Contacting school about male teacher

[Slidingdowntherainbow]

My child goes to a preschool attached to a primary school. The Head is always on the gate each morning welcoming children (and parents) in the gates, we see her every morning.

The other day, I went to collect my child earlier than usual and walked past the playing field as usual, it's on the way to the preschool.

It was a hot day and the Head, along with another female colleague, was sitting on a grass bank watching the children and I know they saw this as they laughed.

A male teacher was walking along the playing field with each hand squeezing two girls shoulders. So he was between them, with a hand on each of their outside shoulders, seemingly squeezing. The girls were giggling and the the Head laughed. Not that I think it matters as he shouldn't be touching them at all, but it wasn't a quick squeeze, he was more resting his hands there for a good 30 seconds I'd say.

Anyway, it may be nothing, but it made me feel very uncomfortable. 1) it's inappropriate to touch a pupil for no good reason 2) he gives me the ick anyway, he's a big presence and I sometimes see him when dropping my child off and I just don't like his demeanor, not sure why.

Do I report this? My child won't be going to this school so I'm not worried about that. More that the Head actually saw this with her own eyes and laughed, so I suspect will be defensive. I then have to walk past her daily, potentially for the next two years. Unfortunately I can't report anonymously as I was the only person walking past at this time.

I'm not suggesting anything more than this has happened, but isn't this a slippery slope? Should a teacher (especially male), be touching pupils necks?

Would appreciate opinions please!

LMAO that's 80% of the site these days

Are you seriously saying that parents of 3 year olds don't want their children touched by the staff who are acting in loco parentis dealing with upset and injury?

Teachers aren't veritable strangers...

They are with the kids hours upon hours. More time awake than with the parents.

Its more that as males they know they'd be more at risk of false accusations if they dared go near a student.

You wouldn't have thought twice about the situation had it been a female.

At a show thing last year at the school (aged 8ish) one of the kids got upset/stage fright. The teacher took them to one side and reassured them, giving them a hug when they were crying. This is entirely appropriate and guess what, no one complained. I am deliberately leaving out genders as it shouldn't change a thing, but I suspect for the OP is driven somewhat by this and the subsequent judgement made on the teacher in question.

It is ok for a trusted adult - which any teaching staff should be - to lay a hand on a pupil, especially if the child is upset and needing reassurance. The OP situation does not sound concerning to me, and there appears to be no grounds to report this. As the quoted poster and many others have said they spend so much time with our children one would expect a certain level of contact from time to time.

Safe guarding concerns over someone who she has never met and who is full of themselves and gives her the ick is as unhinged as any lynch mob. Yes report legitimate concerns, but this is potentially a witch hunt by the unhinged = lynch mob.

I was concerned until I saw "especially male" and "he gives me the ick".

So many male teachers lose their jobs or give up because they can't take people assuming they must be a paedophile to work with children.

He was in the presence of the Head and another teacher. It doesn't sound like he was doing anything inappropriate either. Less than KS2 and sometimes physical contact is the appropriate thing - for a child who's done badly at something or just fallen over.

Wow. I have no problem with this whatsoever and would not care if it was my kid. If it made the girls uncomfortable they’d have had tense posture not laughing. Just because you don’t like someone isn’t a good reason to destroy them - and an accusation will shatter the man regardless of if any action is taken.

I had a gropey art teacher in high school - it was totally different from what you describe, he would make all the girls tense and uncomfortable as he sat behind us to guide our hands on the clay or paintbrush… the guy you describe just sounds like a big personality that is popular with the kids and likely just guiding them along towards wherever they were supposed to be.

What is concerning is the lack of consensus from people who say they have relevant experience in schools, social work etc. It seems that there is a wide variation in safeguarding policies and practices.

Regardless of what happened here - and none of us know - people's comments show how easy it might be for a teacher to find an environment where they could start to begin grooming children.

LaGiaconda
Safeguarding is fairly clear. If anyone has a safeguarding concern then it should be reported and there's policies to follow. If there's low level concerns then that also should be reported in line with the low level concerns policy.

It's possible for any adult involved with children to groom. That's why we have low level reporting. Most of us involved in safeguarding children have put safeguarding reports in on the grounds of "it might be nothing, but X,Y,Z doesn't seem quite right to me knowing the child/staff/parents".

The question really in this thread is whether (taking out the OP personality judgements of someone she hasn't met) seeing a member of staff touch some pupils' shoulders in front of the head teacher would meet the threshold to report, and most people here are saying not.

Had the OP's thread been something like this:
I volunteer in the school and have seen Mr Blogs regularly 1-1 with a pupil and report a low level concern because some of the physical contact seems more than I'd expect. For example... or when I've been picking up my child, I've noticed Mr Blogs used more physical contact with a small group of pupils. I just wanted to mention it as a parent as it seemed unusual for one group to be treated so differently".
Then the thread would probably be unanimously saying to report it.

But obviously as I've said up thread, if the OP genuinely believes there is a safeguarding concern then she should report what she saw factually.

I think my point would be the 'hiding in plain sight' thing. It's a bit like the rape myths. (Strangers jumping out in the dark = bad. Mary's nice kind husband who helped me when the car wouldn't start = good.)

Yes, the OP has very limited insider knowledge. But this can also provide a clarity which is not apparent to those who have been groomed.

So, if we look at a Savile clip where he has got his arm round a nervously giggling 15 year old, we - in retrospect - know something was wrong. For those who saw him involved in lots charitable fundraising, helping children to 'Fix It' etc, they really, genuinely didn't.

So, I think relative lack of knowledge doesn't mean you shouldn't report. You should.

I have reported a teacher who I didn't know. I was in a local street and the teacher was haranguing at a young child, who looked - frankly - scared. The child may have been behaving badly and repeatedly. It was possible that they had done something genuinely risky. But I didn't like what I saw and contacted the school. The headteacher thanked me for having done so.

I think the fact that you viewed it as inappropriate and uncomfortable is enough for you to bring it up with the school. For peace of mind and also to bring to the forefront that prolonged touching (or in fact any touching if not justified ) is not really appropriate. No one but the teacher/student knows the reason for this shoulder touching.
I wonder why the head found this situation funny as well?

I’ve worked in education and safeguarding for many years, and the guidance is to make any physical communication safe and appropriate, with awareness of individual children’s/young people’s potential preferences. The head teacher may have been laughing at anything, perhaps in their conversation with the colleague, and could separately have been privately observing and perhaps planning on a conversation about the subject with her team. You don’t know anything else at all. Except perhaps a need to reflect on your own reaction to this observation. It’s good to be safe and aware, but can be very harmful indeed to see problems where there are none.

LaGiaconda
I do see your point, but would disagree that what OP observed across a field is comparable.

Thinking about my own work, I know I'm on the more detached side of staff. I have great, positive relationships with students but I'm not very jokey. Some of my colleagues are more familiar with students, but it's still within the umbrella of professional conduct. We just have different personal lines within what's professionally acceptable.

In the past I have raised concerns about over-familiarity between staff and students and would do so again in a heartbeat because that's my duty. I wouldn't see a colleague joking with students on the field on duty and report them as a safeguarding concern though because I'm not there, don't know what's going on and objectively from my position looking on "I personally wouldn't do that" isn't grounds to say someone is a safeguarding risk.

If I went around reporting every member of staff who was more familiar than I prefer, but still within professionally acceptable, I'd be unreasonable.
That's why I think the OP needs to objectively establish what the concern is.

I work in a primary school and the children are always touching and trying to hug me, hold my hands! It’s natural for them.
Also our male teacher has had quite a few complaints from parents for nothing…. I feel sorry for him and he’s getting fed up. It’s just because he’s a young man!

It’s just because he’s a young man!

I think you should take it more seriously if there have been ‘quite a few complaints’. One or two? Maybe nothing. Quite a few and you should escalate.

They are all about random things- not touching related. Silly complaints.

Are you giving him a free pass to be crap at his job because he is a bloke then? It’s not unheard of for men to be fawned over for doing less that the bare minimum expected of women.

I absolutely see where you are coming from, but he’s done wonders for some of the kids, especially some of the boys with behaviour issues! And kids love him. So no.
Just “little Jonny didn’t receive his homework, you are singling him out!” Kind of thing over and over Etc etc

He’s a young black, male teacher so great to have in the profession.

I’m so glad the majority of answers are in agreement with my thoughts. I had an awful moment thinking maybe she had a point, then I shook myself and thought Wtaf are you going on about.

@LolaSmiles I agree with this. Everyone should report things they are uncomfortable with in a non hysterical way as you describe. The issue with the OP is she is being emotional, using conjecture and asked for opinions when she really didn't want anyone's opinion unless they agreed. She should raise the issue calmly using the way you describe and then step out.

I think it’s no “greater” to have a young black male than it is an ‘old, white female’.

Be good at your job. No free passes for being crap based on your sex, race or age.

No smoke without fire eh

And it’s not unheard of for people to not like male teachers for no reason other than they are men.