To think Dh should be able to do bedtimes without me being called up

[Themegapintthingisback]

We have a Dd, 4, we alternate bedtimes, Dd needs us to lie with her for a bit after stories etc, until she falls asleep.
A couple of times a week, there’s some kind of incident and Dd starts crying and wants me, I then come up and lie with her of have to take over. I’m more patient than Dh and he often loses patience with her and tries to hurry her etc/gets cross.
She’s had a slight temp and fever nightmares this week and understandably is nervous to sleep. She’s needed a lot of reassurance and has slept with us all night, which is fine.
Tonight was Dh’s bedtime, I hear Dd crying again and Dh telling her not to be silly, Dd was saying how the shadows of the light shade was scaring her etc, she started to cry badly for me and wouldn’t go to sleep without me. I stayed upstairs with her until she fell asleep (Dh stayed too)
Aibu to expect Dh to be able to to bedtimes and be gentler with Dd
and to just do better, without her always wanting me, or is this normal?

Talking about her say, any worries, reconnecting after a day apart while she’s at preschool and he’s at work. Bedtime is usually when DD expresses her worries about something. No one wants bedtime to take up the whole evening but equally it’s a lovely part of the day and a chance for her to see her dad.

We do bath, PJs and pull-up, milk and three stories, teeth, then sit with her as she drifts off – which is when she mumbles her secrets and we find out what’s going on at preschool or her anxiety over school starting soon, etc. She’s still asleep by 7.15/7.30, it’s not a chore. The only nights it is are when we try to rush it – I suspect OP’s kid senses the rushing/rejection/frustration and is responding to that.

You have 2 choices, either you do every bedtime or you do a mixture of both. To do the latter you have to leave him to it. 4 is too big to need you to lie down with them and I say that as a mum of two kids that were awful sleepers (3rd is a dream). My eldest got into this habit aged 2 when she got into a big girl bed. In 6 months we had dealt with it by laying down in her room moving progressively away. It was a slow process but it got to a point where she could sleep without relying on one person to be right next to her. I agree that now isn't the right time if she is feeling under the weather but you do need to try something or you put up with it.

If you want to go down the route of gentle parenting that's absolutely fine but you need your dh to be on the same page, it won't work otherwise as she's getting mixed signals from the both of you. At age 4 she isn't a baby anymore, she'll always be your baby of course but if ypu want your evenings back thos needs to be worked on.

I think his mood and lack of patience maybe to do with mum not the child the teaching a child you need a mummy/daddy teddy bear isn't the best but mummy won't change it she loves it and wants that cuddle so daddy must go along little one must never cry wether it's bed time or anytime mummy says she's tiered so can get out of anything by saying I'm too tired. It's a nightmare daddy gets in the neck for trying to change he must always be waiting to be told off

This.

And it’s not acceptable to just lose patience with a child constantly, especially at bedtime.

I think some mnetters who have never lived with a man whose very early reflex is anger don’t realise how damaging it is. You can’t just leave them to their “style” of parenting as it’s not a valid alternative style.

I don’t know what the answer is for you though Op - if he’s stubbornly unable to do a nice clam bedtime by himself without either giving up (meaning you have to step in and don’t get a break) or losing his temper.

So many excuses for a bad-tempered man with poor emotional regulation who thinks it is OK to be irritated with and behave aggressively to his small, scared child.

I see if from both sides. If you're more lenient with her, then she will naturally not do as she's told. You let it slide, whilst your husband gets irritated by it. Instead of this being a 'which parent is in the wrong' scenario, you would both probably find life easier if you set boundaries with your daughter. If she doesn't do as she's asked/won't stop faffing on the bathroom at bedtime/won't listen, then agree with your husband that she'll get a warning (count of 3 for example) and then a consequence if she doesn't listen/do.as she's told. I can see why your partner gets irritated, your daughter doesn't want to listen, and you're quite happy for her not to. He then becomes 'the bad guy'.

In terms of not being able to fall asleep on her own, that's personal choice, but it needs to be agreed upon by both parents. Your husband clearly isn't happy with the arrangement (can't say I blame him), and it's not working for you because you don't get your evening downtime. Again, it's about setting out expectations for your child. Sticker chart/reward system for falling asleep on her own, talking about her fears and nightmares, and making her feel better during the day, asking her what would make her feel more comfortable or safe at night (lamp on, listening to music or audiobook etc).

You say parenting is hard, but ironically, you dont seem to want to put in the work/understanding so that you and your husband are parenting in harmony and giving your daughter independence at night time. Obviously, if she's ill or woken up, having a nightmare, routines, and expectations change, but you need to tell her that so she can expect to go back to independence at bedtime.

So if your child won't stop playing with their toys or get into bed what do you do just watch them play until they decide it's bed time? ....which with this little one will be when her mummy teddy bear comes up and kicks dad out.

@EveSix Your post made a lot of sense, thank you

Try to talk as a couple and find a middle ground. Children do get tired and struggle at times, laying in bad with them every night until asleep is going to cause a frustration if one parent doesn't want to do that.

Probably you need to understand that she is 4 not a baby, so needs boundaries so that the other parent doesn't feel so frustrated when not listening/making a mess/wanting to be cuddled until asleep - and he needs to understand she is 4 not a teenager, so will need some comfort and patience.

I'd probably suggest you both agreeing on a bedtime routine that you are both happy with which is positive but which may result in some unhappiness from her. Teeth, book, big hug and kiss, nightlight which maybe changes colours and you say is magical and will keep her safe, leave the room. Pop back in bed without talking if she leaves room - not in a negative way, picked up gently and calmly and returned to bed..

I veer towards being quite soft in my parenting style but work 10 hour days a lot of days and if I had the prospect of laying in bed next to my 4 year old until he fell asleep I'd feel uptight and dread putting him to bed, so I think it's worth breaking that habit, or if it's a habit you are happy to continue then maybe you just own the bedtimes and daddy does something with her for a half hour before bed while you have some time?

Because all kids are different and some just need some extra comfort/security at night to help them feel calm enough to go to sleep? Jesus she's 4 not 14!

There is no correct way to parent.

Four is old to still have a parent lying with then until the child goes to sleep

You need to decide if you are going to actually let him be a parent and make decisions about how his child is raised.

Or whether he's your employee who can only do things your way.

If you want himto parent then at bedtime you need yo leave the house and let him do it. Go for a walk, fins a yoga class, go to the supermarket but for a month do not be in thr house on his bedtime.

Allow him to work out what works for him

OP,

This is not a good situation.

He is an angry bad tempered man and your child is becoming confused and nervous of him, with good reason.

He has zero patience.

He is a big angry man and she has now recognised that she is not safe with him.

You are shoring up real problems going forward if this continues.

Do not get pregnant again with this man.

He is deeply critical and unkind to a small child and yet is surprised the same child is now backing away from him.

If this continues, she sounds like a child who might mention that Daddy is very angry at me.

Anyone who hears that, will report it.

Parenting is not easy, parents get frustrated, but this is all the time and all his interactions with her.

You have a real problem.

Personally I wouldn't trust him around your daughter.

Stop him doing the bed times, because he is damaging your child.

In your place, I would furious that he is behaving like this and I would be rethinking the relationship.

His behaviour will not improve if you allow it to continue.

This behaviour is not normal.

Men like him make children nervy and anxious and that will stay with them.

You are 100% correct to be very unhappy with this.

Protect your child from him.

Not sure if this will be helpful but...

DS is 4. At 3 3/4 we had enough of lying there until he fell asleep (also had nightmares). He learnt that if he cried (we are talking big over the top crying) he would get more attention and that we would run straight to him and he would be absolutely fine as long as we were in the room. So we stopped it.

Now we weren't radical, we moved to sit on a chair by the door, he could still see us but it wasn't a physical touch. Did he like it no he didn't, did he get up and down and cry, yes he did. But we were right there he wasn't alone. It took a few days but he got used to it.

Then we moved to sit just out of sight on the landing. Again did he like it no, did he cry yes but again we were literally right there the whole time. If he got up we said mummy/daddy is right here go sleep now. Again it took a few days and he got used to it.

Then we moved to sit in our room, same as above. He was able to get to us and if he did we took him back to bed etc.

Now we put him to bed and go downstairs. We leave an audiobook playing which he enjoys and if he needs us he finds us but most of the time we hear him moving about well before he tries to find us.

We are so much better for it and actually DS nightmares have stopped and he now sleeps through the night because he has learnt to self settle.

I think you need to nip this in the bud now, your DD knows if she cried and acts upset mummy will run in and sleep with her and you need to show her whilst you/daddy will be right there she needs to settle herself.

I cuddle mine to sleep and she's 7... I don't really mind though. She's my only child and I'm not having any more so I might as well enjoy it while it lasts fromy perspective. She won't want this type of comfort forever. Why would I want to make her go to sleep upset if she doesn't have to?

It's up to you if you want to stay with her while she falls asleep or not. It sounds like you just want your DH to be less impatient with her though and be able to comfort her himself. He sounds like he just gives up. I'd go out so I wasn't around and it will force him to do the bedtime properly and DD to get used to his bedtimes.

Well firstly I speak to my child like a person who deserves respect, and I say please put the toy down and get into bed. And if that doesn’t work I say please give me the toy and get into bed now otherwise there’ll be no screen time tomorrow. As a last resort I will actually remove the toy, but not by rudely snatching it.

I do not at any point scream, yell, get angry or rip the toy out of DC’s hands. That would be unacceptable behaviour and setting a bad example. There are ways to parent which are calm and respectful, there is never any need for anger or violence.

He's making a difficult situation worse. He's expecting a 4 year old to have the maturity to understand he's had a difficult day, whilst not having the maturity himself to recognise he needs to be patient with his DD. I wonder if he's doing on purpose so he needs to get you involved and can blame you. I'd not have any more children with this man and I can understand your concern about how this affects your DD.

@Speermint I understand completely, similar situation

How would you remove a toy without prizing it from their hands if they refuse to let go of the toy/hold on to it even more tightly because they know you want to take it away?

Your over reaching

@SwitchDiver the child might know that mum isn't home, but that won't necessarily mean they then just settle fine for dad if he never does bedtime.

I think you're clearly missing my point.

At no point have I said the OP is wrong in what she does, but I don't think it's fair to override her husband doing bedtime and then complain that she has to get involved.
They need to find a compromise that suits them all with regards to the bedtime routine.

My DH went through a stage recently of just going to play with our dd after I had told her off or said not to do something and he would give in to her. All that taught her was that she didn't need to listen to me as daddy would say yes or overrule me.
We chatted about it and managed to get to a point where whoever is dealing with DD's tantrum or misbehaving, deals with it and that is respected by the other parent in front of the child. If the other parent doesn't agree or feels it has been too harsh, we discuss it away from dd

Talk to them about handing it over. A child is a human being. You can’t snatch things from them just because they’re a child. A outstretched hand and a firm request of “give me the toy please” generally works. If not then there’s a consequence such as not going to soft play, and usually the mere threat of the consequence is enough for them to hand it over. There is literally never any reason to snatch or yell. You’re supposed to be the adult.

I love the combo on this thread of “there’s no right way to parent, he has his way” but also “OP, you’re doing it wrong” plus bonus “four is too old to need this” – says who? Four is little. There’s just turned four and there’s nearly five; there’s precocious four year olds and babyish ones. There’s four year olds that need their parents’ company to fall asleep and it’s not a problem, ones who need it and it is a problem, ones who don’t need it.

As op was downstairs how does she know he didn't do all the asking nicely being calm etc all she knows is child started crying and said daddy had taken the toy as her, in the other example she says he asked mummy over rode by saying baby is too tired everyone is ignoring him. Did she say he screamed I thought he said stop being silly which if she's not doing as she's told is being silly. The child is 4 and knows how to play her parents and mum wants the cuddles and to be lovely kind mummy .....4 year olds play the game they cry if they don't get their own way it s sent hurt them or mean they love you less but it's a hell of a lot easier having a 4 year old learn rules are rules than being called into school for a 6 year old having a melt down because finally someone is saying this is the way it is.
Why is there this assumption that mummy's way is the only way and daddy must lay down and do it mummy's way......we all wake up through the night but we self settle this little one hasn't learned that wakes up scared as the parent teddy bear isn't there and starts screaming

@Speermint you obviously haven't dealt with a strong willed child who will cling onto said toy or insert other object here like it's the only thing keeping him alive.

Sometimes a firm pull out of his hand is all that works. That being said I don't scream and shout but if he's in one of his moods a well you won't go to soft play does nothing as he doesn't want soft play he wants to play with his toy!

You are not being unreasonable, if your DH doesn’t think the bedtime routine is working he can come up with some ideas and make a plan for changing it. That would involve chatting to you about it, talking to your daughter, making a new plan etc - not sabotaging the current agreed bedtime routine.

I think it’s fine to lie with your child until they sleep, assuming it works for the family - whatever routine you have needs to work for the family and you need to keep an eye on whether it’s still working for your child, my daughter around that age was actually being kept awake by us being there as she knew we’d leave once she was asleep so we had to change it up. Gently, slowly, in a kind and supportive way and we got to a new routine. I think that’s worth keeping in mind but absolutely until then your DH should be able to stick to the current routine without getting cross with a 4 year old.