To intervene in DS's relationship?

[AlyssaHasAChaaaaild]

DS and his girlfriend are both 20. Met in 6th form and have dated ever since, now both at different Unis and keeping things going long distance.

She is from a strict religious background and made clear at the start there would be no sex before marriage. 2 years in they are being a bit physical but not even close to or considering having sex.

Her mum has got wind of this and is furious, and blames DS for "corrupting" her. There is no question around consent, it's just the religious principle that she can't accept that her daughter would do anything physical before marriage and so he is to blame.

Her mum has said the relationship can only continue if he agrees to go and have a sit down chat with her so she can explain why she is angry with him and set some ground rules. Girlfriend seems to agree this is a reasonable idea, DS is pretty horrified at the prospect but feels if he doesn't agree then the relationship will end.

I'm trying to bite my tongue because I know he adores her and I have seen how happy they are together. But FFS this seems insane to me and I want to tell him to run for the hills. I feel like even if he does this it's only a matter of time before the mum pipes up and interferes about something else.

TBH it's the girlfriend I'm most angry with as I feel like she has thrown him to the wolves and is letting this happen. I think she is a bit scared of her mum but that doesn't excuse her letting DS get painted as the bad guy.

But if I say this to DS am I being interfering too?

Equally, if his GF is lying to her Mum because she doesn't want to admit she was horny (putting it bluntly) then I don't blame OP's DS for not wanting a lecture.

OP, I would suggest to your DS that he gives the GF an option: that he will come and see her Mum on the condition that GF is honest with her Mum about her part in everything that's happened. And that he will also bring his Mum (you) so that everyone has someone with them.

I bet GF will trot out more emotional manipulation - I can't tell her/we won't be able to see each other/if you loved me you'd do this. In which case he should try and see this for what it is, which is the end of the road because his GF is more scared of her mother and will do anything, including blaming your DS, to keep the peace.

If my bf mother sat me down at 20 yo to discuss our sex life in the eyes of some make believe being I would laugh in her face

Are you the girlfriends mother? This whole situation is bizzare and her interference is wildly inappropriate, why are you trying to make out that it's all ok?

I think your son should listen to the mothers opinion, as his Gf has asked. From this conversation he will get a sense of what Gf has told her mother and if she is indeed “ throwing him under the bus “.

Then he should discuss it with his GF and see how she wants things to work going forward.

He should then take some time to consider if that’s what he wants . There’s no shame in ending it if he feels that he and his Gf are not compatible in these areas ( I mean sex and also the role of families / parents in couple relationships ).

Many kids who start dating in high school end up splitting up a few years down the line. When you are are school, everyone’s lives and lifestyles can seem pretty similar . But a few years down the line this changes.

Lots of people start to date someone from another religion or culture and imagine that they can change their partners beliefs . However these beliefs often get stronger and more influential as couples get married, have kids etc . Then the other complains because they don’t like / agree with their spouses beliefs -

“ I didn’t think they would take it that seriously / I thought she was only nominally Muslim / anarchist / woke / Wiccan / Tory / Scientologist / whatever “.

I'd intervene.

It really feels like he needs a voice of balance and reason in all the noise. And if my son had spoken with me about all this (I'm assuming you heard it all from him) then I'd feel comfortable having a follow-up chat.

Twenty is an adult but also quite young to be navigating the complexities of long-term relationships and bizarrely over-involved 'in-laws.'

So yes, I would want to remind him that the mother is not a girlfriend-by-proxy who gets to state the boundaries.

I'd also be tempted to invite the mother over to my house to give her Big Speech in front of me as well, but that's probably just shit-stirring.

I would just like to point out that he has also discussed it with third party since his mum knows how far they have gone so far....

It’s not a discussion about sex life because they’re not having sex.

I don't see how you intervening will help in any way.

Let him know you support him, GF's mother's standards are batshit very high in this day and age, but it's up to his GF what she wants to do.

Ultimately it's up to him if he wants to put up with that crap or not. Still very early days, but if he ends up marrying the GF he will be stuck with that religious crap forever - worth thinking about!

Genuinely horrified at the thought that some people think this is ok! I have no problem with the idea of no sex before marriage if that’s what both parties agree to and am fairly religious myself but I wouldn’t dream for a second of talking to my own adult children or their partners about their sex lives…because they’re ADULTS!!! They can make their own choices.

You don't mean this do you? Surely not! The OPs son isn't immature for not wanting to be sat down and told off by his girlfriends mother because they have differing beliefs, whilst his girlfriend sits there maintaining her innocence. That is demeaning and embarrassing, and putting his own boundaries in place is actually quite mature of him!

Lack of then, she wants to chat to tell him that he’s not to have sex with her dd until they’re married. Same difference, it’s their personal intimacy not the nutjob mother

If girlfriend had said........... a bit awkward I know, but mum wants to have a chat about our faith and sex and marriage. Can you hear her out and reassure her? ....... I think DS would have been horrified and bemused but maybe ok with it.

But the background of:
Mum's angry
Mum wants to sit you down and tell you how sex fits into our faith and what your obligations are
We can't see each other until you do this

This has made it into a really big drama and much more concerning

Sorry, what?! In order to have a sex life, you have to be having sex? Pure, raw sex… nothing else?

No I’m not. I also do not think asking for a conversation regarding their relationship and intentions for the future is interference. She might try to influence or interfere during the conversation, but to refuse to even sit and talk is bonkers. This is why families get so dysfunctional- the refusal to communicate, the petty “not your business” bullshit when whether their child’s heart is being broken or not is very much of their concern.

If he wants to go and talk to the mother I would definitely go with him if it were my son.

He's entitled to his own views and boundaries btw - he should view himself as an equal in the relationship and value himself as such.

I got thrown out of a religious education class for asking the psycho teacher who believed we were all destined for Jeremy Kyle and or hell, "if God doesn't want us to have sex, why do people enjoy orgasms so much?" Still waiting for a answer to this.

I think that religion is being used to control the DD here and she's probably been to an extent brainwashed by her mother's control.
This isn't about religion, not that I follow religion but I know plenty who do and they're not fannying around in their kids sex lives.

20 is a difficult age to navigate and all you can do realistically is be there and advise, but my inner mother bear is wanting you to go tear this woman from limb to limb and tell the kids to get themselves on love honey and start making up for lost time.

Genuinely horrified at the thought that some people think this is ok!

I am too.

Honestly Op best you can do is reassure him it's not normal and he can just not go.

If they break up now or cool it - they can always find each other later on when perhaps she slightly more independent of her mother - at 20 and at University she may feel more beholden due to parental support being needed.

Yes. If you have no sex life, you are not having sex.
Sex life refers to sex. It doesn’t refer to other parts of your life.

The girl needs to set her own boundaries, if she wants to stay within the rules of her religion she should do so. Her mother should have no need to speak to your son. If she feels your son will listen to her mother, when he won't listen to her, then she she is not ready to have a serious relationship.

I get that, OP. But ultimately, your ds is free to walk away from this shit if he chooses to. It's up to him.

With any luck, he might see that his girlfriend isn't ready to step away from her controlling mother just yet, and he will decide to walk away. But it has to be his decision.

it's not appropriate since the gf is 20

can you go along too?

Yes. If you have no sex life, you are not having sex.
They're not having sex. There's clearly some mutual touching going on though which has enraged the mother.

If he wants to go for the chat I would offer to go with him as he hasn't done anything wrong and her mum shouldn't be making him feel like he has. I would also have a big talk with your son about how sex is a big part of most relationships and is he willing to potentially marry into a family that has so many hard rules dictated by their faith as this will impact any future children etc. He's young and should be having fun, not worried about having a 'wife'.

But it isn't the mother's issue to communicate about. Sex and the choice to have sex or not is only about the two people potentially having sex. It is literally no one else's business. The conversation isn't about the 'relationship or intentions for the future' (not that that would be any more of the mother's business, that is also for the GF and OP's son to decide) - it's about having sex. Families where parents of adult children get angry and want to warn their child's partners about the theological consequences of sex are dysfunctional by definition.