So fed up with my child

[arrghhhh]

I know I handled this situation all wrong this morning but I am honestly so fed up. I am a single mum to a 10 year old girl. She goes to her dads once in the week and then every second weekend so I do get breaks.

However, she is an angel for her dad. With me, not so much. She was at her dads last night, I phoned her this morning to see what time she would be home, looking forward to seeing her. The full phone call was just from start to finish moan, moan, moan.

I have been ill with tonsillitis all week so granted, this hasn't been the best week for her, however, she has still made her gymnastics club (4 day of the week) and yesterday my dad took her a day out. Next week I have a day out planned with her and I said since I'm feeling better we will go out a big walk tomorrow.

She said okay to the walk but only if the dogs don't come. I'm like, what? Of course the dogs are coming. Queue 'it's not fairrrr, the dogs alwaysssss come with us'. I said don't be so ridiculous, of course I'm bringing the dogs. It literally makes no difference other than the fact she constantly needs and seeks attention. Also it's a downright lie considering I take her plenty places without the dogs, for instance last week when I took her and her friend to the park - no dogs in tow. It's as if she just finds anything at all to moan about.

She then starts asking what we are doing this afternoon. I said well you have gymnastics and then probably just potter about in house today as I am still not feeling 100 percent. Queue more moaning.

At this point I lost it, I told her she was the most ungrateful child, always miserable, never happy and if my house was so boring then she can stay at her dads for the day and hung up on her.

Definitely didn't deal with this situation well but I am so fed up with her constant negativity. She sucks the life out of me. Even after a full day out with my dad yesterday, she's still miserable, doesn't appreciate it. Shrugs and says the day out 'was fine'. She's only happy when with her friends and I'm just sick of it.

I'm sick of trying to do nice things with her when she appreciates nothing. Whilst I've been I'll she hasn't shown one bit of empathy or compassion, it's all about her and how it affects her and her plans.

I do feel that that last year of primary is very hard. I have noticed it in my own DCs and GCs.

I think it might be better to ride the storm for a bit. She is pushing for a reaction. It is not easy between keeping discipline and giving in to bad behaviour. I do think early puberty is a trying time so all I can say is pick your battles.
As you get on so well with ex, maybe the three of you can sit down and talk about what is making each of you frustrated.

@Kingsparkle

omg aim a bit higher! OF COURSE your child should thank you for buying him an ice cream! Every time
it’s called manners

One would assume the OP didn't simply stick a pin in a list of activities and select gymnastics by chance. You may not see that as fun, but the child presumably enjoys it.
I'm curious as to what activities would be so superior to a walk with the OP (fresh air, excercise, chatting) that would enable better bonding?
Most people have budgetary constraints that mean endless 'fun' days out are not an option. Many children have little interest in the MN staples of craft and baking, which also carry a cost.
The OP is clearly arranging activity. The DD is not appreciative. To think the answer to that is for the OP to run around ramping up the fun is to miss the crux of the problem.

I am not white and I agree with some of what she is posting

Jesus Christ. I feel for your future daughter or son in law, @Kingsparkle if you have taught your little prince he doesn’t have to say thank you to those close to him.

This! Im one of 4, ‘time alone’ with my parents just didn’t happen. This notion that our kids are so fragile that unless we strike exactly the right balance of everything we will damage them for life is a nonsense. What matters is the overall picture, her life looks pretty good to me.

Why would I not expect my husband, a grown adult who I do not have responsibility for, to be grateful? What a bizarre and irrelevant comparison. I am not obliged to keep him fed or clothed so he should be grateful when I do stuff for him, which he is and me him. We model that for my child.

How do you model it for your child? Since you don't expect it from him...

I drew the comparison because your key point as to why a child shouldn't need to thank their parents seemed to be that you chose to have them, which could apply to a lot of things. Yes, a parent is obliged to house, feed and clothe their child. They aren't obliged to buy them treats, though, so for these things, such as the ice cream example, it is natural, and good for the child's development, to expect some degree of polite appreciation.

I didn’t say I would be uncomfortable if my child thanked me for giving them food, I just don’t expect it. And I wouldn’t remind my children I provide basic care for them as a counterpoint to them wanting more things. You can say just no and not chuck in the bit about being ungrateful you know.

I didn't say it shouldn't make you uncomfortable if your child thanks you, I said it shouldn't make you uncomfortable that a parent might expect thanks for a treat. I also didn't say I would remind them of the care I provide just because they asked for more, I said I would remind them of the care I provide if they tried to pull the "you do nothing for me" card. That's not the same thing, it's not helpful to misconstrue what people have said.

I have also never “put my child in his place”. What a horrible expression. Children need boundaries sure but not told they are lesser.

Put them in their place, as in, explain to them how wrong they are to say that. Nothing to do with being lesser, you jump to very negative conclusions.

How does a 10yr old cross a line? I assume she needs putting back in her place in your form of parenting. That’s fine, I’ll stick to mine.

What do you mean? There are tons of way a 10 year old can cross a line, surely that's obvious. This one has done it by whining constantly to the point of excess.

Yes, I actively try to shield my kids from it.

Are you okay otherwise? Anything going on that might be affecting you mentally or hormonally?

Blimey, that’s a bit patronising isn’t it?

I haven’t got much to contribute I’m afraid, given that my only child, a boy, isn’t due for another week, but a lot of what you say resonates with me as DSS is 11 and often shares similar sentiments. I think it’s mainly an age thing, puberty, transition stages (end of primary school into secondary etc.). Maybe kids are a bit too indulged in terms of their wants and wishes to the detriment of their own mental health etc. Now they have a hard time learning that the whole world doesn’t revolve around them. I had it easier growing up in some ways because my older brother has autism, profoundly so, so quite a lot of time we all had to pull together to give him the best possible quality of life, so our needs (mine and that of my eldest brother) came second. But we still had loads of opportunities though (to learn an instrument and so on) and while things were tough at times I remember it as being a very happy childhood.

I think another PP mentioned boundary pushing, button pushing even, and there’s probably some truth to that. Last week my partner wanted DSD (his DD) to watch the news just to provide a window into what’s going on in the world and what people are having to deal with right now. I think there was something about a natural disaster (could have been that New York flooding) and she was complaining that “it wasn’t fair” that nothing like that had ever happened to her as she thought something like that looked fun. If I had made a comment like that at her age, my dad would have, in his words, “swung for me”. I think she was trying to get a reaction, and I think in a couple of years time she would cringe at such a comment, if she remembers it all.

But then she went berserk when one of her mum’s cousin’s children broke one of her toys (like, took a knife from the kitchen drawer ballistic) so I’m not sure getting caught up in a natural disaster would agree with her anyway. And I should point out these children (her second cousins I suppose) are Ukrainian, are here with their mum, dad stayed in Odessa, and they’re awaiting a three year refugee visa to come through. You couldn’t make it up! Kids eh?

It's the "little shit" stage and all of the kids in our wider family have went through it, and have emerged the other side as lovely polite, unspoiled teens and young adults.

It's the start of them learning how to manage emotions, express them, learning assertiveness and curbing the cocky/cheeky or nasty behaviour, and learning effective communication with those around them. DS was at his worst whining when he was 9. You couldn't look at him or he'd take the head off you. He's improved massively now, and once the teen hormones kick in properly I'm sure we'll have many more days of it ahead.

It's a gradual thing. Some days you'll snap back sternly at them to don't even dare talk to you that way, other days you'll recognise that they are wrecked from an activity, are venting at a safe person or have some little worry playing on their mind that's causing it. Some days you'll lose your shit, and then you go back, apologise and communicate better. I think it's ok for kids to know that you are human and that there are days you too are at a low ebb and are running on fumes because you are also showing them that what they are feeling is temporary and tomorrow will be different. It's important to show them that while they can feel like shit, it's not ok to take it out on others and that it won't be tolerated. DS is learning that he can come to us any time and rant over the injustices in his world and I'll listen, and offer him a cuppa/ hug/ distraction /advise as required but expecting a verbal punchbag won't be tolerated.

Same

Is her Dad being the fun parent and leaving you to do the routine stuff? If so change this. She’s probably comparing all the nice stuff she’s doing with her Dad with the boring stuff you do at home. Try and reserve weekends for special 1-2-1 activities without the dogs.

Mmm, yes that's an interesting one, and a theory.

Shame I guess that when they watch the news, or access the internet - they are confronted with these issues anyway , so 'shielding' them from it is not going to help them navigate these local and global issues.

I get it up to the age of around ten - before they have phones etc. but after that, no matter how much you might try, you are not going to have much luck 'shielding' them from it. Something I've learned.

I randomly noticed in G.C.S.E year that there were some kids in DD's class that had never used public transport. I mean at all, ever. Guess some parents thought they were 'shielding' their kids from it. How that sort of thing is going to benefit them, I fail to understand. They are going to have to engage with it at some point. Likewise, budgeting and dealign with the vaguiaries of economics and mortgage rates...

If parents want to raise their children to see them as existing for the sole purpose of meeting their needs and facilitating their pleasure, then that's entirely their own affair.
Frankly it wouldn't work for me. The fact that I gave birth to people shouldn't relegate me to a cross between a servant and a cash machine in their eyes, denied the most basic of courtesy or appreciation. Buying treats and arranging days out involves cost, effort and sacrifice. Why should that go unacknowledged just because the person providing it is a parent?
And let's be honest, when we say parents, we nearly always mean mums, don't we? Far fewer men subscribe to this subservient martyred mind set. So it's not a great introduction to valuing women either.

Hi OP

My daughter has gone through phases of this. It's so wearing when you've trudged around and spent time on money on trying to give them a good day and they just turn around and have a good moan about something completely minor and you just think fuck it I'll not bother next time. With my daughter and probably yours, when pressed eg the next day she will acknowledge that she did have a great time and the little thing didnt matter, and it's actually just habit to moan rather than something they mean.

Like you though I want to do something about it as although kids generally grow out of it, not everyone does naturally and no one likes being around a negative adult who constantly moans). And I can see that she is like this with her friends sometimes and it ends up pushing them away (eg will moan that they didnt play with her enough which has the effect of making them want to play with someone else even more. When she stops moaning and just asks them to play with a smile they are all for it)

We got my daughter a feelings reflections type book which has forced her to think about some of the good things that have happened to her that day. We constantly remind her not to moan (in a 'hey we're going to help you try and break this habit because its easy to get into a negative mindset and that will make you moan more and then you'll be unhappy) type way, encourage her to come up with actual solutions or questions rather than just moans (eg can you help me come up with some ideas for things I can do, rather than I'm bored) and remind her that if she appears to not enjoy things that we have arranged then we will stop arranging them. It's a work in progress though!

I feel ya ! U just having a rough time your Ill as well !! And she moaning !
Best thing I think to do with moaning kids is let them get bored entertaining themselves they tend to enjoy time and trips out more but if they don’t get bored and constantly entertained they don’t know any better , anyways hope u feel better soon just give her a hug and apologise but putting phone down on her x

So...she behaved like a normal, moody prepubescent child, and you responded with a character assassination, told her she could stay at her dad's and hung up on her? Nice.

Nothing in your OP suggests that she has an abnormal lack of empathy or any other emotional problems beyond being 10. I wouldn't bank on that remaining the case if you continue to treat her the way you do, however.

I read this earlier and it’s really upset me. Your poor daughter! She’s 10; not your nurse!! She’s acting like a typical CHILD because that’s what she is - then you character Assassinate her and hang up, can you imagine how that must feel to her? Your promise of a big walk… well yippee what a treat 🤦🏼‍♀️ My daughter wouldn’t bite your hand off for that; maybe her asking to go without the dogs was her way of making a choice? You really sound like you don’t like her, maybe let her stay with her Dad until you can be nice to her.

At this point I lost it, I told her she was the most ungrateful child, always miserable, never happy and if my house was so boring then she can stay at her dads for the day and hung up on her.

That surely showed her how to be happy

Can she go to her dad's more? 4 days a fortnight doesn't seem much.

if point out shes ungrateful and hanging up is a one off- then its fine.shes with her dad- surely he can reiterate you arent feeling well.

My Mum told be recently than when I was a child I would always be horrible to her when I had come back from my Dads, I feel bad now but I don’t remember. Is there a pattern to it?

Give child a telling off? Absolutely.

Burdening a 10 year old child, who is simply acting up like a child, with trying to understand emotional manipulation from an adult who they should be able to trust. Atrocious.

She is behaving like a prepubescent kid (and one with parents that she is working out she can play off against once another to boot) behaves.
Objectively you have to ignore the bad behaviour and reward the good, set and reinforce boundaries and show her lots of love. But you know this.
Here's the flip side. You are behaving like an adult that feels like shit, that's being treated like shit and has momentarily had enough and showed it. That's also ok actually (as long as it's not all the time). Everyone has limits and everyone snaps at some point or other. And those that say they don't aren't telling the truth imo.

The further bad news is she's likely to get worse before she gets better. So you need to learn the strong art of detachment and trying not to take it personally when she behaves this way. I've got two DD's, 17 and 16 and two DSS's 11 and 9. And with all but one of those children, at least once a day I have to say to myself 'it's not them it's the hormones' under my breath, just to stay on an even keel. And I do alot of dog walking just to get out of the house, seethe quietly and then go back and *try to calmly crack on.