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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder why women only want equality and not revenge?

314 replies

Kingcatnight · 04/07/2023 19:09

Admittedly at the end of my tether with men at the moment so possibly BU but honestly right now I'm really struggling to understand what the majority of men appear to have to offer the world that in any way compares to or competes with the (IMO generally superior) social graces, intellectual power, emotional maturity, problem-solving skills, creativity and overall increased pleasantness of women.

I've spent the past week on the road visiting clients, most of whom are white middle class men in their 50's, and having to feign amusement at various childish jokes involving innuendo (not aimed at me, thankfully) and basic, rudimentary word-play. Before anyone suggests it, these clients bring a lot of money into the business I work for so a frosty response or "calling them out on it" would be ill-advised and incredibly damaging to my employer (and me!) but ye gods I'm sick of the self-satisfied look on their smug faces while they wait expectantly for their pathetic jokes to land and for me to respond.

Spent an hour's train ride today sitting in a packed carriage opposite a man who snorted and cleared his sinuses the entire journey, forcing everyone around him to listen to the sound of the snot going down the back of his throat, all whilst reading the absolutely sickening news that the Taliban are further restricting the rights of women in Afghanistan by closing all hair salons. Hair salons which were already only operating after having spray-painted out any pictures showing female faces on their signage. Women in this country are literally no longer allowed a face, let alone access to basic care, education etc.

And at the other far more superficial end of the scale the past few men I've dated, having gone to great lengths to try and vet them carefully beforehand, have turned out to be self-absorbed, selfish lovers who have clearly always relied on the woman's verbal agility and efforts to carry the entire conversation, and who actually have no interest in women beyond having a captive audience for their own accomplishments.

Weekly I hear of various other male relatives, or husbands/partners of friends and colleagues who generally don't pull their weight and give themselves a massive pat on the back for simply being half-competent at their job whilst contributing very little to home life, while their female counterpart is expected to excel as an employee, mother, partner, sister, daughter, friend, neighbour etc.

I say this as someone who has a very generous, caring father, generally decent male siblings etc, so I am aware "not all men", but I genuinely look around me in amazement at the number of smart, warm, dynamic and impressive women in my life who vastly outweigh the equivalent men and on days like today I can't help but think men don't realise how lucky they are that women are still only striving for equality and haven't taken it upon ourselves to overthrow them entirely...

OP posts:
Brefugee · 05/07/2023 17:48

ASGIRC · 04/07/2023 21:02

Wow... Theres a LOT of man hating here... I guess it tracks with other things Ive read on this forum, but still... DAMN!

As for me, no, I dont want revenge. I want equality. I dont hate men, nor do I think they are all terrible. Or that all women are amazing.

this kind of thread (on mn) never fails to amaze me.
Do you think there are boards full of women hating incels saying "no, wait, some women are lovely"?

There is nothing approaching the level of hate against a sex on this thread than you get on, say, a Reddit thread about feminism. So - meh.

Nobody, not even on this thread, has made anything approaching the hateful comments against women on the internet on multiple sites multiple times a day.

why can't we have a thread where we outline the reasons we hate men without someone coming in telling us how hateful that is? when women have it exponentially worse whenever we stick our heads above the parapet. Etc etc etc

Itsdecisiontimeisitnot · 05/07/2023 17:52

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ASGIRC · 05/07/2023 17:56

Brefugee · 05/07/2023 17:48

this kind of thread (on mn) never fails to amaze me.
Do you think there are boards full of women hating incels saying "no, wait, some women are lovely"?

There is nothing approaching the level of hate against a sex on this thread than you get on, say, a Reddit thread about feminism. So - meh.

Nobody, not even on this thread, has made anything approaching the hateful comments against women on the internet on multiple sites multiple times a day.

why can't we have a thread where we outline the reasons we hate men without someone coming in telling us how hateful that is? when women have it exponentially worse whenever we stick our heads above the parapet. Etc etc etc

Because 2 wrongs dont make a right!

I didnt know this was a female incel equivalent forum, either. But I can see how wrong I was. My bad!

ASGIRC · 05/07/2023 17:58

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I know a lot more trans men than I do women! I know personally 4 trans men. Only 1 trans woman! So Im not sure your stats are entirely accurate.

VWFF · 05/07/2023 18:00

If you say anything nice about men you get accused of talking about My Nigel. So women being horrible to other women.

These men are bonkers on Reddit. Not all men are bonkers.

Itsdecisiontimeisitnot · 05/07/2023 18:13

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Meerkatdog · 05/07/2023 18:23

Brefugee · 05/07/2023 17:48

this kind of thread (on mn) never fails to amaze me.
Do you think there are boards full of women hating incels saying "no, wait, some women are lovely"?

There is nothing approaching the level of hate against a sex on this thread than you get on, say, a Reddit thread about feminism. So - meh.

Nobody, not even on this thread, has made anything approaching the hateful comments against women on the internet on multiple sites multiple times a day.

why can't we have a thread where we outline the reasons we hate men without someone coming in telling us how hateful that is? when women have it exponentially worse whenever we stick our heads above the parapet. Etc etc etc

I'm sorry but 'why can't we have a thread where we outline the reasons we hate men without someone coming on to tell us how hateful that is' 😂

So you want a thread where you can be as hateful as you like about a particular group (50% of the population in fact) and it to go totally unchallenged?
Let's not forget that this is a parenting forum, full of women (and some men) who have husbands, sons, boyfriends, friends that are men, that they love. It isn't all feminist man haters.

YouAreNotBatman · 05/07/2023 18:33

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Again, very strange.

But anyway, once more, everything is fine. I have no idea why you are harrassing me, such odd behaviour.

So since you are so concerned: I’m very happy, living a good life, I’m super healthy. Only thing bothering me has been your very strange comments, so I’ll ignore you from here on out.
Please leave alone.

Itsdecisiontimeisitnot · 05/07/2023 19:02

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Itsdecisiontimeisitnot · 05/07/2023 19:03

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bozzabollix · 05/07/2023 19:11

YANBU but so many women put up with incredibly low standards. These twatty men get away with it and those tolerant women will be reading this thinking about how great they are that they aren’t being difficult too.

It should be that if a bloke is a misogynist, manipulative, abusive piece of shit that no woman goes near him.

goldensky · 05/07/2023 19:15

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Jeez you are being well out of order. What's wrong with you? Leave her alone. Really creepy behaviour.

Meerkatdog · 05/07/2023 19:26

Just wondering what talk guideline was itsdecisiontimeisitnot breaking? Is it against the rules to bring up previous posts? I thought it was very harsh but didn't realise it was against the rules.

Brefugee · 05/07/2023 19:29

I actually don't care for huge sweeping generalisations (i'm not NAMALT at all, as a class men do loads of violence etc) and i deffo don't need to have a whole thread of dissing men

But since the entire internet seems to have a billion and a half such conversations about women, i wonder why there is so much "oh you MEAN MEAN girls!"

FrippEnos · 05/07/2023 20:08

Lentilweaver · 05/07/2023 08:07

Really? On another thread, a mum is complaining that an older man who is volunteering along with her 15-year-old daughter is harassing her and asking if she is a virgin. You think older women generally spend their time harassing young boys? Or they would love to, but just don't get the opportunity?

I cannot count the number of times DD has been harassed by predatory older men.

I have been on all women factory floors that have been just as bad as men.

erikbloodaxe · 05/07/2023 20:27

Are you one of the 'lovely women' OP?

WandaWonder · 06/07/2023 00:37

Brefugee · 05/07/2023 17:48

this kind of thread (on mn) never fails to amaze me.
Do you think there are boards full of women hating incels saying "no, wait, some women are lovely"?

There is nothing approaching the level of hate against a sex on this thread than you get on, say, a Reddit thread about feminism. So - meh.

Nobody, not even on this thread, has made anything approaching the hateful comments against women on the internet on multiple sites multiple times a day.

why can't we have a thread where we outline the reasons we hate men without someone coming in telling us how hateful that is? when women have it exponentially worse whenever we stick our heads above the parapet. Etc etc etc

"why can't we have a thread where we outline the reasons we hate men without someone coming in telling us how hateful that is?"

Ok change the word 'men' to 'black' , 'jews' , 'asians' , 'muslims' see where I am going here

ImustLearn2Cook · 06/07/2023 03:47

A pp earlier in the thread said the best revenge is for women to support each other.

A few other pp throughout the thread have pointed out that women can be quite nasty to one another. The rebuttal has been that being bitchy or nasty is no where near as bad as the level of violence perpetrated by men. True. However it misses the point.

Throughout my life I have seen countless times where women are attacked by other women. I remember a woman escaping domestic violence being bullied by not just one woman but a group of women. The nasty things that they said (including accusing her of deserving her husband’s abuse and he’s a lovely man, she pushed him to it etc) and nasty things they did when she was vulnerable was appalling. She was outnumbered by these vicious women. It broke her down. She left. I have no idea what ended up happening with her. Anyone who tried to intervene and stand up for her was viciously attacked in retaliation. Relational aggression.

(FWIW the abusive husband may have been charming and knew how to give the right impression to the right people but that doesn’t mean he wasn’t guilty of his abusive behaviour at home. It’s a tactic abusive people use where victims are not believed).

So, is this behaviour worse than physical assault, rape and murder? It’s beside the point.

Women tearing other women down, standing up for abusive men when they abuse some woman you don’t like, it adds to the problem!

We need to take a good hard look at ourselves and support each other better.

Support each other with comradeship, love, build each other up.

Not support each other to hate and seek revenge. That does not make us better people and it doesn’t solve our issues. It is a lazy, easy path that destroys us from within.

And no, we would not rule the world better if we achieved that leadership role through revenge.

Brefugee · 06/07/2023 06:33

WandaWonder · 06/07/2023 00:37

"why can't we have a thread where we outline the reasons we hate men without someone coming in telling us how hateful that is?"

Ok change the word 'men' to 'black' , 'jews' , 'asians' , 'muslims' see where I am going here

Where you're going is whataboutery.
Or did I miss black people, Jewish people or Muslim people oppressing all women for all eternity?

SideWonder · 06/07/2023 07:01

Totally with you @Kingcatnight

I tend to live my life pretty much without men. They cost us all. If I ruled the world - all men would pay an extra 1% tax to cover the costs of the harm and damage they do.

h1d1ng1npla1ns1ght · 06/07/2023 07:06

SideWonder · 06/07/2023 07:01

Totally with you @Kingcatnight

I tend to live my life pretty much without men. They cost us all. If I ruled the world - all men would pay an extra 1% tax to cover the costs of the harm and damage they do.

This is a great idea. I’d vote for you.

Meerkatdog · 06/07/2023 07:59

Brefugee · 06/07/2023 06:33

Where you're going is whataboutery.
Or did I miss black people, Jewish people or Muslim people oppressing all women for all eternity?

Can we start a thread being hateful about white people then? Or British people? Or Spanish people?

SamanthaCaine · 06/07/2023 08:15

TrishM80 · 05/07/2023 12:09

I think this thread is getting derailed somewhat. Let's not lose sight of the OP's original point. A random middle aged white bloke blew his nose on the train.

What an entitled bastard!

I know right. If there was ever a reason to want revenge on men, this is it.

Snotty nosed bastard.

SamanthaCaine · 06/07/2023 08:17

SideWonder · 06/07/2023 07:01

Totally with you @Kingcatnight

I tend to live my life pretty much without men. They cost us all. If I ruled the world - all men would pay an extra 1% tax to cover the costs of the harm and damage they do.

This is exactly why women are at the bottom of the pile and deservedly so.

BuffyTheCat · 06/07/2023 09:51

I don’t hate men, I just find most of them really tedious. The way they interrupt and talk over women, usually on topics they don’t know much about, just because they like the sound of their own voice and think they’re entitled to an audience. The fact fact that so many of them abandon their children. The fact that so many of them are violent to women and yet the rest of them have nothing to offer in terms of a solution. I think the majority of men, even the ‘nice’ ones, think they are superior to women.

If I could imagine revenge, it would be that they’d shut up 80% of the time, and put some thought and effort into solving the problems they, as a group, have caused. Maybe that’s consequences rather than revenge?