Do some children never like school?

[Albertohello]

Ds(8) used to like nursery, but hasn’t liked school since then. I have been seriously considering moving him because of this. But today he said “I think I’m just never going to like school wherever I go. I’m always going to hate school.”

I found this really sad! He’s quite introverted and shy, I think that’s part of it. But he does really well in subjects, and has a friend or two there.

Aibu? That primary kids could all love school if they went to the right place for them?

But if it was an option, think how many children would be taken out of school and put to work at 13, whether they wanted to or not. The compulsory nature of school is protective in that regard.

For those who are merely bored at school my sympathy is very limited as they’ll be finished before long and can do what they like. For those who struggle with years of bullying or disruption in a horrible class or a failing school I’m much more sympathetic but that’s not how school was intended to be.

I wasn't disagreeing with that, merely pointing out that you misrepresented what that poster said.

BTW when you have ADHD (which I do, and it was undiagnosed at school as I behaved myself and did well academically), boredom feels like physical torture. I remember feeling like I would die I was so bored.

Wish home education was an option for more people. It should be.

Also school is not compulsory. Home education is perfectly legal. School is opt in, not opt out.

I never said that or suggested it so not sure what your point is in quoting me.

Education is compulsory (as far as I know there are meant to be checks done on children being home educated) and children aren’t allowed to be in work.

Home education can be done very well but a lot of Home Ed children are in a precarious situation for all sorts of reasons.

There are vocational schools which teach children more practical skills but they can end up being a dumping ground for disruptive and uninterested students so again, not what was intended.

I know education is compulsory. You said school was compulsory - it's not. Home education doesn't necessarily resemble school based education.

I would love to see your data or evidence showing that "a lot" of home educated children are in precarious situations for all sorts of reasons.

Well there’s another thread on home Education going right now if you’re really interested. Data is difficult to come by as many children fly under the radar - hence the precarious situation. If you’re really interested about the many concerns it’s very easy to look it up yourself.

@TrinaLowsln
And as it happens I don’t think mainstream school is necessarily the best place for children who struggle with it for various reasons (including having ADHD). Ideally there would be other arrangements for those children, as you yourself seem to think. But many disagree and say that everyone should be in mainstream. Hence the high numbers of disruptive children (you say you weren’t disruptive but many are) in mainstream schools who make it harder for teachers to teach and children to learn.

@Boomboom22

Surely towards the end of the summer kids are getting angsty and ready to go back?

Yeah, I wanted to go back. I hated every minute in school and as an undiagnosed, misunderstood child then teen it was fucking traumatic. I still wanted to back through because that trauma was marginally better than the suffering at home.

Yes, and I was one of them. When I was at school, you changed school at what would now be year 3.

I hated my first school with a passion. I was bored shitless, as I could read fairly well when I started, write a bit, and "got" number stuff very easily. They stopped me going up to the next school a year early when they realised I was an August birthday, so would have been 12-23 months younger than the rest of the class. I spent a year reading and doing boring crap on my own.

My next school was better, there was a group of geeky kids and we all stuck together, we were groomed for the 11+, which suited me, and generally pandered to because we were swots. But I still didn't really like it.

My (independent grammar) secondary was dire. I was very rebellious and hated everything except English, Latin and drama. I found their stupid rules about uniform and where you could and couldn't go absurd. My friends were a like-minded group of rebels, and they practically gave up on us. They even turned a blind eye to us smoking behind the pavilion when we should have been doing games. We must have been a nightmare.

I thought it would be better in 6th form, but it really wasn't and I left at the end of lower sixth.

My DB absolutely hated school, too, and his school was very different. Almost makes me wonder if school-hating is genetic, or if our parents somehow made us disrespectful of authority. I feel bloody sorry for the poor teachers that got lumbered with either of us.

I'm a home educating parent. I'm probably more well versed on this topic than most people on MN are. Data not existing doesn't equate to children being at risk.

I hated school. It's meant to prepare you for real life but in actuality reflects none of it! If you don't want to work in places with stupidly strict arbitrary rules, you find a new job. Kids have no choice. As a result we home educate our children and work round each other to facilitate their education. They do clubs, learn and focus on what interests them, and if they hate something we work through it in ways they can handle. No amount of bullying, uniform and rules/punishment prepared me for the real world- I still had to learn navigate it all after leaving school- despite being institutionalised.

I never liked it from about Year 2 upwards and school refused throughout my childhood and teenage years. I would have genuine panic attacks because it it. I wasn’t bullied, was bright and able and in top sets for most subjects and had a close knit circle of friends but still hated and would refuse a lot of the time. It has impacted me a lot in my life because I didn’t do well in my GCSE’s because of it. My thoughts on it now are that I’m probably undiagnosed ASD and just couldn’t cope with it.

Not all ADHD/ASD kids are disruptive though. I wasn't. I was well behaved and achieved well academically. But school was not the right place for me.

@TrinaLowsln quite. Equally not all neurodiverse children dislike or are unable to cope with or are failed by conventional education.

This has been a very interesting thread. I was ok in school, primary I enjoyed more but secondary I disliked. I remember in primary we could choose our own topic to study in a term, I loved having that choice!

I'm a year 6 primary school teacher - it's a career I came to later in life having worked in many different jobs. I love educating and supporting children and I do deal with a lot of children that find some of the work 'boring'.

Boredom comes in different ways: because the work is too easy, or too hard; because kids find it hard to focus (ADHD, ASC or MH); because some kids are more focused on social standing and media culture as a way to be successful - these are examples that I observe currently in my class. Work can be differentiated for the too easy/hard but I can only do so much on the ADHD/ASC or MH support and can do nothing about how our culture currently measures success. Lots of the boys in particular want to be a footballer or YouTuber. Aspiration isn't great.

What I do want for my pupils is for them to be exposed to the opportunity of all the myriad of things available so they can make informed decisions. However, that is hard to manage with the curriculum we have to teach. Even with curriculum changes, where pupils have more choice, staff needed to support the diverse education the children could choose and extra classrooms to teach it in as well as resources needed, we'd need way more funding and schools are struggling now.

I do however tell my class that being bored is ok; life is sometimes boring for adults too and we have to learn to manage our emotions for the sake of our mental health.

For those who are merely bored at school my sympathy is very limited as they’ll be finished before long and can do what they like. For those who struggle with years of bullying or disruption in a horrible class or a failing school I’m much more sympathetic but that’s not how school was intended to be.

The problem is - it is too long. Literally years wasted. And disruptive kids happen because classroom setting is where they do not belong.

As for boredom - there is good bored, and there is bad bored. Bored so you have to think and find what to do with yourself - good. Bored that you have to imitate work and not allowed to do anything else - bad. I had a couple of good teachers who let me draw or bring my own book to read. The rest just scolded me for "being lazy".

Oh, and re. working at 13. I know someone who did that. Would misbehave and run away from school and work on building sites. It was illegal and go his parents in a lot of trouble. Decades later they can only laugh about it because he owns his construction company.

Lots of the boys in particular want to be a footballer or YouTuber. Aspiration isn't great.

I don't get what is bad about wanting to be a professional athlete or an artist/entertainer. Only thing that for the vast majority it is unrealistic. Just like wanting to become an astronaut. Very unlikely to happen.

I hated school. All of it. I was (without sounding awful) extremely bright - straight As and top sets all throughout school, won full scholarship to top independent school, offered place at Oxford etc but didn’t take it because mentally I just felt burnt out with it all. Hated all of it. I think - with hindsight and having a child with autism now - I’m confident I have autism and just hated being around other people. I used to be physically sick at lunchtimes as a young child because I didn’t want to have to be around other children - too loud, didn’t like having to share my own imaginary games with them (!) The staff used to let me sit in the medical room with a sick bowl and to me that was preferable to being out with the other children. 😳 This continued unit secondary where I tried to make friends and got so badly bullied and ostracised that I ended up having a year or so off school between year 7 and 8 which was heaven to me, and changed schools and went directly into year 9. I then just muddled through miserably until I finally cracked at the end of my first year of A levels and walked out of that school and didn’t go back. Then started over at another college and proved to myself I could get my A levels and go to university etc but just felt unable to do it.

To be honest, it’s kind of tipped over into my whole life. I absolutely hate being around people. I can fake it for a while and have had good jobs - senior marketing manager for various luxury cosmetic brands for a while etc but get to point I just can’t do it anymore. I met dh and haven’t worked for 15 years now. Never want to work ever again and thankfully won’t have to now due to a combination of lifelong / ongoing PIP for chronic autoimmune issues, inheritance and being previously very high earning / owning my own home outright.

But yep I hated school with a passion. My son is exactly the same sadly.

Yeah everyone knows stories like that but they are the exception. Most young people who drop out of education very early do not end up having fabulous careers.

Yeah everyone knows stories like that but they are the exception. Most young people who drop out of education very early do not end up having fabulous careers.

Define fabulous. IMHO, it's only fabulous as the standard and quality of living you are able to make. Working with your hands can be as fulfilling as any office based career.

I detested school, except for one year when we had an amazing teacher. I was diagnosed ASD last year in my 40s. DS is also ND, the school recognised it from day one and as long as there’s nothing major to throw him off he runs in every day. Not to say your DC is ND, just that the difference in experience between DS’s experience as a diagnosed ND child and my time at school undiagnosed is huge.

A huge proportion of kids on the spectrum do not like school and many become school registers in the end, however much they thrive in lessons and subjects.

Refusers obviously

I wonder if all this neurodiversity in kids is happening because the environment is just unnatural.