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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

DS 14 and violent porn

206 replies

Hairsterical · 12/05/2023 13:18

Real or set up kidnaps of teen girls getting gang raped, "slave" auctions, close ups of butthole plugs in use - these are among the images my young teen accessed recently, now unfortunately burned into both of our brains.

I believe he only recently started to be interested in sex/masturbating, and I was not surprised when I saw some very slightly racy content a few weeks earlier in his YouTube history. Now, still at the start of his whole sexual journey, he is being stimulated by harmful images that could set his baseline.

DS has been under the spell of influencers and appears to have developed a misogynistic view of the world that involves women rightfully belonging to men and violence against women being normal and correct. Through YouTube videos, Twitter memes and the like, he seems to have followed this thinking straight down the path to violent porn.

We are on a course of action to counter these views and frankly step the f up on our parenting, which was a bit lackadaisical on this and some other areas, primarily making sure our family values are instilled into him - such as treating each and every human being on this earth with respect. I think we assumed DS shared our values but of course teens are testing boundaries and looking for their own identities, and I think DS is currently attracted to extreme views.

I'm looking for thoughts and advice on how to deal with this. Every podcast or report on this topic seems to find that a vast amount of porn is violent --- so why on earth is this normalised and seemingly accepted - boys will be boys.

DS's school supposedly has been tackling these very issues around influencers and misogyny and consent. Yet my impression is that some boys are just learning not to express their real opinions because they know what they are "supposed" to think. Should I notify the school of my concerns and my son's recent behaviour perhaps?

We had some controls on one of his devices but another was free and clear to bring anything into our home. We have clamped down on that, but before this DS claimed to be the only one of his friends with any time limits or controls. When I looked on threads here, it seemed indeed many parents had zero controls on their 14 and 15 year olds. So do you know what your teen is looking at?

IMO interest in sex and images is 100% normal but society seems to be moving toward sex and violence toward women being part and parcel. I despair.

OP posts:
MumMcphee · 12/05/2023 22:14

Hairsterical · 12/05/2023 22:06

Someone mentioned a story this week in the Times so I looked it up. I hope I'm not breaking any copyright rules here but anyone interested in this topic should read this:

I'm watching what the kids are watching: porn. Most of it is disturbing
10 May 2023
The Times

As a new report points to the impact of violent pornography on British children, Helen Rumbelow downloads the most popular content for a day's viewing
Just before my day of watching porn a male friend said, "Wow, you get the best jobs." I wasn't actually sure what to expect. I assumed it would involve becoming at first titillated by, then desensitised to, the endless repetition of poles and holes; the glossy boobs and bums hypnotically rising and falling before my eyes, something like the visual eroticism of Gregg Wallace inspecting an iced bun factory. At first fun and then cloying.
Naughty, but nice.
Instead, when my time was up, marked by my teenagers getting home teenagers who are now way past 11, the average age of first exposure to video porn in the UK I found myself longing for desensitisation. I felt like I had witnessed sexual assaults and torture. For days, I couldn't get the pain these women experienced out of my head.
It wasn't like watching a horror film, when you know they use fake blood and phoney knives. The strangulation, gagging, binding and slapping, the glassy dead eyes of the teenage girl set upon with extreme force, was real. Real violence, humiliation and punishment. It didn't help my brain that the women were being paid perhaps to suck it up. It didn't help my brain to know the suffering was for such a good cause: male pleasure. I felt contaminated by sadism.
The influence of porn is now profound. This week the children's commissioner used statutory powers to analyse more than 500 case files of sexual abuse between under-18s provided by police. In 50 per cent of cases the interview transcripts referred to acts of sexual violence specific to pornography such as strangulation and slapping.
Some teenagers who carried out the abuse referred to their porn exposure as excessive, one saying, "I was really badly addicted to it at one point." An earlier study by the NSPCC found that one in ten schoolchildren aged 12 to 13 were worried they were already addicted to porn.
In 2016 the Journal of Interpersonal Violence published findings of a survey of almost 5,000 boys aged 14 to 17, which found an association: the more boys watched porn and the more they were sexually coercive, the more likely they were to send explicit images and the less respect they had for girls.
Yet for all this talk of the side-effects of porn, we don't discuss the porn itself. This is unique. Usually when there is a moral panic about a liberal frontier, say, rock music, all sides could confidently argue from evidence. But people either don't want to watch porn, or watch it and don't want to admit it.
The public debate on the Online Safety Bill, a pioneering piece of legislation making its way through the House of Lords, is therefore spectacularly ill-informed. Hidden by shame, porn gets a free pass. I recently explored the social media world of teenagers like my children for another article, but I was missing the bare-naked elephant in the room.
At 9am on a fresh Monday morning after the scrabbling to get the kids to school, I put on a wash of football kit and sat down with a cup of tea to watch Pornhub. Full disclosure: this wasn't even the first time I have investigated porn for The Times.
In May 1999, 24 years ago, I was a young reporter in the newsroom with a scoop. It was the battle between the censors at the British Board of Film Classification, who wanted to maintain the ban on sexual penetration, or "hardcore", on screen, and an obscure Home Office committee who overruled them. The porn video was called Makin' Whoopee! and it subsequently went missing from my desk; I assume someone was interested in the legal position.
The liberalising Home Office committee included Biddy Baxter, the former Blue Peter editor. When we interviewed Baxter about her decision she was idealistic. In Makin' Whoopee!, Baxter said, "everything was totally consensual and did not involve violence against women" (true).
At a subsequent appeal I heard a barrister invoke the spirit of the 1960 censorship trial for Lady Chatterley's Lover. Looking back, the Makin' Whoopee! case was seminal. Not that the ruling mattered much: soon video cassettes and censorship would be made irrelevant by the internet.
It was more a symbol of a new era of "sex-positive post-feminism", where we uptight Brits would become sophisticated Europeans. As a young woman in the 1990s I was living this Blairite and "lads' mags" cultural change. I found the porn-denouncing views of writers such as Andrea Dworkin un-fun. I was keen to be open-minded, not a prude.
Now, clicking straight onto Pornhub the website is free in every sense and didn't offer even a cursory check of my age I discovered what we started in 1999. Every video is "hardcore" now, of course, but Baxter's hopes about consent and violence seem to be "wrecked", to use a common porn euphemism for abusive sex.
Pornhub was the fourth most visited website in the United States in March 2023, according to Semrush traffic analytics, and the UK is its fifth largest market. It still gets billions of views, despite the fallout it experienced from The New York Times investigation in 2020 that concluded that of the more than six million new videos posted on the site each year, "many depict child abuse and non-consensual violence". I chose Pornhub as I could safely assume it has the most brand recognition for teens.
As a snapshot I picked the "most popular in the UK" page for that morning. There were 32 thumbnails of videos to click on. I scanned each one: mostly just a few minutes long and most involved people speaking in eastern European languages.
Twelve of the 32 showed men being physically abusive to women. This ranged from hair-pulling, slapping or holding her arms behind her back to a harder range of violence. Four of them included scenes of something I found out was called "facial abuse", in which a woman's airway is blocked by a penis, what looked to me like a porn version of waterboarding torture.
In one a woman is immobilised and bound by four straps and a collar tightened around her neck. She ends up looking like a dead body found in the boot of a car. In another a young girl, dressed to look even younger in a pair of bunny ears and pastel socks, is held down by an enormous man pushing his hand on her neck while she is penetrated.
The sounds that came from my computer were those you might expect from a battle hospital: cries of pain, suction and "no, no, no". I won't yet tell you the worst video I saw as you may want to stop reading now. I started to have to take breaks to go outside and look at the sky and remember kindness.
The next largest category was that of "pseudo incest", with 11 videos. These depict sex between step-siblings or step-parents and adult stepchildren. Bizarrely, I found these videos a moment of calm because they were rarely violent; the violence of the taboo seemed to suffice.
Also less physically violent were videos that relished power imbalances over women. For example, in one a security guard insists a crying teenage shoplifter has sex in return for being set free. Later I found elsewhere on the site a series of videos on the theme of "Fake Taxi Driver", in which women are in the back of black cabs that are driven to remote country lanes for sex. Another from the same source were "Fake Cops", in which vulnerable women are sexually exploited. In the light of high-profile court cases in the UK involving taxi drivers or police these were both disturbing. On the site, "teen" was one of the most popular categories. The site is keen to label teen as "18+", which is not exactly how "teen" is commonly understood.
In none of the 32 videos were men shown to lack power. At the end of nearly every video women's faces were coated with semen. Where was the Baxter-approved consensual non-violent sex with no family members and no teens? Out of my sample, women were makin' whoopee in only three.
Few academics have attempted to codify the videos on porn sites. In 2019 Eran Shor, a sociology professor at McGill University in Canada, found that 43 per cent of a sample of Pornhub videos included visible aggression, with 15 per cent of videos featuring non-consensual aggression. "Teen" female performers were more likely to feature in videos with titles suggesting aggression, and were more likely to act as if they liked a male performer being physically aggressive towards them.
In 2021 a study led by Fiona Vera-Gray, then assistant professor in the law department of Durham University, used web crawlers to analyse the titles on the most popular three porn websites in the UK, including Pornhub. "Despite heated public and scholarly debate, there is surprisingly little research on the content of mainstream online pornography," she and her researchers wrote in the British Journal of Criminology.
Vera-Gray's data set of more than 150,000 titles made it the largest study of online porn to date. "Sexual violence in pornography is mainstream," the study concluded. The word "teen" was the most frequently occuring word in the whole data set, and was even more common in the videos coded as describing sexual violence. " 'Teen' is thus a more common way to describe pornography than any description of a sex act or body part." They found four main types of sexual violence: most common was sex portrayed between family members; the second was physical aggression; the third were titles advertising non-consensual creation of porn, such as "revenge porn", "upskirting" and "spy-cams" (it is not known if these videos are in reality the result of this illegal activity). The last implied coercion and exploitation, with title keywords like "very young" and "schoolgirl".
As the study points out, it is "more common for descriptions of even the most serious sexual offences to be positioned as ordinary or even humorous". Jokey exclamation marks are a hallmark of the titles for some of the most upsetting material.
Sometimes the women seem to like their bodies being punished, sometimes they seem in agony. The man always likes it when the woman is being punished. I cannot imagine how confusing this would be as a teen's first encounter with sex.
I very much wanted to talk to Vera-Gray, to process what I had seen. She agreed that once you detached the videos from their primary purpose of arousal, the material was "confronting".
"A lot is about women's humiliation and degradation," she said. The videos shown to first-time porn users "could be significantly implicated in muddying the waters between consensual and sexual violence".
"I think that every parent, teacher and policymaker needs to actually go and see what is on these sites themselves," Vera-Gray said. This should be done in a "cold light of day" way, she said, that takes sexual arousal out of the debate.
I kept wondering: if this was another medium, say a wildly popular theatre show among teenage girls and women, that involved young men being humiliated, bound, in pain and sprayed with female body fluids, would we be having more of a conversation? I reread my old copy of Dworkin's analysis of porn as misogyny, written in 1989 "the joy of pain, the pleasure of abuse". Andrea, I thought, you predicted it all.
In one video I saw on the Pornhub site the man experiments with suffocation, the woman's throat is restricted by a penis, and at that point the man, for a few seconds, closes her nostrils with his fingers too.
But the video I found most distressing was one of my original 32. It is described as an encounter with a "teen babysitter", in which the man keeps hurting the girl in different ways. There is facial abuse in which she retches, near-vomiting. Some slapping and hard hair-pulling. Her saying "please", which the man seemed to take as a sexual overture, I interpreted as her begging for her life. Before I went outside for another look at the sky, I scrolled the comments. "Wow," said the first one. "So passionate."

Holy shit! I never knew porn like this existed. Sadly porn won’t be banned any time soon as it’s a multi-billion business. Since when has sexual abuse been glamourised, I feel like I’ve been living in a cave.

TheHandmaiden · 12/05/2023 22:15

This will include a lot of husbands here, don't kid yourself. This isn't driven by teenage boys

QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat · 12/05/2023 22:20

Frogger8395 · 12/05/2023 21:39

You've been really irresponsible by allowing him unfiltered internet access.

What a helpful post.

Mischance · 12/05/2023 22:21

No, he isn't vile. He is a child, at a vulnerable age, and potentially could have been groomed or pressured into accessing/exploring these materials. - definitely this.

This is a boy awash in hormones - he gets shown this stuff and possibly has an unbidden sexual response to it - how confusing is that for him? - how does he deal with that? Where can he turn?

He needs help not vilification. He needs the love and support of his parents to make sense of this, which it seems they are giving. Yes - explain how serious this is in every way (legally, effect on future relationships etc.) but do not reject him - he is the same boy as he was a few years ago before any of this blew up and needs the same love and support.

alwaysandforevernow · 12/05/2023 22:24

QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat · 12/05/2023 22:20

What a helpful post.

To be fair, the OP seems to have a really good understanding as to how her DS has ended up on this path and very much links this to his long term access to the internet:

"DS has been under the spell of influencers and appears to have developed a misogynistic view of the world that involves women rightfully belonging to men and violence against women being normal and correct. Through YouTube videos, Twitter memes and the like, he seems to have followed this thinking straight down the path to violent porn."

izimbra · 12/05/2023 22:51

"It is tragic that young boys are exposed to this vile stuff,"

not just boys, girls too. :-( My daughter was shown hardcore porn on someone's phone in year 8. My sons were exposed to it in primary school by another child.

hereiamagainn · 12/05/2023 22:53

Hairsterical · 12/05/2023 22:06

Someone mentioned a story this week in the Times so I looked it up. I hope I'm not breaking any copyright rules here but anyone interested in this topic should read this:

I'm watching what the kids are watching: porn. Most of it is disturbing
10 May 2023
The Times

As a new report points to the impact of violent pornography on British children, Helen Rumbelow downloads the most popular content for a day's viewing
Just before my day of watching porn a male friend said, "Wow, you get the best jobs." I wasn't actually sure what to expect. I assumed it would involve becoming at first titillated by, then desensitised to, the endless repetition of poles and holes; the glossy boobs and bums hypnotically rising and falling before my eyes, something like the visual eroticism of Gregg Wallace inspecting an iced bun factory. At first fun and then cloying.
Naughty, but nice.
Instead, when my time was up, marked by my teenagers getting home teenagers who are now way past 11, the average age of first exposure to video porn in the UK I found myself longing for desensitisation. I felt like I had witnessed sexual assaults and torture. For days, I couldn't get the pain these women experienced out of my head.
It wasn't like watching a horror film, when you know they use fake blood and phoney knives. The strangulation, gagging, binding and slapping, the glassy dead eyes of the teenage girl set upon with extreme force, was real. Real violence, humiliation and punishment. It didn't help my brain that the women were being paid perhaps to suck it up. It didn't help my brain to know the suffering was for such a good cause: male pleasure. I felt contaminated by sadism.
The influence of porn is now profound. This week the children's commissioner used statutory powers to analyse more than 500 case files of sexual abuse between under-18s provided by police. In 50 per cent of cases the interview transcripts referred to acts of sexual violence specific to pornography such as strangulation and slapping.
Some teenagers who carried out the abuse referred to their porn exposure as excessive, one saying, "I was really badly addicted to it at one point." An earlier study by the NSPCC found that one in ten schoolchildren aged 12 to 13 were worried they were already addicted to porn.
In 2016 the Journal of Interpersonal Violence published findings of a survey of almost 5,000 boys aged 14 to 17, which found an association: the more boys watched porn and the more they were sexually coercive, the more likely they were to send explicit images and the less respect they had for girls.
Yet for all this talk of the side-effects of porn, we don't discuss the porn itself. This is unique. Usually when there is a moral panic about a liberal frontier, say, rock music, all sides could confidently argue from evidence. But people either don't want to watch porn, or watch it and don't want to admit it.
The public debate on the Online Safety Bill, a pioneering piece of legislation making its way through the House of Lords, is therefore spectacularly ill-informed. Hidden by shame, porn gets a free pass. I recently explored the social media world of teenagers like my children for another article, but I was missing the bare-naked elephant in the room.
At 9am on a fresh Monday morning after the scrabbling to get the kids to school, I put on a wash of football kit and sat down with a cup of tea to watch Pornhub. Full disclosure: this wasn't even the first time I have investigated porn for The Times.
In May 1999, 24 years ago, I was a young reporter in the newsroom with a scoop. It was the battle between the censors at the British Board of Film Classification, who wanted to maintain the ban on sexual penetration, or "hardcore", on screen, and an obscure Home Office committee who overruled them. The porn video was called Makin' Whoopee! and it subsequently went missing from my desk; I assume someone was interested in the legal position.
The liberalising Home Office committee included Biddy Baxter, the former Blue Peter editor. When we interviewed Baxter about her decision she was idealistic. In Makin' Whoopee!, Baxter said, "everything was totally consensual and did not involve violence against women" (true).
At a subsequent appeal I heard a barrister invoke the spirit of the 1960 censorship trial for Lady Chatterley's Lover. Looking back, the Makin' Whoopee! case was seminal. Not that the ruling mattered much: soon video cassettes and censorship would be made irrelevant by the internet.
It was more a symbol of a new era of "sex-positive post-feminism", where we uptight Brits would become sophisticated Europeans. As a young woman in the 1990s I was living this Blairite and "lads' mags" cultural change. I found the porn-denouncing views of writers such as Andrea Dworkin un-fun. I was keen to be open-minded, not a prude.
Now, clicking straight onto Pornhub the website is free in every sense and didn't offer even a cursory check of my age I discovered what we started in 1999. Every video is "hardcore" now, of course, but Baxter's hopes about consent and violence seem to be "wrecked", to use a common porn euphemism for abusive sex.
Pornhub was the fourth most visited website in the United States in March 2023, according to Semrush traffic analytics, and the UK is its fifth largest market. It still gets billions of views, despite the fallout it experienced from The New York Times investigation in 2020 that concluded that of the more than six million new videos posted on the site each year, "many depict child abuse and non-consensual violence". I chose Pornhub as I could safely assume it has the most brand recognition for teens.
As a snapshot I picked the "most popular in the UK" page for that morning. There were 32 thumbnails of videos to click on. I scanned each one: mostly just a few minutes long and most involved people speaking in eastern European languages.
Twelve of the 32 showed men being physically abusive to women. This ranged from hair-pulling, slapping or holding her arms behind her back to a harder range of violence. Four of them included scenes of something I found out was called "facial abuse", in which a woman's airway is blocked by a penis, what looked to me like a porn version of waterboarding torture.
In one a woman is immobilised and bound by four straps and a collar tightened around her neck. She ends up looking like a dead body found in the boot of a car. In another a young girl, dressed to look even younger in a pair of bunny ears and pastel socks, is held down by an enormous man pushing his hand on her neck while she is penetrated.
The sounds that came from my computer were those you might expect from a battle hospital: cries of pain, suction and "no, no, no". I won't yet tell you the worst video I saw as you may want to stop reading now. I started to have to take breaks to go outside and look at the sky and remember kindness.
The next largest category was that of "pseudo incest", with 11 videos. These depict sex between step-siblings or step-parents and adult stepchildren. Bizarrely, I found these videos a moment of calm because they were rarely violent; the violence of the taboo seemed to suffice.
Also less physically violent were videos that relished power imbalances over women. For example, in one a security guard insists a crying teenage shoplifter has sex in return for being set free. Later I found elsewhere on the site a series of videos on the theme of "Fake Taxi Driver", in which women are in the back of black cabs that are driven to remote country lanes for sex. Another from the same source were "Fake Cops", in which vulnerable women are sexually exploited. In the light of high-profile court cases in the UK involving taxi drivers or police these were both disturbing. On the site, "teen" was one of the most popular categories. The site is keen to label teen as "18+", which is not exactly how "teen" is commonly understood.
In none of the 32 videos were men shown to lack power. At the end of nearly every video women's faces were coated with semen. Where was the Baxter-approved consensual non-violent sex with no family members and no teens? Out of my sample, women were makin' whoopee in only three.
Few academics have attempted to codify the videos on porn sites. In 2019 Eran Shor, a sociology professor at McGill University in Canada, found that 43 per cent of a sample of Pornhub videos included visible aggression, with 15 per cent of videos featuring non-consensual aggression. "Teen" female performers were more likely to feature in videos with titles suggesting aggression, and were more likely to act as if they liked a male performer being physically aggressive towards them.
In 2021 a study led by Fiona Vera-Gray, then assistant professor in the law department of Durham University, used web crawlers to analyse the titles on the most popular three porn websites in the UK, including Pornhub. "Despite heated public and scholarly debate, there is surprisingly little research on the content of mainstream online pornography," she and her researchers wrote in the British Journal of Criminology.
Vera-Gray's data set of more than 150,000 titles made it the largest study of online porn to date. "Sexual violence in pornography is mainstream," the study concluded. The word "teen" was the most frequently occuring word in the whole data set, and was even more common in the videos coded as describing sexual violence. " 'Teen' is thus a more common way to describe pornography than any description of a sex act or body part." They found four main types of sexual violence: most common was sex portrayed between family members; the second was physical aggression; the third were titles advertising non-consensual creation of porn, such as "revenge porn", "upskirting" and "spy-cams" (it is not known if these videos are in reality the result of this illegal activity). The last implied coercion and exploitation, with title keywords like "very young" and "schoolgirl".
As the study points out, it is "more common for descriptions of even the most serious sexual offences to be positioned as ordinary or even humorous". Jokey exclamation marks are a hallmark of the titles for some of the most upsetting material.
Sometimes the women seem to like their bodies being punished, sometimes they seem in agony. The man always likes it when the woman is being punished. I cannot imagine how confusing this would be as a teen's first encounter with sex.
I very much wanted to talk to Vera-Gray, to process what I had seen. She agreed that once you detached the videos from their primary purpose of arousal, the material was "confronting".
"A lot is about women's humiliation and degradation," she said. The videos shown to first-time porn users "could be significantly implicated in muddying the waters between consensual and sexual violence".
"I think that every parent, teacher and policymaker needs to actually go and see what is on these sites themselves," Vera-Gray said. This should be done in a "cold light of day" way, she said, that takes sexual arousal out of the debate.
I kept wondering: if this was another medium, say a wildly popular theatre show among teenage girls and women, that involved young men being humiliated, bound, in pain and sprayed with female body fluids, would we be having more of a conversation? I reread my old copy of Dworkin's analysis of porn as misogyny, written in 1989 "the joy of pain, the pleasure of abuse". Andrea, I thought, you predicted it all.
In one video I saw on the Pornhub site the man experiments with suffocation, the woman's throat is restricted by a penis, and at that point the man, for a few seconds, closes her nostrils with his fingers too.
But the video I found most distressing was one of my original 32. It is described as an encounter with a "teen babysitter", in which the man keeps hurting the girl in different ways. There is facial abuse in which she retches, near-vomiting. Some slapping and hard hair-pulling. Her saying "please", which the man seemed to take as a sexual overture, I interpreted as her begging for her life. Before I went outside for another look at the sky, I scrolled the comments. "Wow," said the first one. "So passionate."

Thanks for posting this here to inform us, although I truly feel sick having read it.

Spambod · 12/05/2023 23:22

Irecan · 12/05/2023 18:11

I do not have a teenage son so cannot relate but work with teenagers in CAMHS (psychology related) and if I had a client like your child I would need to do a safeguard referral and explore the reason behind this behaviour, possible refer to therapy, explore any underlying causes that lead to this, such as grooming, bullying/ rejection (by women), low self esteem etc. I am not suggesting you jump the gun and assume any of these possible causalities however, I am suggesting you approach with some love and connection with your son at this time. He is still a child and needs guidance, firm boundaries and sexual education.

Does he speak to you about sex in general? Is this a normal topic of discussion in your home? If not, you might need to start this kind of communication gradually in a way he feels safe. Would he open up to his dad? Or another relative, younger than his parents but older than him might have more of an impact on him?

If he does speak to you about this then I would thread carefully about shaming him. He needs to know this content is wrong and abusive and these are humans, not objects BUT he is also human and has made some bad choices so needs a chance to put things right. Shaming and restricting him too harshly may damage your relationship and make him feel
misunderstood which will likely make him rebel and make those extreme groups seem much more fascinating.

I think giving him a bit of a scare like mentioning police have been in touch would be a good idea but only do this if you feel he won’t listen to you otherwise. I would also suggest restricting access to certain sites on your wifi etc as mentioned by other posters.

could you explain to him that there is nothing wrong with viewing consensual sex? You could explain that when he’s old enough he can even pay for porn and that way he knows it’s the most ethical choice? Perhaps you could watch some documentaries on the porn industry or on abuse survivors but this would have to be all done gradually and not just out of the blue or he might think you’ve gone mad!

His mother suggesting to him that he pays to watch ethical porn.
as a child there is nothing wrong with watching consensual sex.
don’t shame him for watching violent child sex abuse and kidnap.

jesus wept… you should not be anywhere near children.

alwaysandforevernow · 12/05/2023 23:42

"You could explain that when he’s old enough he can even pay for porn and that way he knows it’s the most ethical choice? "

"Because monetised filmed sexual activity is somehow by default ethical"

Some of the posters on this thread sound as though they were born yesterday.

ThrowAwayOne · 12/05/2023 23:51

Don't underestimate how much damage seeing this level of porn can do to a young persons brain. Having experience of this I'd urge you not to think a good talking to will erase what he's seen and, more importantly, how it made him feel. This will have long term effects on him and I'd seriously consider trying to find some help for him.

Freddiefox · 13/05/2023 00:45

ThrowAwayOne · 12/05/2023 23:51

Don't underestimate how much damage seeing this level of porn can do to a young persons brain. Having experience of this I'd urge you not to think a good talking to will erase what he's seen and, more importantly, how it made him feel. This will have long term effects on him and I'd seriously consider trying to find some help for him.

Who would you suggest the op takes her son to see?

NowZeusHasLainWithLeda · 13/05/2023 06:11

With the best will in the world, (and it's a very natural thing for parents to want to do), the OP seems now to have shifted over to "but they all do it" and is looking for backup to show that "they all do it".

As I said, there's a massive difference between burgeoning hormones (usually in much younger children, of both sexes) leading to a bit of googling, and the kind of porn use that the OP is describing in someone who is old enough, if it took his fancy, to go out there and enact some of what he's seen on someone's daughter. That cold hard fact alone should be enough for the apologists on this thread (and there are more than the one) to give their heads a wobble.

@Hairsterical have you looked on his phone? He won't just be accessing all this on the computer you've looked at.

As for who to turn to, the organisation mentioned above, the NSPCC confidential helpline. He's still young enough (just) to also be seen as a victim. School- though again, as I said, this is one that we'd not be dealing with internally but would be handing over immediately, and with some urgency. I've only had one case with similar circumstances. The boy was 16 though when we handed the information over. He has been prosecuted for storing footage of sexual abuse on his computer. It wasn't his parents who brought it to the school's attention.

IsThereAnEchoInHere · 13/05/2023 06:30

TheHandmaiden · 12/05/2023 22:15

This will include a lot of husbands here, don't kid yourself. This isn't driven by teenage boys

That’s what I was thinking.

Don’t get me wrong, I can’t stand porn/sex industry, but I was suprised by the comments.

Studies show (and men say they’re all at it) that many/most men watch this stuff.
And types op talks about are front page, average stuff.

So anyone angry at op/her son (and I am NOT justifying anything) should most likely be angry at the men in their own house/lives.
They’re watching the same stuff.

Flufferblub · 13/05/2023 06:39

See if you can put a block on the WiFi. We have sky shield that blocks porn at our house.

Keep a close eye on his screen time and devices, and maybe get him to therapy.

Alwaystheweather · 13/05/2023 06:46

Irritateandunreasonable · 12/05/2023 19:51

I think he needs urgent psychological help. This is highly worrying.

This is not normal porn and is extremely concerning, particularly at this young age. Not to mention the way he’s talking about women.

Please, get your son some help.

It IS normal porn nowadays though. That’s the point.

Violent porn, rape. Even porn with ‘consensual’ sex is all about power and domination of men over women.

It’s genuinely disturbing what all this says about how men really view women. If men were actually sickened by women being abused, this stuff would have no market. But it does, and it’s a huge world wide one And women can never have equality whilst so many men are masturbating to this stuff. women can never have equality whilst so many women are internalizing that this is what sex with men is about, and this is what should turn them on.

With my own boys, I want to find a way to tell them what good sex is about. I’ll be blunt and tell them that porn will make them shit in bed, it will. Good sex is like a sexual meditation, it’s about being able to focus on the sense, touch, taste, sight, smell, really concentrate on that, being attuned to your partner’s response and pleasure. That mutually feeding of each other’s pleasure and that enhancing your own. Good sex is about mutuality. Good sex with a partner is connecting and emotional. That’s good sex.

I hate the way porn and the kink/ fetish stuff has programmed people to think good sex is about domination, kink, extremity. That anything else is to be derided as vanilla’, and no-one wants that label! So instead ‘good’ sex is about slapping, spitting, hair pulling. They couldn’t be more wrong.

SparklyBlackKitten · 13/05/2023 06:49

So you gave your 14 a phone with unlimited internet access (until 8.30 pm apparently) and complete internet acces on the computer.... but you blame influencers for his path to misogynistic porn. Right...

ThePoetsWife · 13/05/2023 07:03

Sorry but calling the content "highly inappropriate" is minimising it - you need to lay it on how sick and perverted it is and that it's likely to be illegal.

Your DH needs to step up and talk to him about sex, healthy relationships and what normal consensual sex looks like. I can't believe you both left sex education to the school - it's your job, not theirs!

VestaTilley · 13/05/2023 07:28

Take away all his phones and devices and cut off the wifi at home. Tell the school and sit him down and explain - again and again - how pornography is objectification, not real sex, awful to women and shouldn’t be legal.

Festivfrenzy · 13/05/2023 07:51

floppybit · 12/05/2023 19:40

You can't access porn in my house as our Virgin Media account has content controls on it, I thought everyone with children would do this? You need to contact your internet provider asap and get this set up!

We need to set security up before our kids are old enough to start looking at this horrible stuff. What about mobile phone networks- do they have parental controls that can do the same blanket block on porn sites?
Schools should be promoting these controls to parents if they're not already. We get emails about educate your child but as well we all need to know how to block this stuff!

Petrarkanian · 13/05/2023 08:01

My kids school, asks all parents to put parental controls on their kids phones. The heads rational is that parents should have controls on their WiFi at home so kids are accessing porn on their data. He's not wrong and I think it's an excellent policy, just reading this reinforces it.

They banned mobiles from sight 4 years ago and they are hot on safeguarding, an excellent school.

Parents whinge but they knew the rules before they chose the school.

Lateliein · 13/05/2023 08:31

I am a secondary school teacher and the constant, low level misogyny is exhausting... It's depressing, it's concerning, it's endemic.

It's also unsurprising given the disturbing content freely available online. Which teens are trying to navigate and understand.

Yes, you can restrict access. Yes, you can ground a teen, take away devices.

If you're naive, you can berate him for being vile, call him a pervert. Even though millions are accessing the same thing, so by that reasoning, there are millions of perverts (actually there probably are).

But this does not tackle the real problem. The teen will still see content through friends, at other houses, in the street, at school. There should be more anger, more campaigning, more understanding, more education regarding the damage this type of pornography does to young people.

Start having more conversations with your teens. They're difficult but vital. Those calling him a pervert and vile are missing the point: this is a problem on a mass scale level. I don't have all the answers, but I do know that pretty much every male I've taught loves Andrew Tate 😭 I even had a dad complain when I shut down conversation about Tate because his son is entitled to a voice. 🤷

Showmethefood · 13/05/2023 09:29

Honestly don’t think just because you’ve got parental locks your child is safe. We had it all but our son still accessed porn via a loophole - we had no idea how. Now we’ve got max parental controls but we were gutted when it happened. Parents on here saying “how could you let that happen - we have parental locks etc “ - don’t be so sure of yourself and harsh on others. It can still happen. Even now with max security we still check his history. You should never be so arrogant to think it won’t happen to yours and that you’re the better parent because you’ve got “blocks/security” etc.

Regulus · 13/05/2023 09:31

floppybit · 12/05/2023 19:40

You can't access porn in my house as our Virgin Media account has content controls on it, I thought everyone with children would do this? You need to contact your internet provider asap and get this set up!

The content controls are not enough, it makes it more difficult but porn is embedded in site like twitter which are allowed to bypass content controls, and the less computer literate can access this.

The online saftey bill hasn't gone through, the default setting is to allow porn, we do need to address this as a society.

And sadly I agree with pp, saying it is now 'normal porn' isn't being an apologist. Brutality has become mainstream, the first experience of sex includes anal, beating and mistreatment.

Regulus · 13/05/2023 09:35

MummyJasmin · 12/05/2023 20:27

Im nearly 40 and I daren't access anything so extreme. He's only 14!
As you've said yourself he's gone down a rabbit hole and the extreme nature will only go worse if allowed to continue.
Please don't brush this off as "a teenager finding his own way" or "testing his boundaries" etc.
You sound like a great mum for speaking up and wanting to do something. Please speak to a professional in this area. I am sure they deal with this kind of stuff daily!
All the best.

'Daren't access' ? This isn't on the dark Web, it's on social media, porn hub front page. All free and easy to access.

Do you know the other main type of porn that comes up on porn hub? Daddy and step daughter, step mum and son, step siblings. This is what is being consumed up and down the country, as a pp said it is made because there is a market for it.

I think the majority of women don't realise what is free and easily accessible, if they did I'd hope there would be more support for change.

Regulus · 13/05/2023 09:36

Alwaystheweather · 13/05/2023 06:46

It IS normal porn nowadays though. That’s the point.

Violent porn, rape. Even porn with ‘consensual’ sex is all about power and domination of men over women.

It’s genuinely disturbing what all this says about how men really view women. If men were actually sickened by women being abused, this stuff would have no market. But it does, and it’s a huge world wide one And women can never have equality whilst so many men are masturbating to this stuff. women can never have equality whilst so many women are internalizing that this is what sex with men is about, and this is what should turn them on.

With my own boys, I want to find a way to tell them what good sex is about. I’ll be blunt and tell them that porn will make them shit in bed, it will. Good sex is like a sexual meditation, it’s about being able to focus on the sense, touch, taste, sight, smell, really concentrate on that, being attuned to your partner’s response and pleasure. That mutually feeding of each other’s pleasure and that enhancing your own. Good sex is about mutuality. Good sex with a partner is connecting and emotional. That’s good sex.

I hate the way porn and the kink/ fetish stuff has programmed people to think good sex is about domination, kink, extremity. That anything else is to be derided as vanilla’, and no-one wants that label! So instead ‘good’ sex is about slapping, spitting, hair pulling. They couldn’t be more wrong.

Reposting as I think this is an excellent reply.

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