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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think family court can't be THAT bad?

207 replies

RabbitWarrren · 09/04/2023 17:44

I have gone down a rabbit hole of threads on here and Twitter accounts of women fighting to get their kids back after abusive and/or rich men have got full custody or majority custody. Some truly awful stories

Am I being a total cow to think there must be more to it? Loving, caring, devoted mothers losing their kids to men who have criminal records? Or even just losing their kids entirely to men who never lifted a finger before?

I don't mean that these stories aren't horrific and unjust. But just that it must be something must be more complex for a mum to lose their kids?

Am I being naive? Victim blaming? Is the family court system really that criminal?

OP posts:
Hotvimto3 · 09/04/2023 18:23

Its worse than bad. Actually unbelievable. Doesn't put childrens safety first and is all geared up to the Dads 'rights'. Its un utterly unprofessional and dangerous institution.

LpPp · 09/04/2023 18:32

It really is that bad.
Contact centres are even worse! You would not believe it unless you’ve been dragged into the top secret world of family court.

Its horrendous.

for context- my abusive ex launched himself across the table at me IN THE COURT ROOM AT A HEARING and smacked me across the head. Then he went downstairs and attacked the security guard and my dad. The consequence? Absolutely nothing. At the next hearing they just carried on as if it didn’t happen.

my children were lied to to get them into a contact centre, by being told he wasn’t in there. When they realised he was in there they wouldn’t let them out. My eldest (9 at the time) physically fought the staff to get her and her sister (7) out of there. The manager told me to force them to go back in or she would tell the court to do a section 37 to start looking to take them into care.

EarringsandLipstick · 09/04/2023 18:46

I'm in Ireland, not the UK.
But I think if you've never experience family law proceedings, then you cannot imagine how destructive, unfair & prejudiced they can be.

I think the situation here might not be quite as bad - but it's not good. Especially for situations regarding abuse. The system is set up to facilitate men who want to perpetuate abuse of their ex / children via the courts.

Original poster
RabbitWarrren · 09/04/2023 19:31

Oh god. I'm so sorry @LpPp that is absolutely horrendous. Absolutely awful. I really hope things get much better for you and your kids.

I just can't get my head round it.

My DH is disrespectful, sulky and takes me for granted. I can't stand the thought of being married to him. But I feel like I'm throwing my small kids to the wolves because I know he's got it in him to use them against me and seek revenge.

I can't believe women and children are trapped, whether they leave or not.

OP posts:
SmokyForTheWin · 09/04/2023 19:34

If I'd known before I started how bad family court is, I would have stayed unhappily married. Anything is better than this.

Wittow · 09/04/2023 19:36

There's no way anyone would get away with actual assault in a courtroom.

Family Court is fair, in my professional experience. With children's welfare as the "paramount principle" determining decisions. But, it's not a beauty contest. Good enough parenting is good enough.

mamabear715 · 09/04/2023 19:37

It's not fun. :-(

adriftabroad · 09/04/2023 19:39

I stayed married until DD was 14 because of this. (Spain) Now she can choose.

HunterHearstHelmsley · 09/04/2023 19:40

In my experience, it's appalling. My friend lost custody of her children to a controlling ex. She had legal aid due to previous domestic abuse. He told so many lies about her. She proved time and again he wasn't telling the truth but he'd come up with something else. It seemed to be believed he had lied umpteen times in the past but this allegation is true.

I would never have believed it if I hadn't witnessed it first hand. My friend felt like giving up so many times, thankfully she galvanised herself.

It has been a few years now and the tide seems to be changing for her but the toll taken on her and the children has been immense.

EnVogue · 09/04/2023 19:40

You clearly are very naive.
I'm 3 years into the family court now. My daughter and I fled under a section 47 via the local authority... Had to leave all our belongings behind and stay in a refuge.. There was a 3 year catalogue of abuse documented by medical records, children's services, police, endless...

First hearing.. Despite Cafcass not recommending any contact in the interim... Judge ignores everything and grants contact in the community with me doing handovers with him via social workers... Fortunately, Cafcass intervened and took the matter back to the judge, contact was allowed to continue but in a contact centre.. We're still here 3 years later.. Just had a psychological report where the psychologist has said all contact should stop as he's so dangerous.. Unfortunately we now also have a Cafcass guardian who continually makes excuses for my ec.. So who even knows what will happen as we approach the end..

LpPp · 09/04/2023 19:42

SmokyForTheWin · 09/04/2023 19:34

If I'd known before I started how bad family court is, I would have stayed unhappily married. Anything is better than this.

I understand that feeling 100%. I had felt like that so many times. We had 4 years of family court trauma before a new social worker stepped in (when doing the section 37) and put a stop to it all. I will be forever grateful to her.

Without my families support I would have gone back. I know I would have, just to stop the trauma of the contact centre. We had to go every 2 weeks for 4 years… and my children NEVER agreed to go (in except that last time) even after being coerced, bullied, threatened, lied to, dragged out of the car.

LpPp · 09/04/2023 19:44

Wittow · 09/04/2023 19:36

There's no way anyone would get away with actual assault in a courtroom.

Family Court is fair, in my professional experience. With children's welfare as the "paramount principle" determining decisions. But, it's not a beauty contest. Good enough parenting is good enough.

Sorry- are you calling me a liar?

People like you are the problem.

Anonymouseposter · 09/04/2023 19:45

I worked in a role that brought me into contact with CAFCASS and with people going through the family courts. I saw both men and women treated unfairly and with prejudice, as many of the CAFCASS officers brought their own prejudices to the job.
It isn't at all a easy as a CAFCASS officer can be working with highly manipulative people and with children who are confused and have divided loyalties. I have no faith at all in the system.
Likewise I have great concerns about CAMHS, some good work is done but damage is also done.

SpringingSpring · 09/04/2023 19:46

I have a friend who has been battling through & with the system for years because of her incredibly abusive ex.

I had faith in the system until I witnessed the frankly absurd decisions that have been made, the trauma for her & her kids continues. Horrendous.

SquidwardSquarepants · 09/04/2023 19:47

This reply has been deleted

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Omm · 09/04/2023 19:49

It’s that bad and worse

Brotherlove · 09/04/2023 19:51

I think I may have got lucky with my (female) judge.
She took no crap from ex, demanded explanations from him, refused to give what he demanded, absolutely put the kids first as far as she was able to within the confines of the law.
Cafcass were another matter.....

Eggseggseverywhere · 09/04/2023 19:52

Post family court I had ptsd and was anorexic..
Took years to rebuild the relationship with my dc. Never succeeded with 2 sadly..

Wittow · 09/04/2023 19:52

Anonymouseposter · 09/04/2023 19:45

I worked in a role that brought me into contact with CAFCASS and with people going through the family courts. I saw both men and women treated unfairly and with prejudice, as many of the CAFCASS officers brought their own prejudices to the job.
It isn't at all a easy as a CAFCASS officer can be working with highly manipulative people and with children who are confused and have divided loyalties. I have no faith at all in the system.
Likewise I have great concerns about CAMHS, some good work is done but damage is also done.

Agreed. Nothing in the public sector is perfect, but the rabbit holes on twitter that the OP refers to are posted mostly by deranged conspiracy theorists.

Wittow · 09/04/2023 19:55

"many of the CAFCASS officers brought their own prejudices to the job."

very true.... and also why there are so many layers of representation to the process, each party having their own barrister etc. It's important to challenge all these assumptions.

Arcadia · 09/04/2023 20:04

Wittow · 09/04/2023 19:55

"many of the CAFCASS officers brought their own prejudices to the job."

very true.... and also why there are so many layers of representation to the process, each party having their own barrister etc. It's important to challenge all these assumptions.

But lots of people don't have barristers or representatives now, due to legal aid being cut so much now, lots of people completely unrepresented.

DarkDarkNight · 09/04/2023 20:07

The tales I have heard that have actually made it to the media, and the appalling stories on this thread tell me otherwise. The problem is it is so secretive we don’t really know what is going on.

ChangingUsernamesLikeUnderwear · 09/04/2023 20:14

Nothing in the public sector is perfect, but the rabbit holes on twitter that the OP refers to are posted mostly by deranged conspiracy theorists.

Yeah, I used to think this before I watched a close relative get dragged through the family courts by her abuser and her young DC forced into (unwanted and very damaging) contact with him. I would never have believed the levels of misogyny within the system had I not seen it close up. “Not perfect” doesn’t come close, I’m afraid.

The channel 4 Dispatches programme “Torn Apart: Family Courts Uncovered” is well worth watching.

MoreSleepPleasee · 09/04/2023 20:15

In the cases I've seen it's always been the best choice. I've seen rich men and mums awarded no or little contact as it's in the best interest of the child. Yanbu there is always more to it.

Original poster
RabbitWarrren · 09/04/2023 20:15

Fuck @SmokyForTheWin that says it all really. I'm so sorry.

I will be reconsidering my decision to start my separation plan properly. My kids are in no danger or distress whatsoever. How can I justify making their lives so much worse.

OP posts: