Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Child has dropped out of grammar school and I'm panicking

228 replies

ThatFraggle · 27/03/2023 09:21

DD 18 stopped going to school at the beginning of this year, she's meant to be writing A levels. She got good GCSEs moved to a grammar school during the pandemic. No bullying as far as we are aware. She is very outgoing and sociable and is still bubbly on the phone to her friends.

School have been round to the house. All sorts of meetings. She just says, 'I'll try to do better' then goes right back to what it was before.

She takes antidepressants but won't see a therapist. She says 'there aren't any'. We have Bupa. I called and they said since she's over 18 she has to do it herself but she won't.

She refuses to do chores. Her room is disgusting. You have to climb over piles of clothes. I go in there to get plates once they have run out in the house. She has a bathroom to herself and it's a state too. Never cleaned and I'm not doing it. (School didn't see her room, only downstairs which is normal)

She stays in bed all day, is up all night on the phone. She goes out on weekends with her friends and comes back on Monday.

We've stopped pocket money, stopped driving lessons. She doesn't care.

I've explained all her friends will finish school and be doing things and she'll get left behind. If she decides A levels are not for her then she needs to get a job or an apprenticeship. Since she was in primary school we've gone to like 50 different 'career talk' things. (Not arranged by school, just things I've found, like a charity called Stemettes) Scientists, astronauts, artists. All sorts. To get an idea of what sort of thing she might enjoy when she finishes school.

Today I said if she just goes to school from today to the end of the year I'll pay for her to travel regardless of grades. Just to go to school. She's still in bed. Offer off the table.

She said what she wants is for us to rent her a studio apartment and then she'll go to school. I said 1. We can't afford that, 2. That's why people go to school, get qualifications so they can do that for themselves.

It's just three of us here and her step father and I have rows. I said if she wants to go and live with a school friend for a few months we will pay for her expenses there for the 3 months until school ends. She says she wants her own flat.

I'm at my wit's end. My mum came over to speak to her from another city a few months ago. No change.

Her biological dad is a deadbeat who moved back abroad when she was in nursery. He has paid nothing and has little contact with her and has a new family, including a stepdaughter her age and two new babies. I imagine that's upsetting to her as he's on social media playing happy families.

I don't know what to do.

OP posts:
Gazelda · 27/03/2023 10:34

Has she got the option to return to her previous school for A levels?

Seeline · 27/03/2023 10:34

What were her plans for after A levels?
If uni, she has already done her UCAS application? Was she excited about going?

I think the pressure around A levels, getting the grades for uni offers, and that time on the edge of adulthood is immense for kids these days - especially after covid.

I think if they weren't in a good place before, the pressure really magnifies the cracks.

What support have school given?

ThatFraggle · 27/03/2023 10:38

She missed the UCAS deadline but school came round and said she can still do clearing.

Even if her grades are not enough for what she really wants (not sure) she can do a foundation year to decide.

Sugar baby sends chills down my spine. She's very pretty, long hair etc. and always looks nice when she does go out the house.

OP posts:
VegetablesFightingToReclaimTheAubergieneEmoji · 27/03/2023 10:39

I could have been your daughter. i was just very very lost, I realised I couldn’t afford university so couldn’t do the job I was working towards, so what was the fucking point? (I realise now obviously!). I liked the social side, but the work felt pointless and it got further and further away as the months went on.
i was just utterly lost.
i left with shit A levels, and got a job in a completely unrelated field just to work. would I repeat it now, no way, I’d have found a way to get to Uni.

did She have a plan? Has she gone from being brightest to middling?

GrinAndVomit · 27/03/2023 10:39

Could you do an activity together? Like yoga a couple of times a week, or spin classes or swimming?
Exercise is great for the body and mind. It will give you a chance to bond. It will give some structure to the week.
It would be a great starting point to tackle whatever is going on with her.

YouOKHun · 27/03/2023 10:40

My daughter is a couple of years older than yours and her problems really accelerated in 6th form. The pandemic happened at the same time and was absolutely disastrous for her in that it encouraged all the behaviours she was inclined towards but had kept at bay until lockdown (online obsession, not sleeping/keeping strange hours, staying in her chaotic bedroom). My DD also has really unrealistic ideas about money, can’t stick at anything, is a social butterfly but has problems with friendships. Underneath the bravado she is very anxious. She has an Inattentive ADHD (ADD) diagnosis which was helpful at the time but unfortunately came just before the pandemic. Currently she’s seeing a psychologist with an ASD formal assessment on the cards as there are other issues being flagged.

ADHD in women is getting more attention these days and the problem of women being missed because of their particular presentation is more widely understood. Girls and women are expert at masking their symptoms. I too have a diagnosis and I know how overwhelmed I feel and how chaotic my approach has been all my life. This gets dismissed as a “label” or an impossibility as I am not a hyperactive 10 year old boy but when I got my diagnosis after my daughter got hers it all fell into place (with some regret about how I’d struggled in the past and been labelled as lazy and written off at school). It’s really helped me (along with medication) but at 55 I’ve got the maturity to manage it better. My DD is grappling with a more complex set of difficulties.

I am not trying to armchair diagnose your daughter but it may be worth looking into ADHD in women and girls as it may provide a roadmap for you and her. I think parenting of young adults is the hardest stage; they are often not very mature at all yet they are classed as adults and can get themselves into real problems with the freedoms being 18 brings. I have other children who have managed the transition into adulthood relatively easily and just got on with A levels etc but my DD is very different so I know it isn’t just “bad parenting”. You will get people saying “just kick her out” etc but it’s actually more complicated than that with my daughter, though my other children would have responded positively to tough action. I hope you can get to the bottom of it and find out why she seems overwhelmed.

WetBandits · 27/03/2023 10:40

OP, this is probably something you don’t want to think about but there are things jumping out from your posts that are raising red flags for me.

You say your DD disappears Fri-Mon and tells you that her friends pay for her to go out with them at weekends, that doesn’t sound like something other 18 year olds could afford to subsidise. You also mention that she wants a studio flat and that she’s up on the phone at all hours. My immediate thought is that she could be sex working, do you think there might be even a remote possibility of that? Sad

user1471538283 · 27/03/2023 10:41

It is so hard. My friend's DS was like this. Very bright, refused to go to school, just wanted to stay in bed and game all day and night and for her to fund him.

In the end she made him leave. He was gone three months and upon his return he got a part time job and went back to college. He is now doing very well in a job he likes.

You might try to take her away for a few hours and to talk to her about what does she want and what is the plan to get there.

I know it's not funny but honestly don't we all want our own place that someone else pays for?

Beamur · 27/03/2023 10:42

A levels are still a couple of months away and if she's been a reasonably diligent student she might still be able to sit them and do ok.
Stop reminding and pushing. Really back right off.
You need to try and establish some peace at home. The arguing with your DP needs to stop - I think it's probably a far more significant effect on your DD than you're thinking.
Help her to tidy her bedroom and bathroom.
Personally, the tack I would take would be to offer her support without conditions until the end of the school year. Point out that if she wants to leave home that badly her choices are either going away to university or getting a job. You could offer to help with a deposit but she will need to fund her own living expenses.
This defrays that absolute decision for a couple of months but you are making clear that you love and support her and she has autonomy of decisions but these do come with responsibility too.

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 27/03/2023 10:42

This sounds so stressful op!

I would accept that this is it for school this year. Can she repeat next year if she wants to? If so, I would agree with her and the school that she will take the rest of this year off.

Then I would use this time to encourage her to get counselling (and a review of any medication) and a part-time job - cafe, shop, anything. Even if it is very, very part-time, it will help her to have her own bit of money, some independence, a place in the wider world, it will build confidence and get her thinking about what she might like to do further down the line.

I would also maybe suggest the two of you work together on clearing out her room and maybe re-painting it for her, or something else that will freshen it up and signpost a new start?

A year off to work on all of this would probably be hugely beneficial in the long run.

Sameiam · 27/03/2023 10:44

It also might just be she has a boyfriend/girlfriend you don’t know about so is spending weekends there. Could want the flat so they could live together?

Littlecamellia · 27/03/2023 10:45

She is under so much pressure, from both you and your mum, to confirm, go to school and get qualifications. Yes, she needs them, but maybe in her own time when she feels ready. It might take her a couple of years before she feels able to cope.

Meanwhile, why not forget about school for the time being, and encourage her to get a job - maybe part time to begin with. Then she can contribute to household bills, or perhaps she can pay a share of rent on a small flat of her own.

She might prefer working to going to school. And she has all her adult life in front of her, if she wants to study.

Just take away the pressure and let her decide what she wants to do.

Mirabai · 27/03/2023 10:47

Why a part time job? If she’s not at school she needs to be working and paying her way.

I would sit her down and say you weren’t expecting to have this conversation at this point but if she’s not in FT education she needs to get a job and contribute to the household. If she wants to move out, she needs a job to pay her rent.

There is nothing that will project her into retakes next year than the harsh reality of a job.

She doesn’t have to go to uni she just needs to finish school.

Kennykenkencat · 27/03/2023 10:53

ThatFraggle · 27/03/2023 09:42

She's bubbly and outgoing though, a social butterfly. Does that fit into ADD or autism?

Yes.

Why would you think you can’t have friends and go out a lot if you have ADHD

I note that you asked about ADD

The hyperactivity part of ADHD in females is about hyperactivity in the brain.
10,000 thoughts all at once.

Her room (even down to having to collect plates) sounds exactly like Ds’s and he has his ADHD assessment on Thursday

I can tell you this about ADHD especially in females is that they can mask and hold it together until one day they can’t.
I think the pandemic is responsible for the rise in ADHD diagnosis as the normal routines of going to school, going to work and having a routine which involved being with other people and masking everything, suddenly wasn’t there and the wheels came off.

I think a lot of girls can hold it together in primary school. It gets overlooked as then being day dreamers or just a little shy Senior school is where suddenly they start to fall apart. (Personally I gave up in year 8) Then university is another trigger for realising something is wrong and life imploding.

Ds is also a school refuser. But that started in Senior school.

Intergalacticcatharsis · 27/03/2023 10:53

OK so her real father rejected her and your current relationship is volatile and she has lived through a pandemic. She is pretty and living for day to day pleasure only because she is totally confused about life, love and the future. The pandemic has taught her that everything can change overnight and she has learnt from her own experience that love is volatile and not constant.

As a mum, I would just let her know that you love her unconditionally and are there for her, but that society won’t be if she doesn’t tick the right boxes. I would try and sit with her and work with her on anything. I would start with something small like the corner of her room. Just do one small thing together.

At grammar, most are aiming for uni and A stars and that can be utterly overwhelming. She just needs to aim for passes at this stage.

Greensleevevssnotnose · 27/03/2023 10:55

Take her off the phone plan, switch the WiFi off when you are not around and she will soon get her arse into gear. I am speaking from experience here. You are making it too easy for her to do nothing. She wants to be a grown up, then act like one, pay her own bills clean her room buy her own food etc. Noone deserves a free ride.

WalkingOnTheCracks · 27/03/2023 10:56

GreenFingersWouldBeHandy · 27/03/2023 09:32

Wow, She really has you wrapped around her fingers.

She's 18. She's not at college... time to get a JOB and start contributing.

Ask her to move out. No, give her a timescale to move out.

Eleven minutes it is! Who had eleven in the ‘kick her out on to the streets’ sweepstake? Please come to the office to collect your winnings.

SweetPeaGirl · 27/03/2023 10:58

I feel like you might be underestimating the impact of your unhappy home? At that age everything feels so scary and uncertain, and stability at home is like the foundation that makes everything else work. Maybe the arguing and tense atmosphere is getting to her and that's why she's focused on moving out?

TheTurn0fTheScrew · 27/03/2023 10:59

"I've explained all her friends will finish school and be doing things and she'll get left behind"

Hang on to this. Don't tell her again, but wait for this reality. At the moment from her POV she has quite a nice life - sees her mates, roof over her head, basic needs met.

Next year though, her friends will either be off at uni (most likely in a grammar cohort) or earning a decent wage. She's likely at that point to start to want one or the other for herself, which is a better starting point than wanting nothing to change. If she wants to be able to work/go to uni/whatever that's a good motivation for starting talking therapy if needed.

My nephew dicked around in college and failed his Alevels (not MN BBC type grades - a full house of Us). No drugs/MH crisis, just a very immature young man with no motivation. It took his mates moving away/moving on in jobs for him to realise that he's been shortsighted. He went back to college, then university and is now, of all things, a teacher.

ShandaLear · 27/03/2023 11:01

You say your home is unhappy. Is that anything to do with your partner? Living in a high stress environment can feel insecure and overwhelming, and perhaps she’s staying away at weekends and wanting her own place because she wants to be out of that environment. How does she get along with him? It’s one thing your mum telling you off, but it’s quite another if someone else starts shouting at you. Is there any way you could both move?

onepringle · 27/03/2023 11:02

How and when did she end up on antidepressants?

Her behaviour very much sounds like she is depressed, so I would suggest she's either off her meds, or the type/dosage needs to be varied. It's difficult to tackle, because she's an adult, and because depression can take away your ability to give a damn about anything, but I think this is the angle you need to explore.

I would ask her for permission to organise a doctor's appointment for her (by which, I mean you call the surgery and then wave the phone under her nose on loudspeaker so she can consent), to attend the appointment with her, and to help her with taking her medication. I wouldn't focus on tidying up her hovel of a room (what she does and doesn't do to clean it is giving you a visual indication of her state of mind, which is useful to know) but instead, if you're going to baby her, baby her with taking her meds until her head is clear enough again for her to take control back of her life.

I think a lot of tough love posts are missing the facts that your DD has confirmed mental ill health and is acting as if she's unmedicated.

ThatFraggle · 27/03/2023 11:05

Sorry pp.
I thought AD was Asperger's as they had used ADHD elsewhere in their post and I didn't think DD's sociable bubbliness fit in with Autism or Asperger's.

OP posts:
Mirabai · 27/03/2023 11:06

SweetPeaGirl · 27/03/2023 10:58

I feel like you might be underestimating the impact of your unhappy home? At that age everything feels so scary and uncertain, and stability at home is like the foundation that makes everything else work. Maybe the arguing and tense atmosphere is getting to her and that's why she's focused on moving out?

Many teens live with unhappy homes and or school environments, but they don’t just drop out of school.

Waterfallgirl · 27/03/2023 11:06

DogFleece · 27/03/2023 09:31

It sounds like she’s had an awful lot of pressure on her to succeed. Keeping on the pressure is likely to push her further down.

Let her be for a while, take away the need to be constantly doing something that you want her to do. Prioritise her mental health, let her know it’s ok to have a break if she needs it, after all, the current approach doesn’t seem to be working.

I agree - she takes anti depressants so at some point she has been diagnosed with depression - she is unwell .
I know it’s hard for you and people around her but it’s not as easy as saying ‘get up and go to school’, she has an illness stopping her,which is possibly getting worse, the messy room and not cleaning or tidying could all be part of that.
So maybe something over Christmas triggered a worsening of symptoms or maybe an event at school? Or just the stress of A levels can impact especially if she is under pressure to perform at school.
Who knows.
Poor mental health is common. You don’t have to do A levels if you are not well enough, so taking off that pressure may help.
I’d be concentrating on talking about how she is feeling ( not what she is or isn’t doing), and trying to encourage the counselling as part of those conversation(s).

Iamdobby63 · 27/03/2023 11:08

OP, your posts have brought back some awful memories of my daughter going through similar. She dropped out of A levels after her AS levels, turned out she was involved with an older man, single but older. She manage to end the relationship but over the years she has shared how controlling and abusive he was, didn’t like her in school, ‘banned her from Uni’. When this ended she appeared to really suffer with anxiety and refused to leave her room. We were close and yet I knew nothing about this man, she was always home on time and this was before all the smart phones etc. I had no reason to not trust her. I realise how this sounds but is only an outline of my experience.

Are you certain that when she is out that she is where she says she is?

Don’t bow to pressure on the ‘tough love’ that people will be telling you to do.

if you are certain that nothing untoward is happening then sit her down and discuss her options. She wants her own place, you can’t afford it so what is she going to do to make that happen? If she chooses to leave school then you can no longer provide anything other than the basics, explain that this isn’t punishment, just real life. You are not abandoning her.

For what it’s worth my daughter is now in a loving relationship and is currently doing an open university degree, still very anxious but is managing it.