Vegan inviting themselves to join a dinner resulting in everyone having a crap dinner

[NewShoesForSpring]

I was away with work meeting several international colleagues.

3 of us were staying in the same direction & decided we'd head back together & get some dinner on the way. The quiet girl, let's call her Mary, heard us & said she was staying in the same general direction & would leave with us. We had no problem with this & so once we were finished up that drink we left the general group & checked if she was ready etc

We get off the metro at a busy area close to where our hotels are & there are loads of lovely bistros etc, all busy so one of the group suggestes we try one that looks v nice & has loads of people dining etc. We go over to take a look at the menu (though if it had been just me & the person who suggested it I'd say we'd have just gone straight in! It was getting late & we'd been slightly concerned we wouldn't even find dinner at that stage. So this place looked perfect.

Anyway Maria is hesitating by the menu & then she pipes up that she's vegan....

She tries asking the waiter if they have anything but he doesn't understand & do we're all standing about dithering & she had NO suggestions of what she'd like to do..we start walking around the square looking at all the menus....its now 10.15pm...I can feel our chances of finding some nice food fading...

She spends AGES reading every menu to reject them all. Eventually she stops in front of a cheap Lebanese place & says 'oh falafel I love them...' so we found ourselves eating a really crap dinner. Essentially it was like a takeaway place with plastic cutlery.

The colleague who suggested the Bistro is perhaps late 60s & has a condition that gives her a tremor & she wanted to sit inside as it was getting chilly outside

Maria the vegan said oh shall we sit outside? It's nicer..more dithering for the group of 4 if us as we don't know each other & everyone was trying to be polite

I was getting to the end of my patience then so went to the bathroom & said I'd find them

Came out...they were outside...poor other colleague was wrapping a scarf around herself. We were surrounded by people smoking those glass pipe things (I forget the name)

The food was v basic. I ordered a vegetarian plate (it looked like that might be the best option ). It consisted of cubed potatoes, rice, a small spoon of veg moussaka & bread - cards on carbs!

I ate it without fuss & also worked hard to keep the small talk inclusive etc . I asked Maria how she normally copes with the vegan diet when travelling & she said she usually gets supermarket food. So from that point of view I was glad she did stay out.

But bloody hell there was a really selfish part of me thar was looking longingly across the square at the lovely bistro & wishing for a lovely glass of red wine & steak et frites...it had been tantalisingly close. I also wanted to chat to the older colleague about a part of work / project we're both involved in but it would have left Maria out of the loop.

And to top it all...I we spent so long faffing about finding vegan food by the time I got back to my hotel the bar had closed so I never even got thar glass of wine!

I REALLY wanted to say to Maria & the 4th colleague who didn't seem at all bothered by any of it - you go for the vegan stuff. Me & other colleague want go in here & eat meat / fish. But somehow that just didn't seem possible.

I woke up today feeling like a horrible person even though i did not let Maria know I was irritated....

Can you expand on your view of vegans as always selfish and looking unhealthy?

What's happened for you to make that generalisation?

Not read the full thread. Just wanted to say that you do need to be careful on work trips about how you treat colleagues. Even though I have lots of sympathy with OP for her situation - including the vegan colleague was a wise move in my opinion as you aren't really fully "off the clock" when eating out woth colleagues whilst travelling with work.

Urgh I had a vegan colleague like that. We always needed to accommodate her. Until one day I didn’t join the group and said bring vegan is against my religion. They asked “why” and I said in my religion man we’re created to rule and domain animals. They were shocked, of course. But I had enough of her really.

Each to their own I say until they start describing animal slaughter etc and being sanctimonious / preaching. But it’s usually the vegans who have been one for five minutes like this. I work with one like this who covers her nose with her jumper when someone is eating meat. It’s so rude.

Sissynova so it's OK for everyones night to be ruined by one person and their demands then. Vegan or not that's selfish.

YABU for not speaking up, especially your colleague who has to stay warm.

@NewShoesForSpring (OP), I think so many of us would have gone into the first bistro because we've been stung by annoying situations like this before.

You wrote:

She dithered at the menu for a few mins & we suggested she ask the waiter. They had a brief conversation & she came back to us shaking her head that it was a no go...

That's the moment I'd have known it was all bullshit.

I've had great vegan & vegetarian food in bistros in Paris, for example. Leek vinaigrette, salads, breads & olive oil, frittes, plates of vegetables with dressing and seasoning.

So yeah my response to all her head shaking would have been, 'come on, we'll find you something', and I'd have gone in. Especially after 10pm, with a slight chill in the air.

I think you sound annoyed with yourself as much as with Maria, for believing her bullshit.

I sympathise, OP, and I'm a veggie.

Yes, in retrospect you could have probably steered things better but I can completely see how this happened, and it mainly happened because this woman was totally socially inept, and had no sense of the situation or the needs of others. And as usual, the more people you are trying to accommodate in group dining, the more difficult it is and it usually ends in some kind of unsatisfactory compromise.

This.

With family I can understand, but with a colleague who has a condition, something should have been said even more so with how late it was.

You were ridiculous to not say something… there were 3 of you?!
Or is it possible the others were happy with the food and it was just you who was set on the bistro?

Majority rules. You were all far too nice and let one person's needs dominate. Poor decision making. You paid the price via the crap meal.

I really don’t see how everyone’s night was ruined, not one person other than OP said anything like that.
Perhaps they had a great time and enjoyed the food. One in particular sounded very vocal and chatty about it being a nice night and how lovely it would be to sit outside.
OP has followed up her first claim and said she doesn’t actually know if the older colleague has a medical condition or not but again if this colleague wasn’t happy with a Lebanese food place or sitting outside then she could have said something but she didnt.
In a group setting you can only assume that means people are happy to go with the group.

Fussy eaters who expect the evening to be all about them drive me nuts.

There are 2 types of vegans in my experience- the ones like my wife who just get on and make the most of a bad lot in this type of situation- many plates of chips or a veggie option if there really isn’t anything vegan (for example chips often aren’t if they are cooked in animal fat or in the same fryer as fish, vegetables often already have butter added, wine isn’t vegan etc)

or the type like one of the families at our school who’s children have to be vegan so they expect no one to have an ice cream from a van if they are there, all the food to be vegan at a kids party etc.

One type gets on with everyone and gets invited to events, the other isn’t!

My friend who is vegan smokes and drinks the occasional glass of wine which aren’t vegan but will traipse all around town for the right syrup to go in her coffee when we meets up.
It does drive me mad.

If anyone says they’re vegan but are knowingly consuming non vegan products, then they aren’t vegan. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I'm inclined to agree this is a vegan bashing thread. Obviously it's framed as being about the selfish behaviour of vegans, rather than their choice of diet, but its very transparent.
The whole thread is hyperbolic. A vegan 'ruined' a meal. The horror! Four near strangers deciding to get some food at the end of an event they were paid to attend is hardly the social event of the year. A meat eater missed out on a steak because she was insufficiently assertive to speak up. 'Vegan' apparantly 'imposed herself' when we're not talking about three friends on a pre planned social, but a bunch of random colleagues, heading in the same direction, which she was as much as the others.
The person who chooses a vegan diet is 'fussy', her choice is a 'fad'. I doubt many would dare to use such language if we substitute halal for vegan.
I do wonder what it is about the choice not to eat animal products people find so triggering. If you're comfortable with your decision to do otherwise, then there isn't any need to use attack as a form of defence.

I have been in this exact same situation before.
I looked across the street at a burger restaurant and simply said 'I'm sorry guys but the food here looks really unappealing to me, I'm going to nip over the road and grab a burger. Do you fancy meeting back up in an hour or so for a drink?'

I started walking over the road and after probably 10 paces turned round to see 8 of the 10 or 11 people in our group coming with me. They were all thinking the same thing, it just took me to say it!

We had a lovely meal and met the others for a drink after.

Sorted.

Is it maybe the experiences people have had with vegans in their life? My best friend is vegan. It's a non-issue. We go to a cafe, she orders vegan, I order eggs. We talk, all is good.

A past friend was vegan, invited to a BBQ at ours with a couple of other friends. She was prepared to come and we were happy to make sure there were good vegan food choices for her and her family. It wasn't even at her home yet she was making a big fuss about no-one was allowed to have any animal products where her children could see them as the children would get upset about the animals. She didn't come because the host's kids wanted sausages and the host wasn't going to be told they couldn't serve their kids sausages in their own home, we went ahead with the cook out. Transpired that the whole relationship (and a number of other relationships she had) failed because the kids tried to make rules that must be imposed on everyone else and the mother said it wasn't fair the kids should have to see animal products. Yet every time they had social difficulties it was never their fault but the fault of everyone else.

I just don't bother with vegan type 2 anymore.

She's not fussy because she's vegan, she's fussy because she had everyone traipsing after her reading every single menu for ages and rejecting them all. You'll struggle to find many places without vegan options these day, let alone every single restaurant so it wasn't about her dietary needs, it was about fussy and not caring that everyone else was cold, hungry, bored, having their time taken up and having to eat a meal they didn't really want

Yes. The most favourable interpretation (to me) for the OP is: six of one and half-a-dozen of the other. Two of you wanted to chow down on scorched flesh or dead fish, and the third didn't. So you all dithered and faffed. My DP is veggie (not vegan) and I will eat meat now and then. In this day and age we can whip out a smart phone, and Google for suggestions. All over Europe. I will admit that 20 or 30 years ago in France, some waiters' ideas of 'vegetarian' was 'not much meat in this dish'. But not now, all over Europe. They want foreigner's money and veganism/vegetarianism is mainstream in a lot of countries.

You were being nice and inclusive to be respectful. But you don't have to sacrifice yourself for someone else. Next time just say, " I'm going to x for a nice steak. You're welcome to join us." If she doesn't want to come, she can sort out her own food. You bould say see you after dinner fir a drink. She isn't going to die! She'll go to a suitable place and eat. I'm sure she's used to it, as she's chosen a very restrictive diet. I speak as an ex vegan.

I’ve only once encountered a ‘vegan type 2’ and I know a lot of vegans. He was a dick about a lot of stuff though. Most people just get on with life making their own choices and accepting/ignoring others choices in daily life.

I do lots of campaigning for animal rights and veganism, but only in the appropriate places. When at social events, it’s not a thing, just like every other vegan I know, apart from one.

These vegan type 2s seem to be mostly an urban myth, discussed on here by those with an agenda, but rarely seen by anyone without one. 😉

@NeedCoffeeNowPlease The person you're talking about there is clearly of a personality type that feels the need to be centred in everything. Such types can often be attracted to certain 'identities' because they provide a vehicle to recieve special treatment. Veganism is just one of a number of identities they may choose for this purpose, and if it weren't that, it would be something else. As you say though, there are other people who are just quietly getting on with not eating animal products, minding their own business and inconveniencing no one. Unfortunately people often seem unable to move past their stereotype and understand that just because some self centred people are vegan its not always true in reverse.
@TrollyHolly Indeed. Maria didn't handle it well or with consideration. The OP didn't handle it at all. So each contributed to the failure of the evening. Yet here we are, predictably, making this about veganism, rather than Maria and the OP both lacking the necessary skills to get their tea in the warm.

You have to take charge like SW2002 or everyone just does the British thing of keeping quiet and quietly seething.