To not invite friend because of SEN child

[GameOverBoys]

I know I’m going to get roasted here so I will try to give all the information.
Myself and a few friends have been discussing getting a villa for a holiday next summer. There are 5 families all with children aged 6 to 13. We all went to uni together with another friend who has two boys. Her eldest (10 years old) is on the pathway and I feel fairly confident that he is neuro-diverse. Maybe autism or ADHD but has traits of both. So far, we haven’t invited her but now we are looking for villas we need to make a decision if we are going to or not. She is a lovely, sweet woman and we would have no question if it wasn’t for the impact on the group that her eldest has. He is not safe to be left unsupervised with the other kids. In the past there has been constant issues ranging from rough play, making threats and impulsive unsafe actions to punching and throwing things at the others.
He’s very bright, articulate and thoughtful boy and thrives on adult interaction. Away from other kids, I enjoy spending time with him a lot.
During play dates and get togethers we tend to take it in turns to supervise the kids and he is generally much better behaved when watched and any major danger can be stopped. It’s also easy to spot triggers like competitive games. He is also better when there are fewer kids. If we go to a villa (with a swimming pool) supervising him will be impossible and we want to have a break and just let the kids have a bit of freedom. The other children are all old enough and sensible enough to listen to instructions, such as you can’t go to the pool area.
His mother does her best but when she supervises him his behaviour is much worse for her. Her youngest is well behaved so I don’t feel it’s particularly bad parenting, just a stressed out single parent with few resources left to deal with a very hard to parent child. She also has a physical disability which can sometimes stop her being able to intervene. If he was my child I would take him for regular breaks, providing calming strategies, give clear boundaries and follow through but he isn’t and I can tell her how to parent.
I don’t think she realises how bad it is because this has always been her situation, but it’s constant. The group get on so well when he’s not there. There is no need to get involved, other than the occasional requests for food etc and it’s really relaxing. When he is there it is drama the entire time. I think he just doesn’t have the social skills to mix in a big group and he get’s overstimulated. However, I know my friend would be devastated if she thought they were being excluded.

YABU - You are being unreasonable to exclude someone because of SEN

YANBU - You are not being unreasonable to want a relaxing holiday and only invite who you want to

Just realise if you do this it will most likely irrevocably alter the friendship. So you need to decide what’s more important a group holiday or this friendship. As a mother of a ND child I could not maintain a friendship with so - called friends if they did this to me. I also wonder if you realise OP how many- multiple times ND children and their families are excluded it’s relentless and crushing

I can assure you she realises extremely painfully how bad things are.

Well you know she's going to be devastated when you don't invite her, so not sure what yo u want from this thread. Presumably you're all in agreement that her son isn't welcome.
Presumably this is only going to keep on happening as the kids get older and more independent and her son doesn't keep pace so perhaps it's better making the break now so she can find friends who can support her

btw it is normal in a group that some of the older ones start gravitating away from the kids towards the adults as they hit puberty. Just be mindful that things may shake out differently as they grow up. There's. phase where "the kids" are a gang together and can be supervised as a group, but they do move past that. If it doesn't work well this year, it doesn't mean it won't in future.

Surely it Is going to be chaos with that many people anyway it doesn't sound 1 bit relaxing so your friend and son would be in the chaotic mix, I think you will damage your friend ship if you don't invite them, I would be hurt if it was my family you were leaving out.

I think if you do this you’re basically removing her from the friendship group.
If I were her I’d never speak to any of you again.
I’m not even saying YABU as it sounds like a really difficult situation.

I imagine excluding someone because their child has SEN behaviours that they can’t help would be pretty hard to get over as a parent.

Another day, another thread of ableist bullshit.

It’s lonely enough being the parent of a child with additional needs, without your friends excluding you

If you know his triggers do something else with him.

TBH his behaviour doesn’t sound that different to lots of other children of that age (ASD or not), kids fall-out, fight, and can react before they think. I take it you are one of those parents whose children have never misbehaved.

so leave her out, let her find some new friends who’s are much much much less judgey than you and your “parenting strategies”

My (now 17 year old) ASD daughter was very much like this, luckily for me instead of excluding me, my family and friends realised thar my need for support was greater than their desire to be sat back with a glass of Prosecco.

Excluding your stressed out, single parent, physically disabled friend … and making it seem like you are the victim .. wow

If the other 10 adults plan a rota to focus on him, and the younger/older kids (whichever he feels more affinity with) - take them out for the morning, play football with them, play water polo, then each adult should in theory get five or six days of relaxation knowing the difficult kid is being looked after by someone else. Could that work?

I think you should invite her.

If it was just a few people having a restful holiday no would be ok but with loads of people including kids it's not going to be a relaxing style holiday anyway really.

He doesn't sound all that difficult tbh, and as you said the kids were old enough to be trusted with instructions then they are old enough to follow instructions like no competitive games.

I would be absolutely devastated if I was this lady and you left her out.

Well obviously it's a terrible dilemma and there doesn't appear to be a one-size-fits-all solution.
It's very sad that ND children are so often excluded but other children's safety must be paramount also.

Could she actually afford to go?

Oh gosh this sounds very tricky and awkward.
I have a difficult child and am aware that he changes the dynamics of a group he’s in and have started to decline invitations to things like this as the other children get easier with age and he gets more challenging.
Have you had conversations with her about his behaviour before or has it all been glossed over?

Unless he is physically violent, I would invite them and make it tactfully clear that this is a relaxing holiday and an opportunity for the children to swim and have some freedom unsupervised.

Then it is her choice - join you but know that she will be the only parent heavily supervising her child, or make an excuse because it will be too difficult.

Personally, I would rather be invited and make the choice myself than be excluded. You will also then be able to maintain the friendship even if she doesn't come.

I suppose you would be taking the chance that she might come and not be able to supervise him enough, or that there would be conflict between the children, but there are so many of you that this would be diluted and I would rather risk that that devastate her, end a friendship and show my kids that it's ok to exclude a friend in a tough position.

We aren’t all in agreement. There are one family that are particularly against inviting them. They have a Dd who has been injured by him in the past. He pushed her at the top of a climbing frame because she would get out of his way and she fell off.
Im on the side of inviting them to preserve the friendship and I feel so sad at the idea of him be excluded (he’s honestly the sweetest boy). Maybe we have to re-think the whole thing.

I’m going to go against the grain a bit here… Why should 5 families have their holiday ruined by a child who is described as dangerous. Why would you invite a child that’s “prone to lashing out and throwing things at people”. That’s not a safe or relaxing environment for your children.

If you go with everyone apart from her, I’d be surprised if your friendship lasts. But don’t put a friendship above your children’s safety/enjoyment

YANBU but it effectively comes down to you choosing between having the relaxing holiday or maintaining your friendship with this woman.

Unfortunately I don't think you can have both as she will be very hurt if you go without her.

So really you need to decide what is the most important to you and your other friends.

If you are going any way I think I’d have the awkward conversation. Your friendship will be altered anyway as she will be hurt, so you can at least attempt to mitigate it by having a conversation.

“we are thinking of … We all need a relaxing time and we’d love you to come but the trouble is, as much as we love x, it really won’t be relaxing for you or any of us if we take him. Is there any chance you could get someone to have him, or would you prefer to give it a miss this time? We’re really sorry and we know that’s a really horrible position to put you in, but we really do want an easy relaxing break this time.”

And hope she understands.

There's no way of not inviting her without causing massive hurt/destroying the friendship.

’Excluding your stressed out, single parent, physically disabled friend … and making it seem like you are the victim .. wow’

The above line from a previous poster sums it up perfectly

Surely you will be supervising the 6 year old!

She probably needs a holiday as well having to constantly deal with his issues

why not be a friend and invite her and take turns to supervise to allow her a rest as ell?

how do you think she is going to feel when she finds out you are all going and she hasn’t been invited

try putting yourselves in her shoes, or are you really not her friend?

She's not daft, she'll know why they haven't been invited if she's the only one of your group. Life is isolating enough as parent to a child with additional needs without your close friends leaving you out. Maybe approach her and ask if it's something she thinks he would cope with to start off. It might be that she says no and it's not even a problem.

So, you want to exclude your friend because her child has additional needs and you don’t want to look like the bad guy.

These two things are mutually exclusive.

Take a look in the mirror: this is what a shit friend looks like.

He pushed another child off a climbing frame and injured her? And the child he injured is going on the trip?

That’s a good idea to broach it by asking if it’s something he’d cope with.

YABU, but us SEN parents are used to it.

It's shit.