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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Does anyone ever feel sorry for MIL’s?

524 replies

MrsPPP · 13/07/2023 10:57

I am a Mother to all boys and am nowhere near being a Grandmother or having a daughter in law, so me asking this is nothing to do with my personal situation right now, but it definitely makes me worry for the future.

I see so many posts about imposing MIL’s etc…. Usually in these posts, OP is female, raved about what a blessing her Mother has been and then rants about DH’s family being imposing or coming round to visit too often.
Are DH’s family not equal? Are they not also Grandparents?

I totally understand that this question is generalised and that some people will have valid reasons (abuse, alcohol issues etc).

I just hope that any future DIL of mine will accept that two sets of loving grandparents is surely better for the children. Also, who doesn’t want extra help?

OP posts:
Hazelnuttella · 13/07/2023 12:24

Is it entitled to want equal GC access?
MIL’s were once mothers of newborns, also gave birth, breastfed etc… They are aware of how poor DIL must be feeling so probably just want to help.

But, if DIL has just become a new mum, her needs are the most important, and this might mean support from her own mum, and not her MIL. This is more important than “access” to GC. Obviously this is only applicable to the first few weeks post-birth.

I do agree with you in general that MILs are often derided on mn. I think a lot of the problem is husbands not bothering to keep in touch with their own mother, outsourcing it to their wives (DIL). And/or MILs expecting that it’s DIL’s job to facilitate the relationship/visits etc, rather than MIL’s actual son.

Sugargliderwombat · 13/07/2023 12:25

Just from my experience becoming a new mum and having lots of chats about it with others, I feel like we stay important humans in our own right to our own mums. But too many new mums just turn into some gateway for access to the new baby for MILs. I suppose if your own daughter has a baby you still see her as important and care so much about her aswell, whereas MIL often care much much more about the new GC, which disrupts relationships that were often really positive before GC. I know lots of MILs are lovely and I also know people who's mums seem to be nightmares !

Sugargliderwombat · 13/07/2023 12:26

Hazelnuttella · 13/07/2023 12:24

Is it entitled to want equal GC access?
MIL’s were once mothers of newborns, also gave birth, breastfed etc… They are aware of how poor DIL must be feeling so probably just want to help.

But, if DIL has just become a new mum, her needs are the most important, and this might mean support from her own mum, and not her MIL. This is more important than “access” to GC. Obviously this is only applicable to the first few weeks post-birth.

I do agree with you in general that MILs are often derided on mn. I think a lot of the problem is husbands not bothering to keep in touch with their own mother, outsourcing it to their wives (DIL). And/or MILs expecting that it’s DIL’s job to facilitate the relationship/visits etc, rather than MIL’s actual son.

Oh I agree with ALL of this!

Hazelnuttella · 13/07/2023 12:28

Sugargliderwombat · 13/07/2023 12:25

Just from my experience becoming a new mum and having lots of chats about it with others, I feel like we stay important humans in our own right to our own mums. But too many new mums just turn into some gateway for access to the new baby for MILs. I suppose if your own daughter has a baby you still see her as important and care so much about her aswell, whereas MIL often care much much more about the new GC, which disrupts relationships that were often really positive before GC. I know lots of MILs are lovely and I also know people who's mums seem to be nightmares !

When I had my DS, my MIL started calling me “mummy”. She was holding my lovely new baby, he started crying and she said “mummy we’re hungry”. I had a visceral reaction to it, it really made my skin crawl!

Original poster
MrsPPP · 13/07/2023 12:29

Goldbar · 13/07/2023 12:20

My MIL is perfectly nice. But she's not my mother. And when I'm on my knees from exhaustion from caring for 2 small children, one a non-sleeping baby, with a workaholic husband who's rarely at home, she's not the one I turn to for help. Firstly, because I would never criticise her son to her - what would be the point in upsetting her, it's not like I hold her responsible for the behaviour of a separate grown adult? Secondly, because lovely as she is (and I enjoy her company), she's a visitor in our home. I tidy up for her coming, I change sheets, I hoover, I make food. She deserves it, she does the same for us and is a fantastic host when we visit. But she's not someone I can call sobbing in the morning and say, "please come over, the place is a tip, there's no food, I haven't slept or showered in 2 days and have a migraine and the baby won't be put down".

My mother probably gets more "grandchild time", if you put it that way, but my MIL gets the good stuff. The planned days out, the picnics, the park visits. Watching the older DC at sports day or in his school play. My mother gets to clean our bathroom, hoover our kitchen, do the school run, cajole the older child into doing homework, rock a crotchety baby to sleep... It's my mother who walks the baby around the block at midnight with a coat over her pyjamas because I've just had enough. I can't ask that of my MIL and my husband isn't around to. My mother offers or just does it without being asked.

I completely understand this. You sound like a thoughtful DIL who includes your IL’s and your Mother sounds like a Godsend.

OP posts:
RosesAndHellebores · 13/07/2023 12:29

My MIL was great in the early years but some of her digs have taken their toll over the years.

I have two DC. Five pgs reached the 2nd trimester, three the 3rd.

"It's such a shame you can't perform" has never been forgotten. Nor the banging on about how SIL1 had twins with gas and air and breastfed them without issue for a year. Obviously SIL1 had strong genes like her.

The snotty digs started coming after dh and I had been together for about 10 years. Always a dig about how I might not be academic, it's wonderful that I'm so practical, then the digs about only children, then about appearance being shallow, of course moneyed people like your family wouldn't understand...... Don't get me started on the fuss made about sending the DC's to private school and how it would mean they couldn't mix with other people.

This from a woman who I have entertained every Christmas since 1993, who dh has visited monthly since her husband died 16 years ago, for whom he now pays for carers so she can stay in the family home. We have just returned from a week away with her and SIL2 and husband. Even at 87 she is capable of loudly declaring to SIL2 and husband that spending £65 on a dress is extravagant and she doesn't rate the sort of people who care about their appearance. I just shouted back "I can hear every word MIL, I don't agree. SIL2 and husband had their heads in their hands.

Since 1961 she has never invited anyone into her house for a cuppa or lunch. She has no friends and both her dd's moved to different continents after uni. One has visited about 5 times in the last 30 years and the other twice which says it all.

I do what I need to do, have had her, and formerly FIL, as guests for up to 10 days at a time in my home, catered, made tea, etc., (admittedly not expected now she's in her 80s) but she has never once lifted the kettle in my house and once complained I had put the cheese in FIL's sandwich lengthways rather than crossways.

She's a nasty, green eyed old bag who says what she wants in a particularly schoolmarmy way. Oh and my car was an extravagance when the dc were at schools in opposite directions and I then headed off to work.

Ah, that was cathartic.

Iwanderedlonelyasagoat · 13/07/2023 12:30

My MIL is lovely. She doesn't see our DC as much as my parents because of where we live, but we do everything we can to be available for visits/visit and to foster a close relationship between them. However, there are some differences between her and my mum e.g. how much I would want her around immediately after birth etc. But she knows this and when I gave birth came a week later, stated nearby and very much understood that we needed some space whereas normally they would just stay with us. Most of the behavior people complain about on MIL threads sounds dreadful and from the experience of some friends it's not totally unrepresentative. In terms of equal grandparenting, I facilitate the relationship with my own parents and it's down to DH to do this with his. His mum communicates with me about dates for visits etc, presents in a way my own mum would never dream of involving my DH. So a lot of it is just inequality/misogyny in what we expect from women.

mamaduckbone · 13/07/2023 12:30

I also am a mother of only boys who worries about this in the future.

My ds17 has had his first serious girlfriend for about a year now and she is lovely, and we get on well, so although I'm quite sure they won't last forever it does give me a little bit of hope!

Sapphire387 · 13/07/2023 12:32

I do hope the same people talking about 'grandparents' rights to access GC' etc are not the same grandparents who hardly ever offer to babysit.

Grandparents don't have 'rights'.

I'm afraid biology dictates some of this when it comes to newborns.

I have a son and a daughter and about to have DC3 (we haven't found out the sex yet). I would HATE to think I was making a future DIL uncomfortable by banging on about 'access' to her newborn baby while she was recovering from birth. I would love to be able to support in whatever way she needed, but that should be guided by her - not me.

Neither will I be having my MIL around a lot like I will my own mother, during the post-birth period this time. I don't feel comfortable with that and I'm the one who has had to be pregnant, give birth, and will be recovering.

In terms of more generally, I don't think MIL's should be demonised. But there do seem to be a fair few who tend to overstep the mark and interfere - mine included - and that is never going to make for an easy relationship.

takealettermsjones · 13/07/2023 12:33

RosesAndHellebores · 13/07/2023 12:29

My MIL was great in the early years but some of her digs have taken their toll over the years.

I have two DC. Five pgs reached the 2nd trimester, three the 3rd.

"It's such a shame you can't perform" has never been forgotten. Nor the banging on about how SIL1 had twins with gas and air and breastfed them without issue for a year. Obviously SIL1 had strong genes like her.

The snotty digs started coming after dh and I had been together for about 10 years. Always a dig about how I might not be academic, it's wonderful that I'm so practical, then the digs about only children, then about appearance being shallow, of course moneyed people like your family wouldn't understand...... Don't get me started on the fuss made about sending the DC's to private school and how it would mean they couldn't mix with other people.

This from a woman who I have entertained every Christmas since 1993, who dh has visited monthly since her husband died 16 years ago, for whom he now pays for carers so she can stay in the family home. We have just returned from a week away with her and SIL2 and husband. Even at 87 she is capable of loudly declaring to SIL2 and husband that spending £65 on a dress is extravagant and she doesn't rate the sort of people who care about their appearance. I just shouted back "I can hear every word MIL, I don't agree. SIL2 and husband had their heads in their hands.

Since 1961 she has never invited anyone into her house for a cuppa or lunch. She has no friends and both her dd's moved to different continents after uni. One has visited about 5 times in the last 30 years and the other twice which says it all.

I do what I need to do, have had her, and formerly FIL, as guests for up to 10 days at a time in my home, catered, made tea, etc., (admittedly not expected now she's in her 80s) but she has never once lifted the kettle in my house and once complained I had put the cheese in FIL's sandwich lengthways rather than crossways.

She's a nasty, green eyed old bag who says what she wants in a particularly schoolmarmy way. Oh and my car was an extravagance when the dc were at schools in opposite directions and I then headed off to work.

Ah, that was cathartic.

Holy crap. I'm so sorry you had to hear that awful comment, and for your losses.

IceCreamQueen86 · 13/07/2023 12:33

MissyB1 · 13/07/2023 12:04

We hear plenty from Dils too. Son in laws are expected to put up and shut up.

Show quote history

What are you on about?! Men moaning & making “jokes” about their MILs is extremely well known! All the MIL jokes I’ve ever heard come are men!

AngeloMysterioso · 13/07/2023 12:33

YANBU. I’m really lucky with my PILs, they’re lovely people and they are the only grandparents because my parents are dead- but I have two boys and another on the way, and I do worry that I’ll be the second-rank grandmother when my time comes!

Original poster
MrsPPP · 13/07/2023 12:34

RosesAndHellebores · 13/07/2023 12:29

My MIL was great in the early years but some of her digs have taken their toll over the years.

I have two DC. Five pgs reached the 2nd trimester, three the 3rd.

"It's such a shame you can't perform" has never been forgotten. Nor the banging on about how SIL1 had twins with gas and air and breastfed them without issue for a year. Obviously SIL1 had strong genes like her.

The snotty digs started coming after dh and I had been together for about 10 years. Always a dig about how I might not be academic, it's wonderful that I'm so practical, then the digs about only children, then about appearance being shallow, of course moneyed people like your family wouldn't understand...... Don't get me started on the fuss made about sending the DC's to private school and how it would mean they couldn't mix with other people.

This from a woman who I have entertained every Christmas since 1993, who dh has visited monthly since her husband died 16 years ago, for whom he now pays for carers so she can stay in the family home. We have just returned from a week away with her and SIL2 and husband. Even at 87 she is capable of loudly declaring to SIL2 and husband that spending £65 on a dress is extravagant and she doesn't rate the sort of people who care about their appearance. I just shouted back "I can hear every word MIL, I don't agree. SIL2 and husband had their heads in their hands.

Since 1961 she has never invited anyone into her house for a cuppa or lunch. She has no friends and both her dd's moved to different continents after uni. One has visited about 5 times in the last 30 years and the other twice which says it all.

I do what I need to do, have had her, and formerly FIL, as guests for up to 10 days at a time in my home, catered, made tea, etc., (admittedly not expected now she's in her 80s) but she has never once lifted the kettle in my house and once complained I had put the cheese in FIL's sandwich lengthways rather than crossways.

She's a nasty, green eyed old bag who says what she wants in a particularly schoolmarmy way. Oh and my car was an extravagance when the dc were at schools in opposite directions and I then headed off to work.

Ah, that was cathartic.

I literally felt you sigh from relief at the end of your post 😂
She is certainly not the MIL I’m trying to defend. It sounds like you have given everything to be civil.

OP posts:
Kafkaland · 13/07/2023 12:34

I really wish my children had even one set of involved grandparents!

takealettermsjones · 13/07/2023 12:34

JassyRadlett · 13/07/2023 12:24

I find the talk of "rights" a bit weird and maybe it exposes where some of the issues are here - parents of adult children feeling they have legitimate rights or at best assumptions of what they should be able to expect from their adult children.

When in reality we're talking about relationships between adults. At their best, they'll be mutually respectful and supportive. At their worst, they'll totally break down.

I think a lot of people on both sides of the relationship would benefit from reframing their expectations and how they view the relationship, away from rights and responsibilities and towards something more adult and mutually respectful.

Show quote history

This 100%.

TeddySunflowers · 13/07/2023 12:36

My MIL is a grackle.

wholivesondrurylane · 13/07/2023 12:37

There was a horrible thread about new mums recently, probably more than one thread, but this one comes to mind.

It was basically mocking and abusing the new mums "too precious" to have visitors the minute they gave birth, posters outraged at having to ASK before coming to visit and give the newborn a damn "cuddle", making fun at women asking for a few days home alone before having visitors, and god forbid having their own mum popping in to see them..

With that attitude, far too common, and the new mother being dismissed and put aside from day 1, you can't complain about the lack of relationship with the grand-kids later on.

3AndStopping · 13/07/2023 12:39

I think people are just more used to/patient with their own parents flaws. It’s Easy to get irritated by minor thing by people you don’t perceive to be ‘real’ family. People just don’t have patience. My mil is lovely but my fil is a miserable git. But he has his positive areas and so I just try to focus on those, he is of course my children’s grandad and they love him. I remind myself of that when I’ve been trying to instigate a conversation for half an hour and get grunts back 🤣

afinethingindeed · 13/07/2023 12:40

My MIL is lovely and I love her 😊
Sure, she does things that are annoying but so does my mum. I know I'm very very lucky to have MIL in my life and DD adores her.

Objectionhearsayspeculation · 13/07/2023 12:40

My DH lost his mum before we met but she sounds like she would have been an amazing Grandmother, she had basically been an extra Granny figure to all the neighbours kids now grown up and was a fantastic baker so I wish my Dds had known her. My own DM is.... hands off

mindutopia · 13/07/2023 12:43

I've actually always had lovely relationships with the mothers of all my long-term partners, and I actually don't mind my MIL too much. We have had our differences as we are very different people - and she is very co-dependent in an abusive relationship with a creep of a man, and has a bit of a drinking problem - so I keep her emotionally a bit at arm's length. But I don't mind seeing her too much (which is about every 6 weeks), though I wouldn't really want it to be more often than that. I'd love for dh and the dc to spend more time with her though, though that is logistically difficult as MIL's horrible partner has banned dh from his childhood home (whole coach load of baggage there). 🙄

That said, it's actually my mum who is awful and we are NC with her. I rant about her on MN, but I can't imagine dh is on some equivalent forum ranting about his horrible MIL, because he'd rather talk about tractors.

AngeloMysterioso · 13/07/2023 12:46

But the thing that strikes me from most of the MIL threads is a sense of entitlement. If the OPs are accurate, some MILs seem to feel entitled to an equal amount of "GC time" as the DIL's parents, perhaps forgetting that the DIL is a human being too.

So mothers of boys should just suck it up and resign themselves to always being second best because they happened not to have daughters? Nice. Maybe DILs should remember their parents in law are human too.

And yet when you get women on here who are upset about only having sons because they wanted a daughter, there’ll be a pile on of people telling them there’s absolutely no difference in the relationship dynamic.

Good to know I can look forward to being kept at arms length when I have grandchildren no matter what kind of effort is made.

takealettermsjones · 13/07/2023 12:47

AngeloMysterioso · 13/07/2023 12:46

But the thing that strikes me from most of the MIL threads is a sense of entitlement. If the OPs are accurate, some MILs seem to feel entitled to an equal amount of "GC time" as the DIL's parents, perhaps forgetting that the DIL is a human being too.

So mothers of boys should just suck it up and resign themselves to always being second best because they happened not to have daughters? Nice. Maybe DILs should remember their parents in law are human too.

And yet when you get women on here who are upset about only having sons because they wanted a daughter, there’ll be a pile on of people telling them there’s absolutely no difference in the relationship dynamic.

Good to know I can look forward to being kept at arms length when I have grandchildren no matter what kind of effort is made.

...Did I say that? Any of it?

cruisingabout · 13/07/2023 12:49

I think ils (mil, fil, sil, bil all equally) need to know their place and not to force everyone to be a 'big happy family' if the young couple don't want to. everyone should be polite and respectful to each other ofc, but the ils need to stay away if the young couple want a separate life from them.

wholivesondrurylane · 13/07/2023 12:51

AngeloMysterioso · 13/07/2023 12:46

But the thing that strikes me from most of the MIL threads is a sense of entitlement. If the OPs are accurate, some MILs seem to feel entitled to an equal amount of "GC time" as the DIL's parents, perhaps forgetting that the DIL is a human being too.

So mothers of boys should just suck it up and resign themselves to always being second best because they happened not to have daughters? Nice. Maybe DILs should remember their parents in law are human too.

And yet when you get women on here who are upset about only having sons because they wanted a daughter, there’ll be a pile on of people telling them there’s absolutely no difference in the relationship dynamic.

Good to know I can look forward to being kept at arms length when I have grandchildren no matter what kind of effort is made.

see, you have the MIL from hell attitude right there.

resign themselves to always being second best
well yes, you can expect a child to be closer to their own mother. Work on your relationship with your own son!

Stop making it a competition. Not everything is about you.
Do you expect your teen son girlfriend to be as close to you as she is with her own mother too? That would be weird.

If you behave like a decent human being, and don't impose ridiculous expectations on your daughter-in-law, you will make life easier for everybody, yourself included.