Children's intelligence level

[unsuresue2]

I'm going to be totally honest here- at the risk of sounding very snobby but can't shake a feeling of real disappointment for my kids.
It's obvious to me that my kids are middle of the road in their class for maths and really struggling with literacy, understandable as both diagnosed with dyslexia- however their general IQ / CAT scores are also mid range (literacy really low against this) and my older child will start GCSE work soon and it's clear he will struggle to keep up.
I have been getting all help I can, fortunate position where I can afford tutors etc
But I find it really sad for them and a constant worry for me, that their educational attainment is an accurate predictor for their success in later life.
I have always been in the higher end IQ, loved school and got really good marks that allowed for uni education and professional qualifications- and I am fully aware of the privileged position that put me in- with good job and high earnings I enjoy today- I just don't see my kids being able to attain anywhere near that educational success, and I really worry for them that life will be a struggle.
They have loads of wonderful qualities- sporty (not premier league/ Olympics) kind and funny, great emotional intelligence etc.
I love them unconditionally, goes without saying, but I just want the very best for them and can't seem to shake this feeling that their intelligence markers are not predicting great futures.
Please help me with some perspective/ similar experiences

I have a PhD as does DH, we earn reasonably well. My DB trained as a plumber and learned to fit some very complex stuff that all the footballers and Oligarchs seem to want in their mega mansions. DB is now a multi-millionaire himself with a very large group of employees. He got 4 GCSEs

I can empathise with this. If you are an intellectually minded person and your values lie in education and learning, you are of course going to feel a bit let down to find out your kids just don't have the natural aptitude needed to succeed on this path. However, there are many other routes to having a fulfilling life and a good career. I think the stories about working your way up from intern to CEO are a bit overblown and not particularly relevant in the modern world of work, but there are vocational jobs and skilled trades which are very much in demand. I went to a private school and now I'm a homeowner, I wish I knew a few more plumbers, electricians and plasterers and fewer stockbrokers, recruitment consultants and PhDs!

For the record, my husband and I both have IQs that put us in the "genius" range and whilst we do OK and are very happy in our lives, no-one would be describing either of us as great successes due to the fact we are both quite lazy, have little to no interest in career or money and have to navigate all the barriers that ADHD puts up too.

Over the years I've been managed by some very well paid and happy people who needed things drawn on a whiteboard to follow a logical argument, couldn't punctuate, couldn't think originally... well you get the idea. Intellectual capability is not necessarily directly related to success at work. There are other skills that people can acquire to compensate; if that's really what they want.

I got great marks at school and was always winning awards. I’m now earning around £50k and feel chronically unsure of myself at work. My husband has dyslexia, and barely scraped past school, he has a job he loves and earns £100k. I think it’s his work ethic and drive that makes the difference, it’s definitely not all about grades.

@unsuresue2 I would comment - have lots to say on this situation, and much in sympathy. But until you feedback on the now hundreds of comments cant be bothered. Is this for an article?

Work ethic, drive… Being male …

Speaking as a conventional academic high flyer, I can tell you that career success is predicated far more on self-belief, resilience, an ability to communicate effectively in person and to be companionable and empathetic (and not in the grip of voices telling you how badly you did and how useless you are). You can give them all of these things. My parents brought me up to link my whole personality to my academic prowess, and to rate myself based on the approval of others. Similarly, my husband internally rates himself based on how many external ‘success’ markers he has, compared with people he went to school/university with. He can’t help himself. Don’t be that parent who burdens your children with inner demons around academic and career success.

Hi all
I have been reading all your comments slowly and taking them all in- I wrote this at a particularly low mood / point the other day, but honestly has been a niggle in the back of my mind for few years now - and all your responses are really helping me unpick where this feeling is coming from, the conditioning I was brought up with, where my academic abilities were painted as setting me someway superior/ ahead of others (by my mum)
She wasn't a bad person as such, def a bit of a snob, but only wanted the best for me and really championed women's rights back in the 70/80's- so can't bring myself to be mad at her- but your very considered comments reminds me I need to break the cycle !
I am very logical usually and would be the first to remind others that my kid's happiness is of course my top priority- and it genuinely is, especially when I know what it's like to have low spells myself, but I wrote this when I just found the constant effort with school work particularly exhausting, and some really not great results from school, and I was wishing for it just to come easier to my kids- as it had for me.
That's only why I am sad for them
Not at all disappointed- I'm so proud of them - and love them so much- was just doing that totally wrong comparison to their cousins for example- who fly through academia- where I can spot snide remarks etc coming from them to my kids
I constantly try to focus on their strong points and voicing here what my subconscious thinks is only the time I have spoke about it- apart from some times with my husband- their dad- who is a prime example of what you are saying (not great results) but really successful in business- so I and they have a great example from him- I guess I need to take a back seat and loosen the reins a bit.
To those who I have angered with kids with serious health problems or learning difficulties- I apologise sincerely- it really was not my intention to hurt.

your original question though doesn’t really even compute in my mind that you’d even wish it?

I mean you’ve got two kids who I take it have use of all of their limbs? Never suffered a tragic loss with your kids? Or disabilities etc?

@unsuresue2 Degrees are so two a penny these days- But skilled craft trades are in high demand.
A Surgeon was bemoaning the lack of practical skills in his students- It takes dexterity and good hand coordination to do various surgeries- He said students are definitely lacking in craft skills

I found that very interesting.

I agree intelligence and academic ability can make the road to success easier. However in all honesty most people I know who are financially successful and living fulfilling lives never went to university. My husband failed all his GCSEs and has dyslexia and dyscalculia but runs a very successful property business.
my brother left school at 14 and works in construction and earns more then the prime minister. These are just 2 examples.
Its about common sense and drive. It’s not always about tests scores and certificates.
I also know plenty who were top of the class getting A*s who went onto uni and now just work boring office jobs on £45k a year which isn’t a bad salary but it’s not amazing life changing sums of money and they’ll never be able to retire at 50 and go live in the Bahamas.

I did so well in school, think majority A* and A grades throughout GCSE and A Level. Told I would go far by all my teachers. Went to a Russel group uni and did well... have subsequently turned out to have an incredibly mediocre career. I am, however, happy with my lot in life and have done well enough.

Intelligence is absolutely not everything, try not to worry. Your kids will find their way.

Read that in an Ivy university they started asking those doing medical course if they play an instrument, do arts and crafts, woodwork or sewing when younger. If not they have to show an example of cross stitch art due to lack of practical skills at younger age meant they would find it harder for their fingers coordination.

Meh, I really wouldn't be worrying about this. I think middle of the road intelligence is almost ideal. They will be able to get decent enough grades with enough hard work and be able to get into almost any career of their choosing.
Some of the most intelligent people I know have really struggled with life. My brother is a maths genius and he has never been able to apply himself to the world of work.
The most successful people I know tend to have other skills, confidence, social skills, good communicators etc along with ambition and drive.

Please can I ask what your DH does? My DD15 is dyslexic and probably has ADHD, and we are struggling to find suitable career options for her. She's really personable and bright but never going to do an office paperwork job requiring attention to detail. Keen to explore all options.....

The best things a child can be are happy, reasonably confident, kind and generally of a positive personality.
High levels of intelligence arent actually necessary and can in fact be a sad burden. You sound like you were very lucky in being a naturally intelligent child but also having those other qualities I listed as important. This is a rare combination.
Honestly all I want from my kids is that they are decent human beings who have a positive outlook on life and can give and receive joy.
I was a gifted child.. thought to be very intelligent... it has given me some positive things in adulthood but actually just made a lot of my childhood very difficult and sad. It certainly hasn't brought me wealth or career success altho in terms of my interest in life in general I find my education personally valuable.
My husband is the opposite in that he didn't peak till his late teens... he learnt to talk and read late and was pretty much thought of as slightly below average as a child.
He is the successful one with the masters degree and the career in our marriage.
I had a breakdown after getting 5 A levels at A and refused to go to university... left home, did drugs and occasionally slept rough.. for about 10 years before I managed to sort things out for myself a bit.
This is an extreme example but I'm just telling it to show that wishing your child was academically gifted isn't always wise.. your children sound fine and like they will have happy lives.
My youngest is clearly not academic in any way but she is such a funny, vibrant and joyful girl.. I'm sure she is going to do just great in life tbh.

You need to readjust your thinking.

I had a friend who had 7 kids. 5 of them got high marks in everything and did fine, but two of them - twins in fact - left school early and opened their own joke shop. Even though one of them died tragically young, the shop was a huge success.

The Weasleys?

Firstly Im dyslexic, i also work in education,

Dyslexia is a superpower, a Dyslexic mind works in exactly the same way as the minds of great geniuses infact most of the greats are Dyslexic.

Its thpughtbthat 40 to 60% of sucessful people are dyslexic, including billionaires Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, and Sir Richard Branson.

Dyslexics are also highly employable because of the following natural talents:

They can utilize the brain’s ability to alter and create perceptions (the primary ability).
They are highly aware of the environment.
They are more curious than average.
They think mainly in pictures instead of words.
They are highly intuitive and insightful.
They think and perceive multi-dimensionally (using all the senses).
They can experience thought as reality.
They have vivid imaginations.

Please please look up the positives of Dyslexia and celebrate those, champion Dyslexic ways of learning. Its not a disability its an ability, an ability to do things diffrently.

And let's face it, some of the most educated people I have ever met (professors and such) are often the most unintelligent people on the planet. Good at regurgitation of facts but have no idea how to function in the real world.

A qualification is just a bit of paper.

It's fabulous that you know where this pressure to succeed academically has come from and as a dyslexic myself with a son (7) who is too. You haven't offended me. You have every right to voice your concerns as its bothering you. It's not on that people will throw the "healthy child" card at you because this issue is bothering you.

Just want to add that we know where you are coming from with family. Our son struggles with school so we don't pressurise him, we don't make him do his homework at all costs we are very relaxed about education because we know you can learn at any time but you only get one shot at childhood.

However we have close relations that have chosen private education and champions academic study. It could bother us that our children may not hit Oxbridge or get a PHD or learn Latin and play Lacrosse amd we are reminded of it regularly through remarks.

We have a completely diffrent attitude to schooling and our children will have a completely diffrent education to their cousins and remarks will always be there but as long as you and the children know they are brilliant for being them regardless of grades then you will have done a first class job.

We also have to walk past the private school to get to our primary school so we see the students in their posh uniform. Our boys have asked if the students are better than them or more intelligent and we make jokes that "they have to pay 6k to go to school and we can spend it on a holiday as our school is free . . so who's the cleverest" they think its funny and it stops the feelings of inadequacy.

There will always be academic snobbery and you've realised that the way you were brought up doesn't fit your own children. That's ace.

Celebrate their uniqueness.

I always scored high on iq type tests in school, I was and still am quite intelligent. However I also have adhd , only diagnosed in my 30s and because of this I have done absolutely nothing with my intelligence, I can't. So being smart isn't everything , some of the most successful people I know were middle of the road in terms of intelligence but hard working and determined. Some of the smartest people I know struggle their way through life.

I personally always prefer the analogy I saw on primary board by a teacher there - that dyslexia is like a drag on a sail.

You'll still move and get to destination but it takes more energy.

I was a tortoise - a plodder and my kids have been the same - putting in work long term while really tough when young has got us on - slow step by step.

I haven't set the word on fire but I've carved out a decent standard of living and did well educationally. My sibling who has no issues and always found school easy has actually done much less well academically and my kids - who really struggled by not diagnosed - have done better than many who flew at earlier ages and who parents made very snide comments to us.

If they find a path that suits them they'll be doing better than many others in life.

@Horatiosmum please please look up some of the broader range of opinions available about 'Neurodiversity as superpower' and understand the offence you might unthinkingly be causing.

And let's face it, some of the most educated people I have ever met (professors and such) are often the most unintelligent people on the planet. Good at regurgitation of facts but have no idea how to function in the real world.

Have you any idea of the number of ND people you are insulting by that comment? These very academic, educated individuals are likely to include a high proportion with ASD, ADHD and other forms of neurodiversity. So it's a pretty rubbish state of affairs if we can only big up dyslexia by attacking ASD.

Why do you bother to work in education if a qualification is just a bit of paper signifying an unintelligent regurgitator unsuited to life in the real world?

Intrestingly my other son and husband have ASD.

HOWEVER. This post and my response was about Dyslexia and nowhere did I say that superpowers are exclusive and i wasnt talking about neurodiversity. My other son and husband have their own ASD superpowers but that's not what we came here to help the OP with. So let's not make it about ASD. We are flying the Dyslexic flag here.

Also my experience of Academics is that they are very clever people and very very good at accademic tasks but not very good at practical things, where as I am shocking at Accademia but I am very very practical so the OP was saying her family equate Accademia with success in life where as I'm saying they are not as intelligent as you think. REGARDLESS of what else they have going on. Again it's not about neurodiversity. It's about giving the OP a diffrent view.

As to my view of education, you have misunderstood. Education can open doors but it has to be the right kind of education for the right learner.

thats why I "bother" working in education, because though out my whole life I was the one that was told they are useless, would never be any good at anything let alone education. So I proved them wrong as young people need to see that academic skills are not the only thing you need in life. You can be absolutely shocking at reading and spelling but it doesn't mean you haven't got the talent inside.

I'm not going to look up neurodiversity as a superpower for this thread as that's not what we are talking about here. It's Dyslexia and how Dyslexia is a superpower.

I don’t care to how many people of whatever flavour of neurodiversity you ascribe ‘superpowers’ - that doesn’t make it better. It’s not a superpower. It’s just being a human being in all of its variety and strength and fragility.

The superpower rhetoric is especially damaging to mothers like the OP. What if her child isn’t the next genius entrepreneur? Did he fail at his ‘superpower’ as well as at ‘normal life’ and ‘academics’? Of course not but that’s what the rhetoric implies.

OPs children sound great and I am sure they will thrive.