Am I the female equivalent of a cocklodger?

[Allwelcone]

I have 3 kids, 12, 14 and 15, with DH, and 1 from b4 who has left home. My "career" is crap due to time out for childcare, mutually agreed with dh.

I used to have a proper ft job before kids but since then and leaving London ive never worked ft and my salary has been dire, but I do only want to work for "jobs-with-meaning" so salary suffers. I went back to work as soon as youngest was in reception. I usually have worked 2.5-4 days a week.

I have a job interview tomorrow but the hours are miniscule (half time) and it's worrying DH as we are so overdrawn.

Now i have a 4-day pw charity job i do not enjoy at all, wrong skillset, chaotic managent, boss giving off signals that doesn't want me around (neg comments and I still havnt got passed probation for 9 months) so I do need to change.
But am I being lazy for not going ft? Am I being really inconsiderate? Dh hasn't said anything. I'm worried I'm being selfish. Our home could do with someone there, the kids need input and ferrying.

Whats my standing in the mumsnet arena?

@FormerlyPathologicallyHappy No one person can cure everything. Better to think of yourself as a piece of a big jigsaw

I don't think you sound like a cocklodger but you are deluded. Lots of us have large fanilies and both work. It doesn't sound like your fanily can afford the luxury of part time worthy work.

but I do only want to work for "jobs-with-meaning" so salary suffers

With so many DC, YANBU to work only p-t, but your insistence on only a job with meaning IS unreasonable.

You have the luxury of this kind of choice because your DH earns well. Does he have a “job with meaning” ?

Thats what’s unreasonable and you needto acknowledge the potential stress on your DH. You don’t seem to realise the burden of being the worker whose earnings are crucial.

@Allwelcone

also, stop being a “juicy loudmouth”
That’s not good or professional for ANY kind of job

Are you being flippant and self deprecating to disguise your insecurity? Reads like that.
I'd also get rid of the dogwalker and get the teens to do the walking.

@NeedToChangeName A jigsaw that is never completed. For every patient I helped or child sex group my relative surveilled there’s dozens more out there unchecked. We both left realising it’s a hopeless cause.

@Allwelcone, the charities that “helped” dh when he was dying were very obviously polishing their halos & I despised them for it. I wouldn’t give money to macmillan or Marie curie now if I had a gun to my head. They’re not guaranteed a gold star of god either when the time comes. Service users will tell you you’ve helped when you haven’t just to get out of there. I used to see it all the time years ago with orthopaedic patients, the surgeon would make it worse and the patients just wanted to be discharged.

I don't think you are a cocklodger, but I do think that your kids are old enough for you to work full time and you have an equal responsibility for the family finances. Obvisouly that will impact the kids to some extent so it's a family decision, but equally I don't think it's fair to expect the man to shoulder the entire or most of financial burden just for the fact he is a man.

The Civil Service is a broad church though! Lots of roles and opportunity to develop within it with flexible opportunities. It’s not all Yes Minister although I appreciate the public perception is that. The interview format is something you can rehearse for. CS is a good option for many. I’ve found the problem with ‘jobs-with-meaning’ is that it is usually taken to mean ‘low-paid-labour-usually-for-women’ but with top salaries for the few men at the top of the pyramid.
what about a session with a careers advisor?

@FormerlyPathologicallyHappy My approach would be that some people's lives will be better because you were involved. You can't fix everything, but I don't think that means it was hopeless. Sorry you feel that way

Lots of people do jobs they don't like to keep their family financially stable.
Could you get a second job. If you don't have much skills jobs like in shops and cleaning are always on offer near us (might not be near you) and they seem to offer training and flexible shifts.
I admire the sentiment of working for meaning but I think providing for your family comes first.

I think this is a terribly defeatist way of looking at things.

I can think of nurses and doctors and a teacher who have all made a genuine difference to my life. The way they handled something, the things they said, absolutely made things better for me at difficult times, or improved my ability to deal with and cope with things.

Yes they can't fix the whole world, but in those moments they fixed my world

Sorry if it has already been said, but what about your pension? You have at least 15 years if working life left. Don't you want to up your pension?
Also it won't get any easier to find a well paid job with a good pension as you get older.
Thirdly, teenagers and young adults need lots of financial support. Help at Uni, help with house deposits. In my experience young adults need more financial input from parents, not less.

In my experience young adults need more financial input from parents, not less.

God, yes. Gone are the days when they moved out by 22 or so. The way things are, they will all be boomeranging back.

If you are overdrawn, then you need to work. And with the goal of bringing in enough money to ease the financial strain.

My approach would be that some people's lives will be better because you were involved.

@NeedToChangeName That’s a great attitude and you’re absolutely right.
Even something as simple as being pleasant and kind to people in a work situation makes a difference, even in “non-meaningful” jobs.

That's something to consider, OP.

This is true. One person who genuinely made a difference to my life was the lady at the bank I went into in tears when I realised my abusive ex who had made me and the children homeless was starting to take money out of our joint account. She dealt with it all so compassionately and efficiently and it was an encounter that will stay with me.

Not what people might think of as a meaningful job full of "bonded empathy" but she genuinely made a difference that day

also, stop being a “juicy loudmouth”
That’s not good or professional for ANY kind of job
Agree with this too.
The juicy loudmouths I've worked with have either made workplace culture unpleasant/awkward for others or they've ended up moving on because they found that the professional people in the team weren't interested in listening to them hold court.

OP I think part of the problem is your mindset and the way you seem to perceive this huge gulf between the corporate world and the world of "jobs with meaning". I find the phrase "juicy loudmouth" very telling and also this phrase

"OK but I can't spreadsheet, can't do maths, I can't admin that well, I shd have trained as a social worker but too late now. My skillset belongs in the bonding empathy zone and making meaningful connections with other organisations."

This is a strange phenomenon which I have come across in my friend network where people see everything as a very binary dichotomy between corporate jobs which are full of stiffs with accountancy degrees and voluntary sector jobs where people are "real" and have "empathy" and its inaccurate and profoundly unhelpful. It's also slightly insulting to those of us who work in the corporate world (and by extension to your DH who uses this corporate job to provide a lot of the income that supports you and your children).

I work in the corporate world and have done for the past ten years and can't do maths to save my life. My spreadsheet capability is minimal. It's not as black and white as you are making it. You're correct that it's harder to get into corporate jobs from voluntary sector and there are certain baseline technical and soft skills that most offices require but I'm sure you can learn those. People in the corporate world are people as well and they also have dream and morals and political convictions and families they love. They just don' thave the luxury of having to use their worthy job as a shield.

The biggest problem is your attitude and what comes across as s sense of entitlement to have an "interesting" or "meaningful" job. You don't necessarily have to work for Goldman Sachs or Coca Cola for 80 hours a week, there are plenty of white collar jobs you could do (in the civil service or elsewhere) which use the skills you have developed but with a degree of work/life balance. You have plenty of transferable skills.

You may be deliberately doing yourself down because your self esteem is damaged or you might just be a bit bigoted against "corporate stiffs", I can't really tell. But your contempt for people who work in the private sector is very noticeable and I think you would do yourself a big favour if you lost the attitude and opened your mind a bit.

ive never gone back f/t after having kids. Most is 4 days, but I started and finished early and I was home by 5pm (DCs were in secondary so let themselves in about 45 mins before I got home).
Me being at home p/t always enabled dh to work the hours he needed cos his job/career pulled in the money, mine wouldn’t have even if I was f/t.
We are lucky and don’t struggle, it may have been a different story if we have.
Now I could theoretically go back f/t but I have some health issues atm so precludes it a bit. I work p/t hybrid, my wage is enough to make a difference- have a cleaner, pay uni kid’s rent etc.

Its a balance between being there to support your childs development and needs (even as teenagers) and family finances. Consider how much time you need to be available for kids vs how many days you could work and finances involved. If your career is static generally I would say now would be a good time to re-train and gain some qualificaitons if financially viable in the short term, for longer term improved career prospects. Just something to think about.

Depends if you think you would be happier at work or just more stressed as you wouldn’t have the time to do housework etc.
If I were you I’d say don’t do it, your kids are young.
My mum is 55 and has only just gone back to work as we have both left home now (younger brother 25)
Working would make you feel like you have more purpose I suppose but there is nothing wrong with staying home and continuing to run the house if you can afford to.
I’d say stay home and don’t feel bad, I certainly wouldn’t

Care work. Nursing home or carer for the elderly in their own homes.

Maybe that socially impactful work would be too real for you? You have the luxury of too many choices and too many safety nets.

I think the female term is fanny lodger.

I don't think you're taking advantage. And if you were the female equivalent of a cocklodger (golddigger?), then from what you've indicated you're not doing it very well! Because things sound comfortable at best round yours, not like you're rolling in it while all the hard graft is done by nannies and housekeepers.

Tbh it sounds like you and your DH made decisions together which worked well short-term for your family unit without necessarily thinking through the long-term consequences. Ime it's not at all uncommon for men to panic post-DC when their partners are going back from maternity leave about just how much baby/child/house shit there is to do, and to look for a way out of having to take on their share. And if you're fairly highly paid and your partner earns less, often the easiest solution is to encourage/acquiesce in your partner giving up work or reducing hours/responsibilities. And often women agree because they feel hugely guilty and conflicted about using full-time childcare for their baby. So the pattern is set.

But it sounds like the current set-up is no longer working for your family and the immediate priority is to bring in more money, so together you need to discuss how this can happen and how you can fairly reallocate non-financial responsibilities to enable this.

It does depend on how much your kids need you, how many hours your husband works and how much time chores take. I am in a similar situation as kids are now teens and I often feel guilty that I am not working full time. But the issue is my husband does long hours and I work in a similar industry. If I were to go back full time I too would have to go back to 10 hour days. So neither of us would be around to see the kids after school and all the admin I do would have to be shared. Our weekends would be chores and I wouldn’t be able to help the kids in the evening or cook dinner. We would be better off but at what cost? Each family is different though. My SIL loves her job and wouldn’t dream of going part time for the kids, hires staff in to do the admin. She happy and fulfilled, the kids are happy as they devote the weekend to them. Just wouldn’t work for me as I’m a homebody and like to help the kids with homework etc. family life is all about balance and each family has a different balance. Don’t feel guilty if your current setup works for you for a few more years.