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Original poster

“Pride is about identity not sex”

201 replies

Chocchops72 · 07/06/2023 06:21

“Pride is about identity not sex”

i just read this statement on a Twitter thread and it really caught my attention. Surely the whole point of Pride is (or was?) to demand / celebrate the right of gay people to have sex, legally, with other people of the same sex as themselves?

As a straight adult human female I don’t have much skin in this game, but this phrase just stood out for me as really weird. Isn’t sexuality - linked to one’s sex - the whole point? It’s like walking the walk, not just talking the talk.

I mean, if it’s true then I could ‘identify’ as a lesbian (not sure how) without ever actually having sex with a woman? But I’d be able to say I’m a lesbian? Am I understanding this correctly?

OP posts:
Sissynova · 07/06/2023 06:28

I mean, if it’s true then I could ‘identify’ as a lesbian (not sure how) without ever actually having sex with a woman?

Odd stance, would you say someone wasn’t straight because they hadn’t had sex yet for whatever reason?

GrammarTeacher · 07/06/2023 06:33

Yes what @Sissynova said. You wouldn't say that everyone is asexual until they move actually has sex. A bisexual in a relationship hasn't suddenly stopped being bisexual.

Withnailandeye · 07/06/2023 06:37

The statement makes sense to me - pride isn’t about sex I didn’t think?

Badbudgeter · 07/06/2023 06:44

I think pride is about sexual orientation for its LGB members but about identity for the rest of the alphabet soup.

Thats why the LGB alliance started up. People are unhappy with being lumped in with all the craziness, kinks etc. just because they are same sex attracted.

Original poster
Chocchops72 · 07/06/2023 06:49

So is sexual attraction / orientation part of ‘identity’? Whereas actually having a sexual relationship is separate?

i think I’m not very clear what ‘identity’ means in this context.

OP posts:
ArcticSkewer · 07/06/2023 06:51

Sissynova · 07/06/2023 06:28

I mean, if it’s true then I could ‘identify’ as a lesbian (not sure how) without ever actually having sex with a woman?

Odd stance, would you say someone wasn’t straight because they hadn’t had sex yet for whatever reason?

Is someone straight if they've never had sex?

How do they know?

Shoxfordian · 07/06/2023 06:53

It’s possible to have not had sex with a woman and know you have bisexual thoughts - for example or to identify as lesbian before you have sexual experiences. I completely get how it’s about to identify as you want; or not if you don’t want.

Simonjt · 07/06/2023 06:54

So until you had sex you weren’t straight?

The “how do you know if you haven’t had straight sex” is a very common homophobic trope, especially from homophobic men who can’t cope with the fact that some women aren’t attracted to men.

Sissynova · 07/06/2023 06:54

ArcticSkewer · 07/06/2023 06:51

Is someone straight if they've never had sex?

How do they know?

Show quote history

Do you have sex to find out whether they are gay or straight? A number of men and women hold off on having sex until they are in a long term committed relationship, or even marriage.
I assume they very much consider themselves straight before they have sex.
Do you not?
Are people in this weird in between if they haven’t had sex?

You don’t roll the dice and have sex to find out if you’re attracted to men or women.

jeaux90 · 07/06/2023 06:55

Sex is the key here, gender identity is a load of regressive nonsense.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 07/06/2023 06:55

Chocchops72 · 07/06/2023 06:49

So is sexual attraction / orientation part of ‘identity’? Whereas actually having a sexual relationship is separate?

i think I’m not very clear what ‘identity’ means in this context.

Nobody is clear because it doesn't make sense. The identity stuff leads directly to males with a trans identity who are sexually attracted to women claiming to be lesbians, and then attacking real lesbians, ie females, who exclude all males from their pool of potential partners as bigots and transphobes.

cuckyplunt · 07/06/2023 06:56

As straight people, maybe we don’t need to have an opinion?

BigHeartyTruffle · 07/06/2023 06:57

Pride is about so much more than sex. It’s about being able to fully express yourself in every aspect of your life, including who you love (and yes that involves sex). In this context I don’t think identity is referring to gender identity - I believe it’s about being true to yourself, and not having to hide any part of yourself.

GrammarTeacher · 07/06/2023 06:57

Of course it makes sense! You don't need to have had sex to know what your sexual orientation is!
It's such a heteronormative position to take! If you're straight how did you know you were before you had sex?

Original poster
Chocchops72 · 07/06/2023 06:59

Hmm.

So what’s the difference between “I identify as… “ and “I am…”? Are they the same?

I identify as gay /straight etc
or
I am gay / straight etc

OP posts:
Sissynova · 07/06/2023 06:59

BigHeartyTruffle · 07/06/2023 06:57

Pride is about so much more than sex. It’s about being able to fully express yourself in every aspect of your life, including who you love (and yes that involves sex). In this context I don’t think identity is referring to gender identity - I believe it’s about being true to yourself, and not having to hide any part of yourself.

I agree. Who you love is a huge part of your identity. I’ve no idea why anyone would claim otherwise. To reduce that concept to merely sex is quite demeaning imo.

I think some people are way to quick to find fault in everything because they are so obsessed with the tiny percentage of people who are trans.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 07/06/2023 06:59

And that's before we even start on people who identify as a different age/ethnicity or as having a disability while being able-bodied, or as a furry. All a long way from the original Gay Rights movement.

AlisonDonut · 07/06/2023 07:00

The men whipping other men dressed in bondage I saw yesterday at a 'Pride' march would suggest not.

I'd say it looks like 'kink' to me.

ArcticSkewer · 07/06/2023 07:00

GrammarTeacher · 07/06/2023 06:57

Of course it makes sense! You don't need to have had sex to know what your sexual orientation is!
It's such a heteronormative position to take! If you're straight how did you know you were before you had sex?

Dunno, I didn't know I was bi til I tried sex with women. How would anyone know til they try? I'd assume the 'liking it' part would be a clue.

Sissynova · 07/06/2023 07:00

Chocchops72 · 07/06/2023 06:59

Hmm.

So what’s the difference between “I identify as… “ and “I am…”? Are they the same?

I identify as gay /straight etc
or
I am gay / straight etc

Can I ask why it bothers you so much? Does it impact you differently depending on how someone phrases something?

PinkFrogss · 07/06/2023 07:01

You know gay and bisexual people experience romantic connections and have crushes etc just the same way as straight people right? It’s not just about sex.

Are you solely attracted to women and only want to be in relationships with women, but you just haven’t had sex with one OP? Because in that case you probably are a lesbian.

Do you think people just don’t have a sexuality until they have sex? Confused

ArcticSkewer · 07/06/2023 07:01

I absolutely just see my sex life as sex. It's such a 'last 100 years' thing to see it as part of your identity

NC202 · 07/06/2023 07:07

BigHeartyTruffle · 07/06/2023 06:57

Pride is about so much more than sex. It’s about being able to fully express yourself in every aspect of your life, including who you love (and yes that involves sex). In this context I don’t think identity is referring to gender identity - I believe it’s about being true to yourself, and not having to hide any part of yourself.

This! I'll be going to pride with my son, who has two mums. He's going to see other families that are similar to his, and there will be a storyteller reading stories where the family set ups aren't just a mum and a dad, or a prince doesn't end up with a princess. And maybe we'll bump into some of our straight friends again with their children, because they think it's important that they celebrate all types of family.

AliceInTheMoon · 07/06/2023 07:09

I'm a lesbian and didn't have sex with a woman until my very late 30's. I was always a lesbian though, I wasn't something else just because I hadn't yet experienced sex with a woman. There was no doubt, no waiting until I tried it. It was the same as knowing I was a woman, an indisputable fact. Not restricted to having sex or not.

loislovesstewie · 07/06/2023 07:13

I know that I am not a lesbian because I have never felt sexually attracted to women. I don't need to try having sex with a woman to know that. The same way I always knew I was straight because I only find men sexually attractive. I didn't need to have sex with one to find that out. The same way I know that I don't want to try BDSM or lots of other sexual practices. It doesn't interest /attract me so I don't try it.