Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Friend takes offence

268 replies

Booboojump · 08/04/2023 02:49

So one of my friends took major offence to my wording…. She called me out on it and now I’m embarrassed

I invited my friend around this past week with her children via text.

“Would you and the boys like to come over for some lunch and a play in the garden tomorrow, the weather is looking much better”

She has 4 boys, 3 being the same ages as mine. All friendly with each other and get along great

As she came in I used called her children “the boys” would “you boys” like a drink…
she sat down and asked me not to call them “the boys”. I replied a rather embarrassed yeah of course… silence for a few mins then I had start the convo up as it was awkward as hell.

Im terms of gender, im as liberal as they come (sister is a in a same gender relationship and identities as masc) As far as I’m aware all the children identify as the gender they were born as and are typical boys boys.

I would normally message people with multiple children “the girls/boys/children depending of the children's genders rather than writing a full Tom, Dick, Harry and Bob!

I feel awkward now there is tension between us. like I need to watch myself what I say as not to offend!

OP posts:
ShandaLear · 08/04/2023 04:40

‘What would you like me to call them?’

She obviously has some deeper issues but she didn’t need to be a dick about it.

Rottweilermummy · 08/04/2023 04:44

I've got 3 boys too was always boys or lads ,intrigued to know what she wanted you to call them presumably their individual names each time, prob be offended if you said lads or kids. You're not unreasonable though it's just a thing we say , trying to get all names out each time, if theyre long names just shorten them next time maybe she'll be happy for you to say boys then lol

Ktime · 08/04/2023 04:50

Stop inviting her round, you shouldn’t feel awkward in your own home. She will likely get worse.

CoalCraft · 08/04/2023 05:10

Or it could just be an irritation with the need to refer to their sex at all, they are boys, of course, but it doesn’t really need mentioning any more than you’d say ‘Do the brown haired kids want a drink?’ if they all had brown hair. I read something on our attitudes to sex/gender a while ago, and it highlighted how we do this from a young age, it’s ‘Right girls come and do this, ok you boys go over there’, Rather than just ‘you kids’, and that it’s a constant reinforcement to our kids that their sex is one of the most important things about them.

This. I have two girls but refer to them as "the kids" unless their sex is relevant. I dislike people calling them "the girls" because it feels like a needless gender reinforcement most of the time. That they're girls isn't (usually) important. I don't mention it to others though and probably wouldn't unless I felt they were doing it to make some sort of point.

I also try to avoid "good girl" etc., though sometimes slip unfortunately. To used to doing it with the cat!

IP, I don't think your friend was BU to ask and I do think you're making a bit of a mountain out of a molehill.

VeganStar · 08/04/2023 05:12

From now on I’d refer to them as your children. “ do your children need a drink?”
I wouldn’t think you could go wrong with that.
what does she call them when addressing them collectively in conversation?

DrMarciaFieldstone · 08/04/2023 05:20

Ktime · 08/04/2023 04:50

Stop inviting her round, you shouldn’t feel awkward in your own home. She will likely get worse.

This, I couldn’t indulge this nonsense/rudeness.

FrumptyMumpty · 08/04/2023 05:29

I call my son “boy” all the time, it’s practically part of his name. It doesn’t reinforce any behaviour because he does whatever he wants and the name remains.

The gender identity debate has descended into a joke.

I’d avoid inviting the friends around again. Maybe her boys, but not her.

LAMPS1 · 08/04/2023 05:39

You said three of the for boys are the same age as your dc. Are they triplets ?
Maybe she feels they don’t each receive enough personal attention…and it’s nothing to do with gender identity ?

NameChangeNumber359 · 08/04/2023 05:41

That could have been handled so much better by th

NameChangeNumber359 · 08/04/2023 05:45

Try again....
That could have been handled so much better by the 'friend'. Why not just say what her problem was with the term 'the boys'? Why sit there in awkward silence? Imagine being invited to someone's house and acting like that. Pain in the arse.

KickHimInTheCrotch · 08/04/2023 05:52

There's no need to feel embarrassed. She's asked you to use different language, fairly and appropriately, when speaking to/about her children. It's quite easy to just do that, or at least try to.

It's very clear that way the world is at the moment gender identity is an issue for some people and maybe she doesn't want her children to be assumed to belong to a homogeneous group of "boys". Maybe one of her children has started to question their gender identity and she is trying to get her own head around it. It probably felt awkward to her to have to bring this up with you but we can all expect to have a lot more conversations like this in the future I'm afraid.

Londonnight · 08/04/2023 05:59

I have four sons, and even though they are now all adults, myself , and family still call them boys'. eg, if they are asking how they are, they will say how are the boys' or what are the boys' up to? Never bothered me, or them. I certainly have never taken offence.

nettie434 · 08/04/2023 06:00

It's not what she asked that's unreasonable, it's how she did it. She made you feel uncomfortable and hasn't explained why she didn't like you using 'the boys' to help you understand why she doesn't like it.

Personally, if I had 4 boys and a friend offered me lunch and a chance for them to play in the garden with their children, I'd be more pleased about that than their use of collective nouns.

Barbecuebeans · 08/04/2023 06:14

RoseGoldEagle · 08/04/2023 04:30

Though having said all that, she needs to understand that she has 4 boys and they will be referred to this way, and she can’t really police other people’s language- if she really feels strongly about it she could have had a nicer chat with you about it and not just effectively told you off and made you feel bad about it!

It's this that gets me particularly. I don't like people policing people's language in a way that's shaming. She could have just said something like, I prefer not to use the term 'the boys' because of x,y,z reason. The fact she went silent suggests she thinks you made some terrible faux pas, like calling someone a racist slur.

My first thought is that she's become part of the identity police where some people need to virtue signal that they're so down with identity politics. Even if someone said something unintentionally racist for example it still works better to explain in a calm way why that thing is unacceptable, not telling someone off and giving them the silent treatment. Shutting someone down is what makes people turn off and stop listening.

TBH I don't think I could be doing with her. You're an adult and you don't need to be told off for saying something that isn't mainstream offensive. It might be her preference but she doesn't get to punish you. Uggghhhh.

gloriousmulch · 08/04/2023 06:14

Bit of an odd request but I’d probably just say ok and move on- why has it led to tension between you?

Barbecuebeans · 08/04/2023 06:18

gloriousmulch · 08/04/2023 06:14

Bit of an odd request but I’d probably just say ok and move on- why has it led to tension between you?

Because she gave her the silent treatment. People can tell the difference between companionable silence and punishment. Its obvious. That in itself creates tension.

thegrain · 08/04/2023 06:20

Goldie2021 · 08/04/2023 03:43

I have 3 sisters and we were always called “the girls” It always irritated the crap out of me.

Yes it annoyed me too.

user1492757084 · 08/04/2023 06:21

Perhaps she is just meaning that you lump the children together instead of using their names as the default setting.

It might not be a sex thing.
I would not invite her over again until I knew a lot more about her. I would remember to learn her kids names and take note of how she behaves in larger groups. She sounds hard work instead of relaxing, tolerant and good fun.
Good humoured friends with not too many hang ups are the best types for your children to play with.

Randommother · 08/04/2023 06:23

RoseGoldEagle · 08/04/2023 04:25

It could be that she wanted a daughter and the constant mention of ‘the boys’ irritates her for that reason (may sound ridiculous but since there are whole forums dedicated to gender disappointment it’s not impossible).

Or it could just be an irritation with the need to refer to their sex at all, they are boys, of course, but it doesn’t really need mentioning any more than you’d say ‘Do the brown haired kids want a drink?’ if they all had brown hair. I read something on our attitudes to sex/gender a while ago, and it highlighted how we do this from a young age, it’s ‘Right girls come and do this, ok you boys go over there’, Rather than just ‘you kids’, and that it’s a constant reinforcement to our kids that their sex is one of the most important things about them (and apparently this can feed into gender inequality down the line). Not saying I necessarily agree but I thought it was interesting, and it has made me notice more how often we do this without thinking in situations where mentioning the child’s sex has no bearing on anything, so I just wonder if she’s coming at it from this angle.

Sounds like wokeism bullshit to me. Following this logic using “the kids” makes their age the most important thing about them - in that way madness lies! We naturally refer to groups of people by a common trait, it’s the way things have been forever. Do we need to overthink everything for fear of offence?!

KitKatLove · 08/04/2023 06:28

I don’t know why you’re assuming this has anything to do with gender. They have names and it’s rude not to use them. I’m a twin and being referred to as a collective is infuriating.

TakeMyStrongHand · 08/04/2023 06:29

How old are they?

Perhaps one is questioning their identity and will be triggered by it so she is protecting them. Perhaps she wanted girls and is just fed up of hearing "the boys".

Whoever I hear "the boys" it makes me think of the film Romeo and Juliet where the boys are introduced and it plays music saying "the boys"

Perhaps she is just fed up of the phrase and it makes her cringe.

Was the rest of the visit awkward?

I don't think it's anything to deep and I'm wondering how she asked and if she meant to cause offence

Backstreets · 08/04/2023 06:29

there is literally nothing wrong with calling boys boys and she’s got a hard self imposed road ahead if she’s going to demand this of everyone she meets.

Aintnomountainhighenough79 · 08/04/2023 06:33

You have no need to be embarrassed, if anyone should be embarrassed it's your friend for pulling you up on this and making you feel uncomfortable.

NeedToChangeName · 08/04/2023 06:34

CoalCraft · 08/04/2023 05:10

Or it could just be an irritation with the need to refer to their sex at all, they are boys, of course, but it doesn’t really need mentioning any more than you’d say ‘Do the brown haired kids want a drink?’ if they all had brown hair. I read something on our attitudes to sex/gender a while ago, and it highlighted how we do this from a young age, it’s ‘Right girls come and do this, ok you boys go over there’, Rather than just ‘you kids’, and that it’s a constant reinforcement to our kids that their sex is one of the most important things about them.

This. I have two girls but refer to them as "the kids" unless their sex is relevant. I dislike people calling them "the girls" because it feels like a needless gender reinforcement most of the time. That they're girls isn't (usually) important. I don't mention it to others though and probably wouldn't unless I felt they were doing it to make some sort of point.

I also try to avoid "good girl" etc., though sometimes slip unfortunately. To used to doing it with the cat!

IP, I don't think your friend was BU to ask and I do think you're making a bit of a mountain out of a molehill.

I rather agree with this. I tend to refer to "the kids" rather than "the boys / girls"

Shoxfordian · 08/04/2023 06:37

Maybe you should have asked her a bit more about why she felt that way at the time - it doesn’t seem a big deal to me but then she obviously has her reasons. You could text her something like - I’m sorry to have caused any offence, would love to understand your feelings a bit more to open a conversation. If you’re good friends then you should be able to handle a little awkwardness and discuss it