasty however attractive you are. I got told I was square and frigid and should shave my legs, for example!

Also think you should get another cat.

I think you're not as ugly as you think you are, although your self esteem certainly needs working on. Also I'm objectively pretty but was dumped for someone quite plain. I don't mean that evilly, although of course it sounds it. I think her and my ex just are way more compatible and have more shared interests. As it goes I don't seek gorgeousness in a man - my favourite qualities are humour and kindness. I don't actually give a shit about appearance.

Ha, I took the same path as you by the sound of it. Changed just about everything to present a more “acceptable” package. My mind never caught up with my face though. Underneath it all, in my head, I’m still the gawky ugly girl at school with the big nose and goofy teeth.

Yes I've been dumped in the past for much less attractive girls when I was younger too. I've been married for a while now. I knew even when I was much younger attraction wasn't all about looks.

I can't speak for the OP but what I find is that people say one thing but secretly think another. For example, I have seen other replies in similar threads where people say there is nothing at all wrong with being single at 40 with no kids but then on another thread, they will say they feel sorry for that person. (Even if said person isn't interested in the whole marriage and kids thing).
It's also easy to say 'Join a club' or whatever which is fair enough but easy to say when the poster is the one married with kids who has never had to do any of that and would feel very nervous going to a group alone.
It's hard when things like friendships and relationships seem to come so easily to some with no effort where as with others, every single contact has to be really worked for. It's hard not to feel irritated at that. Some people will never truly understand what loneliness and being physically ugly is about. Of course we try to change things and be positive but it is bloody hard.
I posted upthread but think it got lost amongst all the other posts. I could have wrote OP's post myself. I don't struggle with my weight but although a few years younger, I'm single, no kids, ugly, chronic health issues, no friends. Do work but hate it and makes me feel worse about myself. It's really tough. Outwardly I am always smiling and positive but I hate my life and really question my purpose in it because I feel I have none as in society's eyes I have failed. It's soul destroying to feel that way and know that many people judge my life.

Good point about the clubs, actually.

It drives me mad when people say 'just' go to a Meetup group or an activity. It's bloody nerve wracking to walk into a group of strangers, let alone do it over and over again! Its bloody hard, especially if you're already feeling low or having confidence issues. People actually aren't always nice, either. I went to a Meetup last night where a few people were downright rude, and I didn't really enjoy it. So pretty much a wasted evening, and actually a wasted day. I couldn't really get on with anything because it was in my head that I needed to go out later, had to start getting ready at 3.30pm, leave the house at 4pm, spend money on train to central London, a few hours having a not-great time, missed the train home by two minutes, so had to wait around, didn't get home until after 9pm. Hours of my weekend wasted and nearly £10 in transport when I'd have been happier staying at home with Netflix and a glass of wine.

There are so many married and partnered people who would never, ever have the balls to do any of the stuff they think single people should be doing all the time. They never have to go outside their comfort zone and have built-in company at all times. I think they can often lack empathy for how lonely it can be to be single.

Has it helped your confidence? I'm pleased that you don't feel ugly now, I'm livid we live in a world you felt you needed surgery to live happily.

I'm fat and my weight fluctuates, I hate that I know women who've almost died after the turkey tummy surgery and yet part of me still looks at the websites with a bit of jealousy I won't do it, it annoys me how we feel we owe society pretty and slim because we really don't. But I do hope you feel beautiful. X

@LilacRain12 so what if they judge your life? They can live their own life the way they want so f* them. This is your life!!

Having been both I'd say it's a very complicated mixture of several factors. There are some physical characteristics which it's hard or impossible to change. Then there's how you present yourself, both in terms of your attitude and what you can do to change your appearance. Then there's the issue of how men treat women and how they can actually be bloody rude about your appearance, whether you look like Waynetta Slob or Bella Hadid on the red carpet.

I've been physically assaulted by boys who hated my appearance so much. I suspect a lot of what they hated was my refusal to conform. Not dressing in a way that was trying to please them was taken as a big 'fuck you, I don't care what you think'. The reality was that as a young teen I just wasn't interested in male attention. Things changed partly because I grew into my looks and partly because I changed how I presented myself.

However, I didn't have a relationship until well after I started receiving male approbation. I had simply put up too many barriers, in order to deal with the abuse, to be able to let anyone in. Changing that took a lot more work than conditioning my hair and wearing tight jeans. There really isn't a simple answer as to what one can do to appeal to a potential partner. If the OP gave more details, we might be able to help. On the other hand, maybe that isn't what she wants from this thread.

I get it, OP. I’m ugly too. And now that I have hit my mid-40s (but look late 50s) I’m even more down about it. I’m either invisible or someone to mock. It’s shit.

@Scandipandi But it's hard to do in reality when you know the consensus is that most people, deep down, either pity you or feel you are less of a person because by a certain age, you are still single with no kids. For myself, I have never wanted kids and not fussed about marriage or being with someone. But society still makes you feel you are lacking if you don't have that. Even as I say, the responses I see on here day to day. Contradictory and differs according to the thread. For example, if someone comes on saying they are worried about being single at 40, generally they will get posters saying there is nothing wrong with it. Yet on another thread, they admit they would feel sorry for that person or that they discuss the single people in their lives saying that they wish they had someone.
It's horrible knowing you are the source of pity and sometimes ridicule.
Some will never truly get it as they have always had friends. Or they have been in relationships throughout most of their lives or they look average or attractive etc. It's easy to say 'Join a club' or ' Get out and socialise' but easier said than done and hard when you know other people don't have to go those lengths. Makes you feel so inadequate and lacking as a person.

I can look really good and also really bad, it's a fact I ve got the photos to prove it.

Loose weight, everyone looks better at a healthy weight.

Put effort into appearance.

Be available and flirty.

Be busy, fill your diary up.

Work full time, pay for supports if required. PT, good hairdresser, plastic surgery.

Take control of the situation.

Why do you care though?

I know some people feel sorry for me and think I'm sad because I'm 38 and single. I feel sorry for them, with their life of drudgery, never having time for themselves, having to cater to the whims of toddlers all day, every day, never able to just do anything spontaneous. I would hate to have their life, so I don't care what they think of mine.

I'm going to use a MN phrase here, and say, "Did you mean to be so rude?". And yes, it is spectacularly rude, and unless you have some kind of omniscient knowledge of all the MN posters, you sound fairly delusional yourself!