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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder why women only want equality and not revenge?

314 replies

Kingcatnight · 04/07/2023 19:09

Admittedly at the end of my tether with men at the moment so possibly BU but honestly right now I'm really struggling to understand what the majority of men appear to have to offer the world that in any way compares to or competes with the (IMO generally superior) social graces, intellectual power, emotional maturity, problem-solving skills, creativity and overall increased pleasantness of women.

I've spent the past week on the road visiting clients, most of whom are white middle class men in their 50's, and having to feign amusement at various childish jokes involving innuendo (not aimed at me, thankfully) and basic, rudimentary word-play. Before anyone suggests it, these clients bring a lot of money into the business I work for so a frosty response or "calling them out on it" would be ill-advised and incredibly damaging to my employer (and me!) but ye gods I'm sick of the self-satisfied look on their smug faces while they wait expectantly for their pathetic jokes to land and for me to respond.

Spent an hour's train ride today sitting in a packed carriage opposite a man who snorted and cleared his sinuses the entire journey, forcing everyone around him to listen to the sound of the snot going down the back of his throat, all whilst reading the absolutely sickening news that the Taliban are further restricting the rights of women in Afghanistan by closing all hair salons. Hair salons which were already only operating after having spray-painted out any pictures showing female faces on their signage. Women in this country are literally no longer allowed a face, let alone access to basic care, education etc.

And at the other far more superficial end of the scale the past few men I've dated, having gone to great lengths to try and vet them carefully beforehand, have turned out to be self-absorbed, selfish lovers who have clearly always relied on the woman's verbal agility and efforts to carry the entire conversation, and who actually have no interest in women beyond having a captive audience for their own accomplishments.

Weekly I hear of various other male relatives, or husbands/partners of friends and colleagues who generally don't pull their weight and give themselves a massive pat on the back for simply being half-competent at their job whilst contributing very little to home life, while their female counterpart is expected to excel as an employee, mother, partner, sister, daughter, friend, neighbour etc.

I say this as someone who has a very generous, caring father, generally decent male siblings etc, so I am aware "not all men", but I genuinely look around me in amazement at the number of smart, warm, dynamic and impressive women in my life who vastly outweigh the equivalent men and on days like today I can't help but think men don't realise how lucky they are that women are still only striving for equality and haven't taken it upon ourselves to overthrow them entirely...

OP posts:
AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 04/07/2023 21:26

Don't buy the boring trope that "women have been equal or worse historically in the war mongering" stakes.
Not in the last couple of centuries they haven't. Since, you know, as a global community we seem to have become much more civilised in how we treat others, particularly the disadvantaged and marginalised.
Men (and by that I mean global leaders) don't seem to have caught up in that respect.

Witchcraftandhokum · 04/07/2023 21:27

Allmyghosts where did I say I was excusing anyone? I was simply pointing out that some women are horrible human beings. We're not all angels.

Losingmyusername · 04/07/2023 21:29

Watching The Power was quite nice in that respect. Imagine.

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:29

Nobody said they were, it's whataboutism. Talk about the subject at hand, by bringing "bad" women into it you are deflecting.

Spendonsend · 04/07/2023 21:30

This is all rather extreme and a bit surreal.

Witchcraftandhokum · 04/07/2023 21:31

Allmyghosts I'm really not, but you appear to know more about what I think than me so crack on.

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:31

Not particularly surreal tbh.

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:33

I'm going by what you say@Witchcraftandhokum . What else can I go by? If at any mention of male violence you bring up female violence, it's textbook whataboutism.

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:33

Talk about male violence. Do you think it is justified?

EddyF · 04/07/2023 21:34

DepartureLounge · 04/07/2023 19:38

I couldn't agree more. Men are well aware of it too, which is why misogyny exists. Fear and loathing. They know the only way to avoid being our serfs is to curtail our opportunities, undermine our confidence and, if all else fails, hurt us physically. What a shower they are for the most part. And NAMALT? Well, scratch the surface a bit more and actually they mostly are tbh. Colour me unimpressed at best.

I guess you could say this about racism. The global majority have suffered for centuries due to racism from white people. If they were to seek revenge rather than fight for equality, you would possibly be up in arms.

Meerkatdog · 04/07/2023 21:35

Reading this thread makes me despise women. eurgh! 'men bring nothing to the world' what a load of absolute tosh.
Giving a bad name to an all female forum, hope it doesn't end up in the daily fail.

Growingouttogether · 04/07/2023 21:36

Haven’t read the full thread but YANBU. Often wonder what a world would look like run by women.

WandaWonder · 04/07/2023 21:36

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:23

And? You are unconsciously excusing men completely because some bad women exist. Look into yourself and examine why You anyone criticising men uncomfortable?

Why is criticising women being uncomfortable?

Apart from anything else we see examples of it on here every day

There is both 'bad' men and women why is that a problem mentioning it?

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:37

Meerkatdog · 04/07/2023 21:35

Reading this thread makes me despise women. eurgh! 'men bring nothing to the world' what a load of absolute tosh.
Giving a bad name to an all female forum, hope it doesn't end up in the daily fail.

OK, didn't take much to make you despise women tbh, I have a feeling you were 99.9% there.

Witchcraftandhokum · 04/07/2023 21:38

I also never mentioned violence, but you want me to say things which fit into your carefully constructed, cool-girl fight for what you think is fair. You don't want to listen or even have a go at understanding that some people don't have the same world view as you. You're so stuck in a stereotype that when the world around you doesn't comply with your demands of it you go on the attack. You don't support any women (or indeed human beings) whose views don't comply with yours and then congratulate yourself for it.

Spendonsend · 04/07/2023 21:39

I think it is surreal. Revenge isnt that common as an aim for a movement.

We dont see revenge as the main motivator in post apartheid south africa, or in jewish populations post holocaust, ive not seen huge numbers of decendents of the slave trade seek revenge.

People talk about standing shoulder to shoulder and moving forward together.

Meerkatdog · 04/07/2023 21:39

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:37

OK, didn't take much to make you despise women tbh, I have a feeling you were 99.9% there.

You're probably right, I've recently spent too much time on Mumsnet.

Allmyghosts · 04/07/2023 21:39

WandaWonder · 04/07/2023 21:36

Why is criticising women being uncomfortable?

Apart from anything else we see examples of it on here every day

There is both 'bad' men and women why is that a problem mentioning it?

It's not uncomfortable, I have met loads of horrible women #ahem. Doesn't explain the fact men commit the great majority of all violent crime.

SwordToFlamethrower · 04/07/2023 21:43

My husband is a self declared misandrist. He hates men as a sex class and wants very much for there to be a matriarchy in place. He knows the world would be a better place.

We both want revenge on the men who have committed atrocities.

Liz1tummypain · 04/07/2023 21:44

Some women are catty and bitchy. Some men are cocky thugs. I couldn't say what proportions there are in all these camps. I choose to avoid the people I don't like, regardless of what's between their legs.

goldensky · 04/07/2023 21:47

yeah, you are not unreasonable. I don't date or hang out with any men anymore. They are so unevolved as a class. Some individuals OK but the vast vast majority are so disappointing. Im not sure if I want revenge but I would like to just be free of them if that could be in anyway possible.

whodawhodaeho · 04/07/2023 21:48

Tempting isn’t it??!! But all out civil war serves no-one…

Peppadog · 04/07/2023 21:50

Several studies have now shown that women are more aggressive online than men.
Aggression comes in many forms. Women and girls are more likely to use verbal and indirect aggression than males. We all know it, we all experienced it at school. There are positive and negative generalised traits to both sexes.

Fernbreeze · 04/07/2023 21:52

SwordToFlamethrower · 04/07/2023 21:43

My husband is a self declared misandrist. He hates men as a sex class and wants very much for there to be a matriarchy in place. He knows the world would be a better place.

We both want revenge on the men who have committed atrocities.

How about you read this, there are many more accounts of this you can freely look up. But I know you will not as it's easier to stick in your echo chamber bitching.

https://theconversation.com/why-its-important-to-see-women-as-capable-of-terrible-atrocities-149877

Why it's important to see women as capable ... of terrible atrocities

Women continue to be stereotyped as passive and meek. For this reason, international courts often let women war criminals off the hook.

https://theconversation.com/why-its-important-to-see-women-as-capable-of-terrible-atrocities-149877

Lentilweaver · 04/07/2023 21:53

Peppadog · 04/07/2023 21:50

Several studies have now shown that women are more aggressive online than men.
Aggression comes in many forms. Women and girls are more likely to use verbal and indirect aggression than males. We all know it, we all experienced it at school. There are positive and negative generalised traits to both sexes.

Will remember this next time I am walking in SE London late at night, and see a group of drunken men. At least they are less aggressive online!