Loveless marriage VS commitment to family

[hoven]

AIBU to suggest that committing to stay in a marriage for your children is more important to show your children than showing them an 'example of a happy relationship'?

In marriages without abuse or toxicity of course

You know OP, you are putting an awful lot of energy into persuading yourself you are right and the majority of society is wrong.

This does make me think you are trying to persuade yourself, rather than you actually believe what you are saying.

As long as you take good care of your kids, married or not, they will be fine. They may appreciate you staying together, or they may not respect you for it - there’s simply no way of knowing that, so whatever you do, don’t base your decision of some hypothetical feeling you think your kids may have in 20 years.

And don’t waste your time arguing on the internet and convincing yourself you have the moral high ground. You need to live your actual life.

@hoven you keep parroting that “children come first” as if you were the only person to have thought of this.

But on further inspection it turns out your desire for another child is your real motive here.

It’s perfectly possible to separate in a way which prioritises the needs of your children. As plenty of people have pointed out here. The moral high ground is not reserved for people who doggedly cling to a miserable marriage like a rat to a sinking ship.

It is not ethical or sensible to sacrifice both yourself and your existing child to an unhappy relationship because you have some rigid idea that children need siblings. It’s incredibly selfish and self destructive.

Your beliefs are your beliefs and if you think staying in an unhappy relationship for your child is the right thing to do that’s one thing.

But remaining in a dysfunctional marriage to bring a second child into the mix takes it out of the realm of self defeating self denial and into the arena of doing exactly what you say you are trying to avoid: harming your existing child. If you do this you are in no position to insult the people you have asked for support by telling us that people only leave marriages for sex.

Your ethical position is highly questionable and you don’t get to make sanctimonious comments about people who divorce when your own actions are so profoundly self-centred.

This.

OP you have said such unpleasant, goady, judgemental things to and about other women who have posted trying to help you. You keep trying to justify the poor decision you're making if you like, but you don't need to be such a dick about it.

What's your marital situation?

Coming up to 20 years together; supportive, happy and still loving marriage with my high school sweetheart. But grew up in house with unhappily married parents, so if our relationship was to change, I know what would be best for us and our children, and they wouldn't necessarily be opposing options.

Why would that matter?

It’s clear you came here for some sort of kick. A need to prove that your choice makes you a better person and parent.

People who are happy with the choices they make, don’t do that. They don’t go seeking validation and certainly don’t seek to try and be superior to people who made a different choice.

You are staying because you dislike women who have kids to more than one man. But are desperate for another child. You know, deep down, this isn’t for your existing child. It’s for you. And you started a thread to tell people how you are making the right choice, they are wrong, how they must have put their sex life above their children and so and so forth.

That’s not the behaviour of someone confident they are doing the right thing for themselves or for their children.

And what would you do if when your child comes to you and said they had a miserable childhood because it was quite obvious you and their dad didn’t want to be in a marriage and should have split up?

Their childhood won't be miserable due to my lack of sex

Yea because that’s what the poster said. Yabu and you are being ridiculous

@hoven are you certain your DH shares the same views and will tolerate a sexless, unromantic relationship until your children grown? And if he does, that he won't change his mind?

I agree totally. And I think it's a shame when someone has to denigrate another person's actual lived experience to justify their own poor choices.

Many women leaving for sex, indeed! Sex may be a result of passion but passion doesn't always equal sex. Passion is a feeling born out of love. If for some reason my husband and I could no longer have sex I would still love him with the same passion that I do now. So when a woman says she is leaving because there's no 'passion' in their marriage, she's talking about the feeling not about sex.

Have at it @hoven . Just don't expect anyone to admire you for your decision to stay or for your children to bow down in gratitude. And I wonder what your husband's take on this is? Have you been honest with him? You're so anxious to proclaim the truth to us all but have you proclaimed it to him? Doesn't he have the right to decide whether or not he wants to live in a loveless marriage?

I'm 45 and my parents stayed together for us. There was no violence, arguements (not moreso than usual anyway),no abuse, shouting, nothing amiss. But I just knew they didn't love each other. I didn't see examples of love and happiness between a couple growing up, and that's caused some major issues for me. They're in their 70s now, and have strangely grown closer, but I so so wish they'd have separated and got divorced when I was a child. We'd have had less money, maybe not been able to afford to go to Uni, we'd have missed extended family occasions every now and again, but each of them would have had a chance at finding real happiness with someone else. It makes me so sad, I just think "What a waste of two lives".

I think it definitely means happier.

For me, yes. It would have been difficult with less money etc, but seeing either of my parents happy would have been so lovely.

My Dad had a female work colleague he got on very well with, and on weekends or in school holidays if my Mum was working she'd come for days out with us (no issue, my Mum knew all about these times) and my Dad was just a different person around her. He was just......happy. I remember being about 10-11ish and just really wishing more than anything they would have an affair so he could be happy.

Just my personal experience but my mum and dad tried staying in a unromantic marriage for the sake of their kids when I was younger. No abuse or anything like that - they just weren't into each other romantically anymore and didn't really talk to each other unless necessary.

I was only around 5 at the time and I don't even know how I knew, because they never shouted at each other or argued. It was more like the air in the house was thick with tension, they didn't sleep in the same room or hug or kiss or laugh together and even at 5 years old that made me feel uncomfortable. They both just seemed lifeless and like robots going through the motions and I could sense it. My dad would go out to work all night and when he was gone my mum seemed happier and less tense, so I would wish he didn't come back. Not because of anything he did - just because the tension and weird non-lovey dovey vibe made me feel like I was on eggshells all the time.

When they announced they were finally getting divorced, I was only about 6 or 7 and honestly I just thought thank god. My mum got remarried to someone she actually has a romantic connection with, and even though me and her new husband didn't really get along all of the time - I can see my mum is happy (even as a child) and would prefer that 10x over than her and my dad together.

Again, no abuse or shouting or actual major issues. It's just hard to explain the vibe that it has and obviously I presume my mum and dad were unaware of the atmosphere it caused.

Exactly my point. Them divorcing could have changed the whole trajectory of you life by you not being able to go uni, potentially living in poverty and with your dc also unable to go and even achieving home ownership. Not to mention extra curricular activities and cultural capital they will be missing out on. That's a lot for your children to give up in exchange for giving up a dull but not toxic relationship to try to gain passion and sex

We're there any financial implications or negatives effects on you living with a man you didn't get on with?

That is not what I said and you know it.

Either your reading comprehension is terrible, and not just from this post you have replied to but many others too, or you are here for a wind up.

Financial wise - no. They divorced amicably so it was fair/even and my 'standard/quality of living' remained in the same in the immediate aftermath in terms of type of home, school etc. If anything, as I got older my mum and her husband were better off so my standard of living went up in terms of living in a better area, better opportunities, better holidays etc. My dad actually ended up moving abroad (which he would not have done if he stayed with my mum as she didn't want to do this) so it was nice to have a second home overseas to visit. My dad remarried as well later on to a nice lady.

It's harder to say for certain whether me not always getting on with him had any negative effects - it was mostly things like disagreeing as a teenager about typical teenager things. If my mum and dad had of stayed together, I presume my dad would have lectured me about those things if he was there to witness it instead of my mums husband so the outcome would be the same regardless of who it came from, if this makes sense. I probably would have argued a lot more with my dad if he was there as much as my mums husband, but it's just because my mums husband was in the line of fire at the time that I say that now.

I think the only one thing I did notice was that when my mum and dad were together, I rarely spoke. I would hide in my bedroom with books because the atmosphere was just so off it was almost unbearable. Once they were divorced it was like a weight lifted and I could have a better relationship and speak to each of them properly when they were seperated, as I no longer had the lingering feeling something was wrong.

@hoven why are you so determined to think that life as a single parent will be so awful for children. My children have infinitely better lives than when their father and I were together.
For example today they are going to a family bbq with their dad. Unlike when we were together, he would see it as a party and down four beers, (as I would be there to be the sensible one) he now has to be responsible for them and is a better father because of it. I've been to lunch with my family and got housework done. Now they will have a less stressed out, more present mum at home as I'm up together with stuff and have had time for myself. Later when I pick them up I will stay in my in laws for a bit and have a chat. They see their parents actually interact with eachother in a natural, friendly way, rather than make digs or passive aggressive comments all the time.
As for 'grow up in poverty' well I did with a single mum and it was bloody lovely. Much better than my other friends with 'moody' dads or grumpy stepdads to tiptoe around. Better than seeing domestic abuse or worse. One of my friends remembers crying each night as she knew her dad was going to come home and quiz her mum on where she had been that day and what she'd been up to. My kids have none of that worry. I am theirs and no one else, full time, and we have such a laugh. Eating pizza in bed, kitchen discos, days out, playing mario kart, walking to the woods in the summer evenings. My life is better than anything I could have ever imagined, can't imagine many in shit marriages could say that.

Have you asked them?

@hoven yes. They said they don't like daddy and mummy arguing. They are much happier and doing better in school.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4240051/

Most posters are claiming their divorce was a success. The above study details the significant risks occurring after divorce including higher rates of teenage pregnancy, lack of upward financial mobility and decreased social and emotional maturity

How do you afford it in the current climate? Are housing costs low where you live? I'd like to do as you describe, but can't afford to.

@hoven you keep avoiding the question but I am really intrigued as to why you're so confident this is your decision alone, and that your DH will tolerate an unhappy marriage as long as you will?

His values mean he is committed to his family above everything