Was IBU? Train give up seat for a child situation

[FriendsObsessed]

So I was on the way home today. Busy train, full of commuters.
i managed to get a seat, one of those 3 that are on the side of the carriage and can be flipped up if needed.

An older couple got on with their (I assume) grandchildren.
The women next to me offered her seat to one of the kids. The grandfather came back saying at yes if they could sit together that would be lovely (keeping eye contact with the woman). She was like ‘I can only offer you my seat’. I didn’t move… he sat down with the child on his lap.

someone else got up and offered the seat to the other child. Same thing happened the grandmother sat down with the other child on her knees (kind of)

i tried to just chill (as I always do on the train) but I kept feeling very uncomfortable and sensed a bit of a death stare. The kids were pretty annoying, and weren’t told to just sit and keep kicking other people’s bags, seats and stop complaining. When I got off the train I could hear the grandfather saying, now you sit here finally.

I’m just so annoyed at folks travelling on train with kids expecting that others should move/give up seats for them. AIBU?

ps the children were approx 4 and 6 yo

Kanaloa Today 15:44

If you were determined, you probably could get the conductor to support you.

Well give it a go. Let me know if you find a conductor who will make a three year old stand up on a moving train so that a healthy and able bodied adult can sit down.

Basically, this.

But then when I was a child, if you had a discounted child or student’s ticket, you were required to give up your seat to a full fare paying adult passenger.

And 4 & 6 are OK to perch on adults’ knees.

I still don't get what this wrong message that kids get is. That people can be nice?

I reckon a 4 year old would be fine either on the lap of grandparent or standing between their legs. Or the children could have shared a seat. Or if the GP were that bothered, they could have stood and the GC could have sat. Certainly the children's balance would have been good enough to stand on a train if they were able to hold on to something, same as most adults.
It was unpleasant for the OP to have to put up with hostility from the GP.
I'll mention here, I have taken literally hundreds of children on trips in the tube , am currently grandparent age, and have an adult DS with a hidden disability who struggles with expectations of sitting/ standing on public transport. My advice would be to do what you can to be kind and help other people, and if you aren't able to, then don't give it another thought. If some one is giving you hostile glares, do the same back. Their opinion is not your problem.

No, the conductor would say the child has to sit on parent’s knee. The conductor will know the conditions of carriage better than anyone, and that means that a (non-fare-paying) child can’t occupy a seat if an adult is standing.

@Tellmethespoiler by your own quote, that's only children under 5, so not all children.

Also they only have to move if it's required, for example if someone has an assigned seat(that 's the most common situation) or a standing adult actually asks/needs it. It's not a case of all seats full, an adult gets on ,child jumps!

Plus , in my experience most people would balk at being offered a seat by an under 5/their parent.

Nope. I never give kids my seat.

If they're little they can sit on a lap .

If they're bigger, they can stand .

Yes, of course. Children under five. But people on this thread are insisting that these are the very children who do need a seat. Obviously, that’s rubbish.

No, that’s not true. Non-fare-paying children must give up a seat in favour of an adult. The adult doesn’t need to ask. It doesn’t need to be an assigned seat. It’s basic good manners that the conductor shouldn’t need to enforce.

I would not give up a seat for a child. Presuming no disability, they are no more in need of a seat than me.
To be honest when I was a child I would have been expected to give up my seat for an adult. I wouldn't expect it now, but I do find the expectation of giving up a seat for a child a bit odd.

When people buy train tickets, it’s very clear that children under five travel for free and they are not entitled to a seat. Don’t travel by train if you’re going to be a CF

I hope a family with quintuplets, all under 5 use the National Railway, and buy their kids a heavily discounted ticket. Just to see some posters' heads blow at the "audacity".

They are expected to give up their seat to sit on the lap of the adult they are with. There is no expectation that small children stand themselves.

I find it odd not to. Was on the Tube today..Packed to the brim with people carrying shopping, food and backpacks, while little kids were getting whacked around the head by all the flying bags. I gave up my seat to one tiny kid..Don't think I was creating an entitled brat by doing that.

You can’t do that. It’s only two under-five children that can travel for free (per paying adult).

Well mum dad and grandma there you go. 8 seats taken, 5 occupied by children. For a nice long journey at peak time. Just out of spite.

Jesus.

Two on a lap would be tricky. Particularly if one is a baby. How do you safely hold a three or four year old on your lap when you already have your baby in a carrier?

How about my neighbour, 3 year old twins and new born twins. Don't know how she ever goes anywhere, I go out with her sometimes and help.

Well, if seats are bought for all the children, that’s fine.

Two options.

1. you have baby in carrier as you sit down and you stand the 3-4 year old between your knees; or
2. you put the 3-4 year old on the seat and you stand in front of the seat with the baby in the carrier.

neither requires the use of two seats if two seats are not available for use

She didn't say the kids are travelling free, she says they buy them discounted tickets.

It would be a nasty person who would make the three year old vacate their seat if they had one to start with though. If someone has a need for a seat I'd expect an able bodied adult or older child to stand before a three year old or parent carrying a child.

They’re different scenarios. The parent carrying a child gets a seat. Obviously. The small child itself does not get a seat. Obviously. It would be nasty and very poor behaviour for a parent to allow their small child to occupy a seat when others are standing - and for the millionth time, they aren’t actually allowed a seat on National Rail. If you buy a ticket for the child, or if you aren’t travelling by train, different rules apply.