Do you think you're a nice person?

[haioopl]

I go out of my way for friends and will consider other’s feelings etc. But this is mostly for my own gain, to feel liked and needed. I can be incredibly selfish and often have very selfish thoughts. Is anyone truly nice? Truly genuine?

“Nice” is very subjective and overrated.

To me someone who is “nice” is someone with superficially good social skills who is capable of making people feel comfortable and giving the impression of caring about their needs.

Whether that’s genuine or a social mask is situational and debatable from person to person but it’s usually unimportant and can often just mean someone is good at winning people over.

Nice people are easier to rub along with at work for example so have their uses but it doesn’t mean they are better people underneath and it says nothing about their motives. Very often there’s a quid pro quo.

I would far prefer a friend who was funny, insightful, loyal and knew my foibles than one who was nice. Niceness is usually selfishness well disguised.

I think I used to be nicer, until I realised most people are either self-centered or selfish and I was probably being taken for a mug. So I am still pleasant to people but generally don't go above and beyond anymore.

@speakout I completely agree with everything you said. However what you are describing is basically perfection. What I object to is this idea that people pleasers are awful, and selfish and doing it just for their own reasons, which usually isn't true. Most people wouldnt choose to be a people pleaser, the amount of times I've kicked myself for committing to things that I don't want to, and recently I compromised my own views to make someone else feel more comfortable which I kicked myself after.
In that moment I just couldn't face sticking up for myself. It actually sucks being a people pleaser, as it basically means you don't value your own self worth. I'm working on saying 'no'.
But the truly awful people are those that go out of there way to make others miserable or show no empathy to others feelings. To exist in society sometimes you have to be nice to people you don't particularly like to create a nice atmosphere for everyone, and that isn't always a bad thing.

‘Nice’ is always seems to be the ultimate in ‘meh’ adjectives when applied to a person, imo, and it’s something you say about someone who you really have very little to say about. ‘Nice’ reads as ‘I haven’t had any disputes with this person and I am vaguely aware they exist’. That’s it.

Damned with faint praise and all that.

Most people wouldnt choose to be a people pleaser, the amount of times I've kicked myself for committing to things that I don't want to, and recently I compromised my own views to make someone else feel more comfortable which I kicked myself after.

Well exactly. How is this "nice"? It's just insincerity, done to avoid ever having a disapproving reaction from someone.

It actually sucks being a people pleaser, as it basically means you don't value your own self worth.

Of course it sucks. You're living a life of insincerity and never being yourself, because you can't handle disapproval. That's exactly the problem. Nobody likes you for you because they don't know who you are. So you'll only attract people who are out to use you. It sounds absolutely awful.

And if you don't value yourself, why do you think others will?

But people-pleasing is a choice, @Peppadog — a choice to behave as though you are less important than other people (even, very often, other people you neither like nor respect). I certainly don’t think people-pleasers are ‘awful’, but I do object to the narrative that people-pleasers are just too selfless and sweet-natured, and are perennially taken advantage of by ‘users’, and that it’s these others who are the problem. No, it’s not a comfortable habit, but it’s a choice, like any other entrenched bad habit, and should be thought of, and worked on, like any other bad habit that has a negative cumulative impact on you and those around you.

@ReneBumsWombats
That's a huge exaggeration 'noone likes you for you'. I have plenty of very close friends who do know me, and a very wide social circle and am very happy in life, so it isn't hindering me to that extent.
When have I ever said I only attract people out to use me? Just because I'm a classic people pleaser doesn't make me an idiot, I still distance myself from selfish twats and am quite a good judge of character. I just find myself in situations where I end up giving in to make someone else happy.
And what you've described there is a massive misconception, the idea that someone is nice in order to get approval. It's not to get approval, it's to make someone else happy/comfortable. I would do it even if someone didn't know it was me.

@Templebreedy I agree with most of that, although I think it being a choice is a tough one. You can choose to stand your ground but you will likely still feel utterly shit afterwards, if you've let someone down, which is a harder thing to change.

Nope, I always try to convince myself that I am but deep down I know I'm not. Most people irritate me - family, friends, and strangers. I work hard not to let it show.

I wouldn’t always say I’m ‘nice’ because I don’t always say what makes people feel good for the sake of it.

I do however, feel a lot of empathy for others and I would go out of my way for a stranger if they needed help and I have done that before without shouting about it for my own gratification.

I used to feel jealousy a lot and I still do at times, but I do try and think that although I may want something someone else has, they may also be missing something in their life that I am fortunate enough to have. I also don’t get jealous of superficial things because I don’t care for them so much as time has gone by, I genuinely am grateful to just have my health and a healthy family!

Other people succeeding does inspire me, I really don’t like to see people fail. Seeing others succeed is just proof to me that difficulty can be overcome and great things can be achieved.

I will speak my mind and call out bullshit though, so some people don’t see that as ‘nice’ I suppose, but I don’t like unfairness so I will always say my bit. I do struggle with people pleasers but then again that’s a trauma response so I try my best to see that as a coping mechanism for a person rather than something to get annoyed by.

I used to prefer the term kind to nice - I think nice does have an edge to it of inauthenticity, but now kind has similar connotations. "Just be kind".

I try to offer what I'm prepared to give without strings attached. I try to say no when I'm uncomfortable about something, so that I don't end up doing it grudgingly and with resentment.

I think I'm thoughtful and considerate and I try to be consistent and dependable.

I think mainly the issue with people pleasers isn’t that people don’t think they are genuine, it’s that people can spot that their behaviour invites abuse and pisstaking.

A lot of people pleasers (most of whom, surprise, are women) behave as they do because they have been conditioned to think that it gets you some sort of reward. When in fact it’s a self destructive way to behave: it’s a way of erasing your own views, opinions and needs. And it attracts manipulative people like a magnet.

People warn against people pleasing not to be nasty but because it just leaves you wide open to shit behaviour.

But how can anyone like you for you if you never show yourself? When you keep doing things you don't want to do, agreeing with things you don't agree with, just because you can't stand the idea of someone disapproving of you? And usually someone you don't even like either.

How can anyone who never sees the real you like the real you?

If it really was to make people happy and comfortable, you wouldn't resent it. You do, because that's not actually the reason. It's just what people pleasers tell themselves as part of the "oh I'm just too nice" narrative.

It's almost like you can't accept that some people genuinely do things to avoid upsetting others or making them uncomfortable.

I resent it because I know that in doing it I am putting too much pressure on myself or my family depending on the situation. I'm run ragged all the time as all the little things build up. Approval isn't really an issue for me at all, maybe for some people it is, but we are not all a homogeneous group. It's either about not wanting to upset someone or about not wanting confrontation.
It's not like my close friends don't know me, they probably know what I'm like and find it annoying. I know my husband does! Drives him up the wall.
I've actually got some quite funny examples, but this thread is so harsh I think I'd just get more stick telling me I've got issues or need help or something.

But continually avoiding upsetting others or making them ‘uncomfortable’ are far from necessarily being good things, especially if, as you suggest, you’re doing so at the expense of your own peace of mind or compromising your own principles on a regular basis. What are you prepared to nod along with to keep the peace?

Yes I'm nice. I try to do the right thing and am kind to family, friends and strangers.I am however also a bit self absorbed if that's not a contradiction in terms

I'm generally a down-to-earth, giggly girl that loves life and have achieved so much this year to date so I'd be quite motivated and love trying to get out of my comfort zone. I am sweet natured but tend to find certain people mistake that for being either a doormat or a pushover. My empathy goes so far though till as I'd put it my dark empath side would come out to play if I'm pushed too far. I'll give people chances till enough is enough. I do fear confrontation but when people take the piss out of my good nature then I'm done! x

It's almost like you can't accept that some people genuinely do things to avoid upsetting others or making them uncomfortable.

I can accept that. But those people don't then complain about it. They've got what they wanted: not to upset others. Some people are genuinely extremely kind and selfless. That's not people pleasing. And even those people, if they're smart, will know when they need to extend that kindness to themselves, because there comes a point where you're just enabling and helping horrible people. And how is that a nice thing to do?

When did I say anything about enabling or helping horrible people? This is pointless as you don't know me at all so are just trying to criticise some imaginary person you've created.

You're quite happy to try to make me uncomfortable right now...

It's what happens when you nod along to anything, squashing yourself down, ostensibly because you just want them to be happy but really because you just don't actually want to make a stand.

I don't trust these people. They'll nod along to anything I say but they won't have my back when I'm not there because their priority is being pleasing to whoever's there right now. How can I like a person when I don't know who they are? How can I trust them to be loyal when they'll always just nod along to whatever's happening?

And the reaction we're getting right now is the classic response to a people pleaser being told why what they're doing isn't nice. It's very similar to Nice Guy Syndrome. Why aren't women/people appreciating me as I deserve, why don't they admire this, I'm obviously too nice...

I haven't tried to make you uncomfortable. I haven't said anything offensive to you at all. You are trying to say I'm not nice, you are being offensive. When I stick up for myself, you say I'm not nice, yet ironically you've also just criticised people for nodding along. So I can't nod along, but I can't argue my point? What can I do then?

Yes, it's why viritually no-one on this thread is calling themselves that. 'Kind' may have been a more interesting gambit.

I didn't say you'd been offensive. I'm just interested that your selfless desire to repress yourself to make everyone else happy, being so nice, doesn't extend to people who don't find it admirable.

I'm saying that there's some cognitive dissonance going on and constantly squashing yourself down because you don't want to make waves with people isn't a nice thing to do and won't make you happy, as it clearly doesn't. Nor will it attract people who like you for you.

That's why people pleasing is awful. I was surprised when you said it "actually sucks" being a people pleaser, as if it was a revelation, because I thought that was pretty obvious.

Personally, I don’t think ‘being rude’* is the most grave of sins that shadows all others. Same with confrontation. I much prefer knowing where I stand with someone, over someone trying to spare my feeling, and/or saying one thing to my face and another behind my back.

*What constitutes rudeness varies between cultures. In my home country communication is much more direct than it often is in the UK, and would be considered rudeness in the latter (conversely, not being direct would be considered evidence of untrustworthiness and dishonesty in the former). I had to learn the art of code switching when I moved to the UK, but even now I’m still considered very direct (and at times rude) by UK standards.

and that quickly became a euphemism for ‘doormat’. ‘Be kind’ aka ‘aquiesce without complaint to any and every unreasonable demand I make of you, even though I would have zero intention of doing the same in your position. Because ‘being kind’ is your job, not mine’.