To tell my friend she's being an awful wife

[MommaTonda]

Long story sorry. A very good friend of mine has a 3 year old and for the last 2 years has been trying to get pregnant again. She's had all the tests done and no issues. IVF will cost them £12k and only 20% chance of success due to her age. She is understandably really struggling emotionally and I'm there for her all the time. I listen, help with childcare, help her research IVF options etc.

Her husband is the most lovely, supportive, patient man and he loves her and their 3 year old dearly. He is also a friend of my husbands and they talk a lot.

Every month when they realise there is no pregnancy they are devastated. My friend then turns quite nasty towards her husband (shouting, blaming him for everything, throwing her dinner on the floor, swearing at him etc). This is not her normal personality and I'm massively worried.

I'm worried she's so obsessed with getting pregnant she's treating her husband like sh*t. She's also very short tempered with her 3 year old. As her friend I want to help. Her husband is at the end of his tether and has asked my husband and me to help.

When she is so emotionally unstable, am i being unreasonable to tell her straight? You're going to lose all chances of another baby if you continue treating your husband this way? Or should I just carry on supporting her but not say anything about how she's treating her man?

I really don't know how to help. I also want to avoid an "It's ok for you" scenario as I have 2 kids and got pregnant straight away so I literally don't know what she's going through 1st hand. But I can see it's bl*ody hard and I need to help her!

Omg some of these responses are horrific!

Personally I would sit them both down and TALK...

If you don't want to be involved make that clear, if you do suggest counselling and the possibility that a second pregnancy may be unviable.

Such an emotive situation for them both.

OP, you can continue to function as a supportive listener. Your friends are obviously intelligent people, and they are as aware as you about the many service options available to them.

It is better to listen than to become involved. An interesting side line is that your friend seems to be ignoring her existing child. It seems as though she might want a pregnancy more than she wants a child.

Some women seem to really "need" to be pregnant, but the need to be a parent is far less meaningful in their lives . Maybe she wants the attention that comes with pregnancy , and is using this vile behavior to get a type of attention as a substitute for pregnancy attention.

Your friend does not sound like an emotionally healthy person. Maybe they will decide on counseling for her it sounds as though she needs it.

Listen to both of them, but remember that they are both choosing to engage in this disturbing drama. There is no direction in which you can point them to that is not a direction of which they are unaware. They are remaining in this cycle ,so it is not unreasonable to think that some need is being satisfied for both of them.

This! She is being abusive to her husband and he shouldn’t have to put up with it. What about the 3 year old child caught up in this?

Frankly I think the fact she is unable to have another baby is nothing but positive. Nobody should deliberately bring a baby into an abusive household.

The fuck would I be encouraging counselling or being supportive of her situation. She is a cunt. And I would have nothing more to do with her.

The abuse apologists on this thread are disgusting.

She really needs counselling and I’m saying this as someone who just went through ivf.

People never cease to amaze me. So true that if the genders were reversed people would not be saying stay out of it!

1. Friends and family are there to form each other. 'iron sharpens iron' type thing. I would blame my friends if they were only being supportive to me and not also calling me out. Friends are supposed to be there to cheer you on and help you in life, not assisst you in self-sabotaging in the name of support. Sometimes behaviour (especially towards one's wife/husband) becomes a routine and it is difficult to realise you're in the wrong without an outsider pointing this out from a different perspective.
2. Obviously this story has 2 sides, so a gentle approach is necessary. not blaming everything on her, because you are not privy to all the facts. However, this does not mean we are supposed to say something. something like: " I realise I do not know everything and x is surely a pain sometimes, however I've noticed you are behaving cold/ snappy and xyz towards your 3 year old and your husband. I wouldn't be a true friend if i didn't mention this. I'm here if you want to chat and realise secondary infertility is hard, but it seems you have become somewhat abusive towards - insert husbands name-. If I was in this situation, I'd want someone to point out this pattern to me." Sometimes an outside perspective helps. (obv my wording isn't perfect, but you can have a nice long think about it.
3. My dad has once spoken to a friend and said -" i have noticed you are very impatient towards your wife, she can say nothing and then you snap. This is no way to work with your wife and as a brother I wanted to say something." He said it's true , its become worse over time, he hasn't realised it but it has become a pattern. And he changed. Because sometime chatting to your wife/husband doesn't help. You need someone else calling out your behaviour.
4. Lastly, I think even if I were to lose a friend, I would rather do what is right, rather be a loving, caring friend that's willing to speak up when something is wrong, than not saying anything. Its very delicate and should be done in private, but if this is something you've noticed too, don't stay quiet. you have to be able to lve with yourself afterwards.
5. To all the people who say stay out of it, bet you would not be saying the same if your daughter's husband were throwing plates and swearing at her. Abuse happens because everyone turns a blind eye. ( not saying she's necessarily abusing him, she's hurting, but as a general rule above is true)

If it was a man who had done these things there’s little chance you’d be providing the excuses you are.

OP, your friend is an abuser and she needs help to stop this. Her DH needs to leave and take their child until she can get help.

If a man had done these things, no one would be telling the OP to confront him and tell him he's an "awful husband". They would be telling her to be supportive of the friend, but don't make it worse for her by upsetting her husband.

It's a boy. Do you still feel the same? Apparently on MN only females can be felt sorry for. You don't feel sorry for a man thats being treated poorly

I think they need to sort it out between them, not be propped up by crying to OPs husband and whispering around behind her back. I’m sure OP is trying to be a good friend, but I think a good friend would stop being a prop and tell him to go and talk to his wife.

those saying the OP doesn't know the true story and only has her DHs version....did you miss OP say she has witnessed the way her friend has spoken to the 3 year old? Not a huge jump to assume then that the husband is probably telling the truth?

A lot of us have been through awful things in life. Things that truly test and push you to the edge.

Not all of us are abusive towards our family. It's not normal or okay, regardless of sex.

Her husband needs to talk to her when she’s not emotionally raw and tell her that he’s not dealing with the out bursts , counselling maybe the way.
please don’t get involved .

That's what YOUR friends are for, that's not what mutual friends of the couple are for, that alienates her.
I hope he is clueless and not setting her up.
Tell him to leave her if it's as bad as he says, don't be a person who tries to fix an abusive relationship if he's telling the truth then you're doing him a disservice by fixing it, also if it's the truth then she will be angry with him for getting you involved.

But if a woman said it, you'd believe her, I imagine.

You should tell him if what hes said is true ,he should make preparations to leave and take the child so they are both safe

You said you're researching the IVF stuff for/with her etc. As part of that research find a therapist (online or local) who specialises in this area. Look for qualified and experienced. The DH also needs to speak to someone separately, maybe your DH can talk to him about that.

If a woman said it to mutual friends I'd wonder whether she was laying the groundwork for him to be a villain socially.

Sorry I may have misunderstood but I thought she was looking into IVF not had/going through it. I do get this is painful but if I'm right and she hadn't and is already feeling this overwhelmed I am not sure IVF is the right move atm. IVF is a real whirlwind of emotions. From hope, hormones, pain and potentially horrific disappointment all at a horrendous financial strain that does not help. That's my first worry is her already in this stage and if it failed how she would manage both her feelings and her existing family.

My next main worry is how you know all she is doing RE the plates etc? If you have witnessed it fair enough question it but absolutely as a concerned friend not you will lose your husband etc. If you haven't seen it and go in with we have been told this and that I worry she may feel that he is going behind her back and then start taking against you so to speak.

Either way as someone who had 7 years of infertility and it nearly broke my marriage and myself, it doesn't always just get better with time...

I would encourage the husband to speak to the IVF clinic and maybe offer to have the little one for a bit so they can have some time together because you can see they are having a hard time. I wouldn't go any further than that.

Your husband needs to just be there to listen to his friend and you for yours.
Nothing that you say or do can make her feel better. Just be there.

You're saying she's a bad wife
Rather than that she's vulnerable and her mental health is causing her relationship problems.
Just wow.

Well, I’m going to be sure to go on to DV threads in future and tell the woman that there’s two sides and we don’t know the whole story. I mean that’s perfectly ok to do isn’t it? No didn’t think so.

This thread is a disgrace.

She's abusing her husband. If your husband us friends with him, he needs to listen and believe him. The DH needs to get help from organisations for abused men and if she is violent towards him, he needs to call the police. Infertility is absolutely no excuse for abuse and violence.

She sounds deeply unwell to me. Although she is behaving in an abusive way, as it’s new behaviour, it sounds more like she’s unwell rather than just an abusive person if that makes sense? Can you encourage her to go to a doctor?

You're going to lose all chances of another baby if you continue treating your husband this way?

If you seriously consider this is an appropriate thing to say, don’t get involved.