Can I just say that life as an ugly woman is horrible.

[SundayMorningTeaForOne]

I’m going to get very personal, so I’ve name changed for this one.

I hope we can be grown-up about this topic and no one’s going to hit me with the ”everyone’s beautiful in their own way” or claim that I have self-esteem issues.

Anyway, when I was younger boys really wanted to let me know how ugly they found me, so often made comments when I walked by.

When older I was loading some stuff in the car and men walked by and made those truck in reverse beeb-beeb-beeb sounds, you know letting me know I’m fat.

When out, men don’t talk to me, I’m not saying they have to be interested in me - this isin’t even what I mean, they complitely ignore me, talk to everyone else around us/ table, I’m air apperently.

I’m turning 40 next year. Never been on a date, never even been asked out on a date. So if anyone here want to argue my ugliness must be in my head, what more proof do you need.

Getting older has woken me up to the fact that I’m not going to have kids, I don’t have enough money and only family members I have I my prent and the way that they are, they are not going to support me with a child, so I can’t have a child on my own.
I don’t have enough resourses.

I can’t ger over the fact that I’ve went through life and never been loved.
No one’s ever cared about me, no one saw me as someone they’d (at least try) want to share and build a life with.
Always doing everything on my own, how tired I have become, I didn’t even notice it until I felt totally broken.
My cat died almost two years ago, she was the only one I’ve ever said good morning and good night to, now I just say to an empty room.
How sad is that?!

I honestly don’t know what keeps me here, why did I stay here for all these years. To still be alone.
Everyday I get up and go for a walk, no matter the weather, and feel like an idiot for doing that.

And in case someone wants to jump and say I must have depression, I just want to remaind that this is my life, had been always.
I’m just getting it all out. I think anyone would be very extatic if this is how their life had gone.
I had hope when I was younger / was happier, years / decades roled by and it wore me down.
That’s it.

I know a girl who is absoloutly lovely person but it would be an insincere lie to say she doesn't noticeably fall into the category of 'ugly' (as you put it) as far as expected 'beauty' looks go. That doesn't effect our ability to see her as a valuable and wonderful person though.

Just factually she is a big girl (over 400lb all carried in the protruding belly area) and very masculine to the point she can be mistaken for a drag queen sometimes (over 6 foot, huge feet, STRONG bone structures). She also has a completely upturned 'piggy nose' (as she points out herself) and always suffered badly with cystic acne and scarring too... she was first in our group of friend to marry (to a lovely man too).

I'm certain it's because her extroverted personality (shes friends with everyone and always the center of a party) WAY over shines anything to do with 'beauty standards' and people clearly see that and flock to her.

Some others of our group have worked in modelling, pageants, dance etc... and other beauty based careers and are still unsettled and unmarried pushing 40 despite having literal awards for their 'classic beauty'.

They don't lack 'attention' but if anything they seem to get 'used' then dumped quickly by men a lot. Also, some men clearly struggle with having women 'other men' want. They seem to like the idea but struggle with the reality leading to jealousy and controling behavior. It hasn't been a walk in the park for them from what I've seen (but then I was lucky enough to marry my childhood sweetheart, glad I'm not in the 'dating game' it looks awful for a lot of people).

I have a question
do you want to loose your virginity?

I have hobbies. Knitting, drawing, playing the piano, gardening, I love baking,

Have you tried finding likeminded people? There are certainly knitting clubs, baking ones? Doesn't have to be about finding partners, but you sound lonely and isolated, having friends would certainly help.

OP, you should obviously get another pet if you can. And have you tried joining online interest groups, where no-one knows or cares what other people look like? Mumsnet is good for that. What you have to say, what you can contribute to the group is what matters. When you get older you'll find that the difference between you and other women diminishes, as the attractive women begin to lose their looks.

I haven't RTFT but I'm conventionally attractive, and I've had a bloody awful, traumatic time with dating and relationships. Being totally objectified, men assuming I'm thick, decent men being too shy to approach, so only arseholes approaching, being negged to high heaven because men assume I'm full of myself and need to be taken down a peg or two. I've ended up with severe anxiety and depression and have basically opted out of dating at 38.

The problem isn't being ugly or beautiful, the problem is men.

Start your own thread.

I think there is far less of an objective Beauty standard than these posts suggest. Princess Diana was feted as a great beauty but objectively she had a larger nose than is generally seen as the accepted beauty ideal. Others with a similar nose might fixate on it and feel unattractive. Phoebe Waller Bridge joked in Fleabag about her insecurities about her nose and her flat chested figure. (She's stunning btw.)

I see that you've said you don't have enough resources to have a baby. Many don't. I had my first child as an unemployed 19 year old. It wasn't 'ideal' but I coped and got on with it. I imagine that most babies worldwide are born into less than perfect conditions but that's life and they get on with it.

I can't say that this is recommended but I do know of a few women who have used sperm donors they found online because a sperm bank was so expensive. They felt comfortable doing it and I think there were forums for finding donors. It's not the ideal situation for most people but it has produced lovely, much wanted children.

Don't waste your one and only life watching everything pass you by. As I said before, I have cancer at a young age and I want to grab every opportunity once I can because I have no idea how long I will have. I regret letting things just float on and daily life grind me down. It's easy to get stuck in a rut but it's down to you to do something about it.

And considering that so many suggest to get a tan, nails, lose weight, make-up…. It seems many of you have much higher expectations to women’s looks than I do actually

can you explain what this means please? Does it mean you think if you were a healthy/toned weight, with good hair , make up etc you do not think you’d be perceived as any more attractive? Or you do not wish to do these things, or you think we should all not do these things , I’m sorry, I don’t understand the intent of the sentence.

Yeah I didn't get that bit of @SundayMorningTeaForOne 's post either.

Don't tell me what to do.

My post is relevant to the thread. OP is acting like her bad experiences are uniquely because she's (apparently) ugly. They're not. That's the point. She's just blaming everything on that.

OP what do you want?

If I had a magic wand and said I could give you exactly what you want what would it be?

Do you want a husband or children or have lots of one night stands?
What would you change about your appearance?

I agree.

Its good for OP to have comments of people in a similar situation.

Hi OP, I’m sorry you’re feeling this way. It’s hard being conventionally unattractive and having to find the self worth to value yourself despite how dismissive people can be. All is not lost though, because you have you and you can make a more fulfilling life for yourself. It might not include a partner and a white picket fence, but that doesn’t mean that you won’t be happy. If you want a baby, work towards that. It’s definitely not too late.

You said you don’t have much family, but you can enlarge your circle of friends. Volunteer, take classes at the local adult college or start a hobby. As you start to get out more you’ll feel more confident.

I’m assuming you must be incredibly resilient, if you’ve had to deal with strangers saying such horrible things. That’s something amazing you can model to your child if you still want one. If you can’t afford counselling, maybe see if there is an online CBT course you can do to try and improve how you feel about yourself. There are some lots of great suggestions in pp about how you can improve your looks (and you should action a few if you want to) but ultimately we can’t assume we’ll be able to put effort into our looks all the time so you don’t want to peg your self worth to that.

I lost a lot of weight and I would recommend that if you choose to do this, speak with a GP and see what help they can give you. Gym referrals, advice, drugs if appropriate ect.

Then see what you can do about your earning potential. Make a plan. If you haven’t got a degree you can get part time funding for one so you can earn more, for example. I know it might not be possible because of the initially very low salaries, but there are some apprenticeships into fields that are very well paying.

It might be overwhelming but if you make a plan, maybe in the next five years, you can really change your circumstances. You’ll then be able to have your baby if you still want to.

Who are you to tell the OP she is WRONG about the cause of her issues. Such arrogance!

Do you do any volunteering OP? I know it sometimes sounds a bit glib, but it can really help your mental health to focus your mind on helping others. It can also widen your social circle and help you make different types of friends.

I started volunteering a few years ago, and through the meetings and fund raising I've made loads of new friends, people I probably wouldn't meet in day to day life. They're all different ages/backgrounds and I've really enjoyed it.

Volunteering opportunities....Local care homes, primary schools (reading with kids) Food banks, guide dogs (if you live near a training centre you could foster a pup in training, or just join the local fundraising group) they also offer a "My guide" service where volunteers help visually impaired people get out and about.

I think the key thing is to try and fill the gaps your life with other things, instead of giving too much headspace to the lack of relationship/your looks.

Bollocks. I'm not very attractive. I could do this I suppose and come out okay looking, but I cant be bothered. So I wander about looking not very attractive and don't really care. Its fine. I'm in the low normal range.
My friend was ugly. (shes now dead of the medical condition that made her look as she did). She was very short, fat, her face was not at all acceptable to most people, she had a strange voice because of the structure of her face, she had little to no hair, was very visually impaired so had to wear enormously thick glasses. A make up artist could not have helped her AT ALL. Some few people are very very unacceptable looking to most people. People would avoid her or at best think she had learning disabilities. It was nothing to do with her confidence.
She, to her enormous credit had loads of confidence, a medical professional job. But no dates ever. No interest from men ever. Horrible things said to her on the street practically every time we went out. Her cats loved her and her patients loved her. So bloody good for her, she achieved an enormous amount with the hand she had been dealt.
But it is so unfair to tell people like her and the op that life could be different if they behaved differently, fixed their hair etc. It couldn't and it is absolutely victim blaming to do this.

Stop telling people to start their own thread. Their contributions are relevant to this discussion.

Who are you to tell me my contribution is irrelevant?

Of course OP's problems aren't solely down to looks, because they can't be. You don't have to be Einstein to figure that out. Look how many women have posted about women they know who aren't conventionally attractive and who are in happy relationships and doing well in life.

Yes, being conventionally attractive makes some things easier, of course it does, but it makes other things much, much harder. OP just doesn't see that. It's just more socially acceptable to blame all your woes on being ugly than on being beautiful.

Imagine calling someone arrogant when you're so arrogant that you basically want to erase their contribution and silence them because you don't like what they have to say.

The lack of self awareness!

What @loveheartsonaflower said!

You sound lovely OP 💞

I think @RestingMurderousFacewould like to believe HER issues are to do with the way she looks, when she might want to consider the way she interacts with people may also have something to do with it. Who are you to tell people what they can and can't discuss?

@ilyana I identify with a lot of your experiences and I am sorry for them. Voices like ours need to be heard on this thread because the belief a lot of people hold that being beautiful makes you automatically happier and more likely to end up in a successful relationship is a complete fiction. If anything you end up with the worse end of the deal, to be honest. The abuse I've had at the hands of men would fill a book. I don't want one near me now and I also have chosen to be single as a result of my experiences. And yet me choosing to be single also elicits rage from men. I literally can't win.

I agree with a PP asking what you want.

Do you want advice here or just to offload ?

Because almost anyone can improve how they look. If they want to.

You probably are not ugly. Plain perhaps, but that's not ugly.

Do you want help to change that?

Not because MEN like 'pretty women' but because you yourself have labelled yourself as ugly, so it's you hating yourself, (first) not other people.

You say men don't chat to you.

Do you chat to them or do you sit there quietly and never speak?
Do you always want a man to make the first move?

Being blunt, if you think being 'ugly' is a barrier, then lose weight, get a nicer haircut, wear make up, take advice on clothes.

You can't change your face, as such, (unless you want surgery) but you can make more of what you have IF YOU WANT TO.

I'd start by looking at your own behaviour. You may give out an 'untouchable' vibe because you appear to hate yourself or feel sorry for yourself.

There are many 'ugly' people about but they act confidently, are happy, and seem warm and friendly. So people end up talking to them.

The oh “I’m so beautiful” posts. Do you have no empathy, no sensitive, no emotional maturity?

I’m in that category, and I would never ever dream of telling someone who was struggling “oh but life is also difficult for us”. Be realistic, life is no where near as difficult for us. Don’t blame your bad choices in men on being beautiful and be a bit more self conscious about how you come across.