ID of Starbucks non binary Southampton manager revealed

[Birthdaygirltoday33]

Their name is Luna Spain

DM link:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12077475/Starbucks-manager-sacked-transphobia-rant-activist-terrifies-neighbours.html?ico=related-replace

All this fuss over an attention seeker getting attention. By the way went was my last post deleted? Because I deres to luna as

... Why was my last post deleted? Are we not allowed to refer to males as“he” any more?

We haven’t been for a while. A few years ago I got a post deleted and warned because I referred to Fallon Fox as a male when talking about the fact that FF (trans woman) fractured the skull of a woman during an MMA fight and how it shouldn’t be allowed.

Completely agree @KittyAlfred

And let's face it, if someone is that aggressive, it's never a one off. It's a pattern of behaviour.

How profoundly depressing that on a feminism board, we have people minimising and excusing violence against women.

Exactly, Cymene. There is no way Luna is a victim in this scenario.

The woman stood her ground, but it would have been absolutely terrifying, and something that will stay with her.

I don't care that Luna's identity is now known. It's a good thing. It means that women will know to approach them with caution. It's so very easy to not end up in the Daily Mail threatening a woman. Maybe Luna should try it.

This.

It should also be added that Luna went outside had a scuffle with the person filming, snatched the phone and hurt the person filming. They then stormed inside grabbed their coat and bag and broke a glass door on the way out:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12067759/amp/Woman-55-accused-trans-Starbucks-manager-transphobic-says-feared-life.html

The reality is, if someone is trans and was born a man, and is now a woman through having transitioned, etc, she will still have the muscularity, frame, effects of a puberty awash with testosterone, etc, that will make them far more scary, basically, when they are getting in your face or trying to grab your phone (i.e. in the video) than someone who was born a woman and has ten times less testosterone, far smaller muscle mass and height,etc.

That's not a trans issue that's just science. I'm thinking that when my DH tried to sort out some crap with our insane neighbour (she was scary), he took a calm approach (more calm than me) as he is a big old tall rugby player, and couldn't charge in like I did (a small woman) because it would be unfairly phzysically intimidating and that would be excessive - talking did just as good of a job.

This is what I feel when I watch the video of Luna tbh. To have the physical male privilege to intimidate while having also the privilege of being referred to as she.

I think this thread is still in the AIBU board. But yeah, depressingly predictable that Mumsnet gets these MRA posts all over the shop these days.

OTOH, the reason that MN is like a magnet for such nonsense is because it has been a spectacularly successful 'town hall' for women to talk about stuff that other platforms haven't been allowing.

It's women's fault that a man went off on one ... it's women's fault that a man from MailOnline wrote that article ... it's women's fault that something something ... at least MN allows some discussion of this phenomenon of blame.

Luna is big. And seems to feel completely entitled to intimidate and threaten that woman. It's actually terrifying to me that this is now the reality we live in - speak the words I tell you to speak, even when they go against what you can see with your own eyes, or get in the bin, Karen.

Punch a terf, kill a terf. Get called a terf for even accidental "misgendering."

It's vile and aggressive and pure, old fashioned misogyny.

You never, ever see men being treated like this woman was. And you never see trans men demanding capitulation, either.

People who are buying into this without question need to think long and hard about their behaviour. What else would you stand by and let happen because groupthink told you to?

(I notice all the TRAs have wandered off....)

Full Luna recently. May 5th I think.....

Because people need to understand there are consequences for their actions. Name and shame for behaviour like this will warn future prospective employers of their basic attitude.

If it had been a matter of name calling and a purely verbal exchange, equal on both sides, I'd feel differently about it. However, this person became physically violent and took a threatening posture even during the verbal altercation... All caught on camera. Personally, I don't think of this as doxxing, under the circumstances...

Ugh how depressing. So to be clear, we can't call violent males what they are if they have pink hair and special pronouns? If someone posts that their husband hits them but he identifies as a woman (whatever that means) will their posts be deleted too? Disgusting.

Not a TRA, but someone who feels there actually is a middle ground between "TWAW"and "all transwomen are a threat to women/a ridiculous parody".

I suspect many people have left the thread because it's pretty pointless, as none of us are going to change each others minds anyway.

But, for what it's worth, I see this very differently to you. I do think it matters what happened before the video, as it starts with the customer being much louder and more aggressive than the employee. The employee sees themself as defending another employee. They are taller than the customer but slightly built. If the person videoing is the man pictured with the customer, he looks much physically stronger than the employee.

The employee is absolutely out of order and needed to be sacked. It is never acceptable to lose your temper with an unreasonable customer. However, the shouting and clapping is pretty ineffectual and I seriously doubt the customer felt in danger for her life.

But obviously we will have to agree to differ as it is so hard for those at either extreme of this debate to allow a shred of nuanced discussion.

I can’t get remotely upset for Luna’s identity being revealed to the nation. Trans rights activists regularly and openly say absolutely disgustingly violent things about women, intimidate women speaking in public about matters relevant to women. They are violent, they hound people out of their jobs and they are usually allowed to get away with whatever they like as they’re part of a ‘sacred caste’. If the DM actually wants to hold one of them up as an example of inappropriate behaviour this is actually highly unusual and might be a good reminder that antisocial, violent, misogynistic, homophobic and aggressive behaviour generally isn’t seen as acceptable….

One can only hope that Luna himself checks himself slightly the next time he is perturbed in public as a result…

However, the shouting and clapping is pretty ineffectual and I seriously doubt the customer felt in danger for her life.

I disagree. For a start the customer said she feared for her life.

My inclination is to believe her, because I know how frightening such a situation can be.

Luna is big and appears completely out of control with narcissistic rage. One punch to the head may have meant a life changing brain injury to that woman, and that is not "ineffectual" - the clapping could have escalated into a punch, it was certainly heading in that direction.

Maybe the long history of male violence towards women is clouding my judgement here. Or I'm just not capable of "nuanced discussion."

But to me, Luna is a serious threat to women and I'm laughing at your claim that at any point the customer was the more aggressive party.

That's patently absurd.

Maybe this thread is all "pretty pointless" to you but I think it's very helpful and hopefully makes sense to others.

This. Bigoted thread has been reported by me too. The fact that it's still up confirms a lot of people's poor opinion of MN.

Customer originally wanted to pay by cash but wasn’t allowed to so paid by card.

Asking for a refund was a separate issue. She asked for a refund after Luna told her to leave (without the drinks and food she’d paid for) due to alleged transphobia

No you won’t change my mind. I can’t understand the mental gymnastics to come up with what you have.

You assume the woman is lying for no other reason than the person being aggressive is trans.

You assume the non binary member of staff wanted to be defended or felt offended that the customer assumed they would be fine with the term ‘lady’.

The woman is defending herself from being called transphobic and is ‘loud’ so she must be wrong and have done something else’s and definitely can’t have felt threatened.

You mention Luna is slight built, ignoring the fact that biologically they are a male and taller and younger than the woman they are being aggressive too. Ignoring biological facts that far our weigh being slighter built than the woman.

The woman couldn’t be a scared because defended herself? Women don’t ever argue back and try and defend themselves when feeling threatened? Bad woman, defending herself against an aggressive biological male.

You then mention the build of the man videoing. I assume you believe Luna couldn’t have been intimated as they then assaulted the man videoing. So what does the build of the man matter? By your logic, Luna can’t have felt threatened because they assaulted the man? So why did they assault the man?

Threatening behaviour isn’t threatening behaviour only when the person on the receiving end fears for their life. Why does this woman have to fear for her life for this to be serious or upsetting?

Funny how you say ‘but no point discussing it because everyone else is too extreme’, after you put your points over, which is ridiculous and just an attempt to stop people replying and challenging what you wrote. What you wrote was essentially excuses for a trans identifying male to be aggressive and assault someone.

Fearing for her life wasn’t due to clapping and shouting but being forced out physically after the video, before the door was slammed and glass smashed

I would have been terrified of the clapping. .

want to know why?
This was something my abusive ex would do to intimidate me. It was used to control me into submissions. When the clapping didn’t work he put his hands on me. And guess what a slap sounds like… clapping.

So what was the trigger to go after the camera man? He hadn’t said anything. He stood quietly outside the store and filmed. The customer also reminded the manager several times about cameras around. Had she done something vile to provoke the managers reaction she would also be aware it would be on camera.

I'd have been intimidated by Luna looming over me and smacking hands together just in front of my face. It's a direct threat, anyone who refuses to see that is simply privileged.

Its the "next time it'll be your face" crap that men pull.

It's the "next time I'll do sometbing much worse" threat.

It's the "next time, I will REALLY hurt you" promise.

Don't recognise it?

Lucky you.

@BishyBarnyBee - the victim's husband was outside the whole time and I'm guessing if Luna had felt intimidated by him, Luna wouldn't have stormed outside and smacked the phone out of his hand.

Luna is a violent person who physically assaulted two people. And some posters are falling over themselves to defend them because of their trans identity, not in spite of it.

And I suspect the only reason they want people to stfu about it is because it doesn't fit with the victim narrative.

I'm struggling to think of any media coverage that does fit with the victim narrative. Which makes me think it's not founded in reality