To not allow DD to go on school trip for breaking phones?

[Feefoog]

My DD 10 yo DD has broken her phone. I thought fine I have a spare one. DDs put a pin on the spare factory reset model. I have reset the phone but it says put in previous users emails. I've tried both mine and DDs emails, I think she's created an email to get round family link and screen time she said she might have done this. I'm really mad she's effectively broken 2 phones and broken my trust . She has a phone to walk to and from school so needs one, she has a school residential that's £310 which is already expensive. It's not so much about the money its that she shows no regard for rules, money or possessions.

AIBU to refuse to pay for this school trip as she needs a new phone well 2 phones really hers and the spare. She has already been snowboarding this year and will be having 2 weeks in Greece in August so its not like she won't be having trips away.

Why does she need a spare phone? Surely buying her two phones just gives her the message that it's ok to break one of them...

Op are you literally saying your ten year old (year 5 I assume) child goes out on her bike alone and you don't know where she is so she needs a phone?

As I said before my ten year old lives in a village but I always know where he is, certainly no roaming about.

He does 4 hobbies a week. The rest of the time he plays in the garden, has arranged play dates, goes on family outings and has screen time!

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02Zx7Gzb8JktCqGNt8RrmPPVAhGL62nW3Vh6Qe4tCayz5qN5imqvaHMV79HDrWZPBzl&id=100068839375564

and this is why a 10 year old doesn’t have a phone

Despite the 50/50 split on AIBU voting, the vast majority of those posting are saying don't punish your DD by banning her from the Y6 trip, it's too harsh a punishment. I agree, and am uneasy that OP has not once addressed the issue of the (inappropriate) punishment in any of her posts. Indeed she seems to be getting angrier and angrier. OP, take a breath then look at the advice you've been given, which is overwhelmingly in favour of a brick phone and letting DD go on the trip. Plus getting the 'broken' phones working again so that you can see what she's been up to.

School trip is valuable for her development and becoming independent.
I wouldn't link it to the phone. She is only 10.

Treat the phone as a separate thing. Say how much it will cost you to replace what she broke. And then tell her she will have to earn it back through chores or something similar. That way she will learn the value of things. If she has to save up to replace it and put in the effort herself, she will respect it more. She probably doesn't have any idea what is hard for a parent to afford because things magically will be paid for for her.

I would ground her and ban her from technology for a week or something. Then make her earn back the money for a new phone.

If you go down the AirTag route I would still check that she is where the AirTag says.

What I mean is if I was her and didn't want you to know where I was, I would park my bike somewhere allowed and go somewhere I wasn't allowed. Or I would leave my AirTag in an allowed place then bike to somewhere I wasn't allowed.

There are lots of ways to fake location on a smartphone. For example if you put your phone in airplane mode then your location will show as the place where you put the phone in airplane mode rather than where you really are.

I suspect that your dd googled how to get around the parental control software that you use. If your passwords are saved on your phone and she knows the phone code, she would be able to log in without your Face ID. Are you sure she's not seen you type in the code or that the code is not as random as you think ?

School trip isn't a holiday and should be good for her

She clearly can't be trusted with a phone to Not change emails /passwords

So she doesn't get given a phone

She needs to earn your trust and going on your iPad and getting PIN code and changing security setting etx isn't a way of earning your trust

She is delib going against your rules and quite frankly taking the piss out of you !!!

Take the phone to a phone shop. They will be able to sort it

For your own iPad maybe don't do a code and do finger print or Face ID (yours) only

We took all tech away from all 4 kids for 3 months because we couldn't trust the punished ones not to use the others. It was the best thing we ever did.

My son is year 6 and had previously smashed an old iPhone, so I told him that should he damage or lose this one then he would be given a basic call/text phone.
I don’t have set screen time as he’s not on it like that but gets charged at night so not to go on it then.
I know his password and have family sharing so he needs my permission for things but thankfully sensible.

I wouldn’t deny a residential trip but set some boundaries and give her a cheap phone until she understands the value.

if you plug it into a computer and connect to iTunes can you reset it that way?

"She's done the same with my tablet took it worked out my password then used it to get round screen time, parental locks it's not the first time she's done it. So I think I'm going to have to lock all devices away. I'm so angry with her. More for not listening, I guess she's clever though for working it out."

Check your bank account!

@Feefoog She is learning that she can lie, be destructive and manipulate you without consequences so why would she stop?

There has to be an appropriate consequence.

Phones are not a necessity. She doesn't need one. Don't replace it. Make her save up and buy a new one.

Cancel the residential trip. Things that that should be a rewards for hard work and good behaviour otherwise you create entitlement.

Give her a curfew when she is out on the bike. If she keeps to it, she can earn pocket money and treats for the good behaviour. If she doesn't, you take the bike away.

If you don't start enforcing boundaries and rules that are there to keep her safe she will walk all over you and it will be that much harder to deal with as her full teen years hit.

Don’t use the residential as a punishment. Also depends when it is but punishments should be immediate and not something that takes ages to happen.

Also as a teacher who organises residential trips it can really put a spin in things when numbers have been confirmed and then kids pull out. Can effect cost and staffing.

I’m also against punishing kids by stopping them attending a paid hobby or a pre arranged party . Not only is the child being punished but the people organising those things are effectively punished.

What school does a 2-night trip for that sort of money?

I wouldn't pay that for 2 adults for 2 night, never mind a single 10yr old!

Our son lost his £120 coat yesterday. When he came home he told us he couldn't find it and couldn't remember where he had left it. So we told him that the £120 he had saved for our family holiday to Turkey from doing months of dog walking and chores would be used to get him a new coat. We let this sink in for an hr or 2, so he would feel the weight of the money loss. Then we ordered him an new coat the exact coat he'd lost. As a. We would never take his money off him that he had earned as shit happens there children and b. We would never make him pay for his own stuff until he's 18.
Yes you are being unreasonable this is a child and it's a school trip, nothing our son could do would result in us depriving him of a school trip he would be grounded or loose his xbox if needs be but making him loose out on an experience is just mean.

Shit happens, move on and let her go

10 year olds do not NEED a phone to walk to and from school.

How old is your child? Our 3rd oldest is 11 and he like the other children of the same age on our estate, plays out on our street, roams about our estate and does things all boys of there age do. If we tried to cage him in our garden and arrange play dates there would be trouble, this is how we treat our 5yr old.
But on top of that our son tells us everything. He is very honest, very responsible, quite mature for his age, if something does happen he does come and tell us what he's done. We have tried to find that fine balance between being a friend and being a parent. And we've found by being this way our kids don't hide things from us, there not sneaky, they confide in us and above all they trust us. We do have boundaries and consequences but you have to allow them to be children and make mistakes

As others have said, get her a Nokia brick for when she's walking to and from school and out of the house.
You need to talk to her and say that she has shown she isn't ready for the responsibility of having an expensive phone with internet access, therefore she will be given a cheap basic phone. You will revisit getting her a better one when she is older and has proved she can take care of it and follow your rules. I think that is fair, and she will understand it.

Cancelling the trip might not have clear cause and effect to a ten year old, and might make her stroppy and resentful. She won't learnt he lesson you want her to learn, which is to take care of her things and follow your rules about internet access.

OP I think your priorities in all of this a very skewed. Pushing to one side the broken phones and tablets, your daughter continually deceives you. She can somehow (really can’t get my heat around this) guess all your pins and by pass all security on your devices.

she is deleting texts that she is apparently sending to friends but you don’t know what they are so how do you know they are being sent to and from ‘friends’

Your whole thread screams vulnerability and a child that is deceptive and openly lies, breaks rules etc and she is 10, an age that is so very impressionable. I am not saying this against your child, she is 10 and she is the child. You need to really get a control of this, maybe look at some good online videos about dangers of phones and social media etc.

There is an excellent advert in New Zealand that shows the dangers of social media.

https://www.adsoftheworld.com/campaigns/keep-it-real-online

I can’t tell you what to do as you know your child and what will work with her.

out of interest does your school do any internet or phone safety classes?

Anbd remove the iPad entirely or only let her use it with your supervision if she needs it for homework etc. As above- she's proved she is not ready yet to responsibly use it on her own.

no I wouldn’t cancel the trip for her, as another poster said it’s completely irrelevant to the actual issue.

my son is the same with items he’s age 7 nearly 8 and in the space of one week has left his water bottle in school (now been returned home), left his reading books in school (he now has them) and has lost his one of his school jumper! I was furious by the end of it tbh😂 but I’m the type of parent who remains calm!

I have also had the chat with him (he is very eager for his own iPad/phone because all his friends play on Roblox etc) I’ve just simply said to him once he proves to me he can look after things I’ll happily get him one😊! I also explain it’s his responsibility to ask his teacher where his jumper might be (didn’t bring it home) and also to get his reading books to do his reading,

for stuff like this I do genuinely think a good chat about how to be responsible helps.

in your situation I would say to her “you can only take your phone to and from school with you so I know your safe, otherwise until you can prove to me your responsible and can look after things I’ll have to keep hold of it”

cancelling her trip means she’s missing out on more life skills and that could genuinely teach her abit of independence and responsibility!? Also you was willing to pay beforehand so it completely misses the point & will only add more problems and give your daughter signals to try and hide stuff in future as opposed to being honest with you.

Agree with those saying she doesn't need a phone for walking to school.

I find your reaction to her working out your password odd. No, she’s not clever. And no, you don’t need a safe for your devices. That’s ridiculous. You just need to create a more effective password.

If you want to track her, still just get a basic phone, and stick an AirTag on it.

Give her an apple AirTag clipped on and tell her tough cookies - lying means being treated like a baby until she know right from wrong

I learnt this the other day on here

If have an iphone

Press top left and edit

It will show deleted texts