To think Dh should be able to do bedtimes without me being called up

[Themegapintthingisback]

We have a Dd, 4, we alternate bedtimes, Dd needs us to lie with her for a bit after stories etc, until she falls asleep.
A couple of times a week, there’s some kind of incident and Dd starts crying and wants me, I then come up and lie with her of have to take over. I’m more patient than Dh and he often loses patience with her and tries to hurry her etc/gets cross.
She’s had a slight temp and fever nightmares this week and understandably is nervous to sleep. She’s needed a lot of reassurance and has slept with us all night, which is fine.
Tonight was Dh’s bedtime, I hear Dd crying again and Dh telling her not to be silly, Dd was saying how the shadows of the light shade was scaring her etc, she started to cry badly for me and wouldn’t go to sleep without me. I stayed upstairs with her until she fell asleep (Dh stayed too)
Aibu to expect Dh to be able to to bedtimes and be gentler with Dd
and to just do better, without her always wanting me, or is this normal?

Bloody hell @Speermint do you undermine your partner like that all the time?

It’s up to you but your DD does not “need” you ti lie with her til she falls asleep. I am always astounded people get themselves into these ridiculous situations. Can’t use a babysitter. Can’t go out occasionally.

Change to gradual withdrawal where you sit next to her on floor gentle hand on her, the. After a few days none then over days moving across room. After a week you will be at the door then out of the room. Both do the same and stop undermining him....children learn how to up the anti to get you there.

You are right OP in that he needs to take a breath and be a bit more patient.

Equally, he is not unreasonable to find it frustrating that he has to lie with her till she falls asleep.

Parenting is hard and it's often difficult to work out when a child is genuinely anxious/in need of support and when they're simply playing up and just mucking about. The problem is it's a fine line between being patient/nurturing/loving and being overly permissive/allowing a small child to rule the roost.

And another problem is that many DC don't just 'grow out of it'. I have several friends who still have to stay with secondary school age DC until they fall asleep.

It sounds as if you and DH both need to compromise a bit and accept that there needs to be a middle ground.

He can do it your way but chooses not to, he has no patience for a poorly 4-year-old and expects her to fall in line.
He doesn't see her all day by the sounds of it and then makes a pigs ear of the small amount he does have with her, did he even want a child?

I would not be having more children with him and I'd probably take over all bedtimes but not be cooking him dinner or washing so he can still have something to do rather than chill out earlier.

Completely normal. Most children want their mums.
at 4 she should be encouraged to settle on her own so maybe taking a more firm approach is needed. If you want to share the putting to bed then you have to let him do it his way.
Bedtimes should/would be no big deal at 4 if you were firmer anyway.

She will still want it for the next 4 or more years even as bed time gets later

The child will be alright in an emergency. They know when one parent is away.

I don’t think this is all on him. Your DD is expressing what she wants. You are constantly undermining him and showing DD that dad can’t do it alone.

@Speermint Exactly!
Dh will say to her he’s tired, he’s had a long day, this means nothing to a 4 year old and yes it’s tiring, yes we all have long days, but parent! Use other techniques than losing your patience and shouting etc, I hate it. I get we’re all human, I’ve lost my patience before of course, but he does it much more when there’s no need at all.
He just gets at her more, I don’t think he understands she’s only 4 and isn’t being *Naughty
Today, supposedly a relaxing Sunday, we were watching films on the sofa and having dinner there, he’s constantly saying to her to keep still, not move etc or getting angry if she knocks something over or drops it, she’s 4! She’s a fantastic girl, who sits really well when we’re out etc, it’s Sunday, we’re relaxing, she’s tired because of nights of bad dreams, just leave her alone, pisses me off. He adores her and is a nice man, but his technique is too harsh in my eyes and I’m sick of saying it to him.
Today, a few toys on the floor and her shoes there, I ask her if she can put her shoes away, she always does it and is great at it, he wades in with that if she doesn’t put her stuff away, he will and it will go in the bin, wtf. She was so tired and lay on me, he ended up moving them later and she looked worried and asked him where he’d put them, she was genuinely upset he’d thrown her Frozen shoes away. It’s like he can’t think of other ways to parent, using positive ways for example, always negative, no well done for doing this or that. Sorry for the rant but I don’t know where to go from here, I feel really strongly about the way I want her brought up. She’s started to say she only wants mummy etc and it’s upsetting him, so why can’t he see and change his ways

Why do you talk to her if she's up in her room? Your feeding it and undermining him every time you get involved....the daddy's turn is what you say when it's time for her to go up...goodnight sweetheart daddy's bed time....then it's story and whatever you've agreed....ideally not in her bed and not talking to her after the first lay back down.

That’s a bit of a drip feed. All the parenting techniques are things you should be talking to him about in private when DD isn’t around. But not in a ‘don’t do this’ type of way but ‘how should we handle this?, I was thinking….or DD responds well to….” Type of way. You can’t just hand her off like a hot potato.

You are creating her need for you at bedtime by not teaching her to fall asleep on her own and running to her every time she calls. To get annoyed with your DH about a problem you are creating is massively unreasonable. Your DH is very understandably frustrated at a unnecessarily lengthy and drawn out bedtime. It doesn't need to be like that.

You should also try to listen to your DH and not dictate how he should parent. He has views too on parenting. He is also her parent and his views should also be considered. You don't get to dictate. You need to discuss and find a middle ground.

@SwitchDiver not if her mum does bedtime every single night and stays with her until she falls asleep.
Then for some reason mum isn't there at bedtime, so dad has to do it, he's not happy with how bedtime goes anyway and the child always wants her mum.

You think a 4 year old child will settle fine?

Well, that's a drip feed and a half 🙄

you need to realise that your partner has as much right to parent your child in a way he wants as you do. You sound incredibly undermining to him and, as you say he is a loving a caring father, if you did leave because you disagree with his parenting technique then this would only continue when you aren’t there for his contact anyway. You need to step back at and work together without just thinking you are in the right. Everyone loses their patience when not always necessary. Unfortunately it’s easy to do when tired and I’m sure even you have done it. We are all trying our best and can’t be the perfect, most gentle parent at all times

It may also have been helpful to remind your DC to stop messing around with his toys and get into bed when he’s told to, then his father wouldn’t have to remove his toys. Important to show a united front to DC.

I know so. 4 is old enough to know a parent isn’t home.

She only wants mummy because mummy is softer....she didn't put her shoes away why not you come in shoes off and away but you gave the message okay come cuddle ignoring what he had asked her to do....it's undermining and says mummy makes the rules if you don't agree with it bring it up when she's not around as it is you say quickly pop them away and we can have that cuddle....or give her a nap.

@Themegapintthingisback

She doesn't need it.

But it sounds like you really dislike your oh.

You are completely incompatible as parents.

It won't end well.

By the way you say she always put things away when asked.....she was asked and didn't, he threatens she still didn't then later he put things away and she looked scared he would throw them out.....so she ignored both of you didn't do it ....and now he's undermined himself by not doing what he said and thrown them out....never threaten what you won't do.....and you undermined both of you be carrying on cuddling effectively saying don't do it.

I don’t think it’s ever acceptable to snatch a toy from a child, even if they are messing around. Or snatch anything from anyone for that matter. I don’t think it’s ever acceptable to yell or speak disrespectfully to someone, even if they’re a child. I’m never going to “show a united front” if that means supporting DH when he’s displaying the sort of behaviour that I’ve taught DC is wrong and naughty. DH needs to be the adult and model respectable behaviour, not yell and snatch and make DC cry.

Lying with children until they fall asleep shouldn’t be necessary every single night. Of course, if they’re going through a bad patch, where they have additional emotional needs, they should be met.

My DD was the same - she wouldn’t go to sleep unless someone was with her.

DH didn’t think it was necessary and wasn’t prepared to do it. So I always did it. Although I knew in my head that he was right, in my heart, I didn’t want to leave her to get upset at bed time, so I did all the lying with her. Which I categorically did not enjoy, but I couldn’t not do it.

I think you have to take the same approach.

Your DH is perfectly entitled to think it’s not necessary, and not be prepared to do it. If you think, as I did, that it is necessary, then it falls on you to do it.

I got so sick of it, that I had to start weaning her off it. Because DH was right - it really isn’t necessary, and being able to self-soothe and fall asleep on one’s own is something children need to learn to do.

So I would do stories and have a cuddle and then I’d tell her I was popping out to [insert activity] and would come back in 5 mins to check on her, and would keep doing that until she fell asleep. It eventually worked, and I got my evenings back.

Neither of you are being unreasonable. So if he’s not prepared to do it, and you think it’s necessary, then it falls to you. And if, like me, you’re completely worn down by it, then work out ways to phase it out!

Good luck.

you need to realise that your partner has as much right to parent your child in a way he wants as you do
His right to “parent in a way he wants” ends at the point where he’s doing naughty things that DC has been taught not to do, or being unkind and making DC cry. I don’t have to stand by and let him make DC cry just because that’s how he wants to parent. What utter tosh. Next you’ll be saying I should stand by and allow him to smack if that’s how he wants to parent.

OP I totally understand, he doesn’t have to parent in the same way as you but it’s reasonable to expect him to show a basic standard of decency and kindness.

She was asked to put her things away, which she's really good at but she didn't do it. You gave in and gave her a cuddle but your DH is wrong for getting annoyed.
You can still be a nice parent without giving in all the time.
If you don't leave your DH to it, you'll never know if his bedtime routine works better and that means no engaging with your daughter.
I'd also concentrate on getting your DD to go to sleep on her own. There is no guarantee she'll give it up on her own.
You have options to get your evening back. Let DH do bedtime on his own, get your DD to sleep by herself but you don't really seem interested. Seems you just want to moan about DH and expect him to do what you want. He's her parent too. Let him do things his own way.