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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask what stops you voting for Labour?

1000 replies

Winniethepoohandtiggertoo · 06/03/2023 09:21

No agenda I’m just interested as Kier is on LBC this morning…

For me it’s the TWAW magical thinking, and not being convinced they would prioritise average earners, which I want to happen.

OP posts:
dutysuite · 06/03/2023 12:30

Starmer and Khan

QuizzlyBear · 06/03/2023 12:30

CheersForThatEh · 06/03/2023 10:09

I dont have a clear message about what their big issue is that they stand for.

Yes, I know their policies and views but when it was Tony Blair it was Education Education Education. Boris was Brexit and Environment.

What is Labours big aim?

At this point 'Get us out of this utter shit storm' would be a great (and very electable) aim...

IcakethereforeIam · 06/03/2023 12:32

Just posting this link again, I still hope labour can be talked back but we need a debate. Sign the petition to protect women's rights in the Equality Act

www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4722618-petition-to-update-the-equality-act-thread-2?page=38

Leafstamp · 06/03/2023 12:32

Anyone who wants to uphold women's rights to single sex spaces, such as rape crisis centres should sign the petition here : www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4722618-petition-to-update-the-equality-act-thread-2

privateeyeeye · 06/03/2023 12:33

FourTeaFallOut · 06/03/2023 12:27

Rosie Duffield was shouted down in the commons by Labour men for speaking about single sex issues less than two months ago. Where is the pushback, where is the thinking, when the misogyny is shamelessly on display like this?

Yeah I mailed Labour on it and no reply.

That’s probably the fifth I have contacted them without reply, except when Lloyd RM replied to tell me how wrong I was.

so that was nice.

TheBadLuckOfTeelaBrown · 06/03/2023 12:34

TWAW? Are they?

If labour think that, they cannot have my vote. 50% of the population shouldn't be ignored and subsumed by other categories.

Beowulfa · 06/03/2023 12:35

Labour are making it near impossible for me to vote for them due to:

-self ID gender woo TWAW and the associated misogyny, child safe-guarding nightmare and complete lack of scientific realism.

-being such an ineffective Opposition during years of a self-destructing Tory shitshow. The Tories have not only given them an open goal, they've blindfolded the ref and taken their entire team off the pitch to the pub. And still Labour can't score.

rioseco · 06/03/2023 12:40

I think the hustings may be the downfall of KS unless he has a radical rethink.
The fear of direct questioning has gone.

IcakethereforeIam · 06/03/2023 12:43

Isn't the women's rights activist Kellie Jane King talking of standing against Starmer in his constituency?🍿

C8H10N4O2 · 06/03/2023 12:45

Timesawastin · 06/03/2023 10:48

All these people willing throw the whole country under the Tory bus just because they hate and fear a tiny, tiny minority who are trans.
I fucking despair.

Then take that issue up with the misogynists on the left who crawled back in under Momentum and have appropriated trans issues as a means to roll back women's protections.

They are looking to remove hard won protections from significantly more than half the population (women, children, gay and bisexual people) and even now, after all the fuckups in Scotland still can't bring themselves to say something middle groundish like "yes we recognise there are a few areas where rights clash and for the benefit of both we need to look at how we manage safeguarding etc from men trying to abuse both groups".

I would like them to stand up and say they want to develop the rights and needs of both groups without allowing the debate to be appropriated by misogynists who regained power in the party under Corbyn and Momentum (and Momentum still dominate my local party).

Even now a serving Labour MP has been allowed to barrack and abuse a victim of domestic violence on the floor of the house with impunity. He has neither apologised (to Duffield) nor had the whip removed - that tells me that the leadership of the party think this kind of abuse of women is acceptable.

Mincepieeyes22 · 06/03/2023 12:46
  1. Women's rights
  2. VAT on school fees
IMustDoMoreExercise · 06/03/2023 12:49

PinkFrogss · 06/03/2023 11:37

Many people who claim benefits also work.

I don’t know what the tories are doing to stop the cost of living crisis, housing crisis, low wages, childcare costs etc that would mean working people could afford to live without benefits.

Also for those talking about saving money - the Tory government tried to save money by limiting spending on processing asylum claims. That’s led to an even more expensive backlog. Sometimes short term spending makes long term savings.

Yes, that is the problem. Gordon Brown ensured that many people who were working were able to claim benefits. That meant that employers could just pay the minimum wage, knowing that it would be topped up.

Also, people only had to work 16hours a week and were disadvantaged if they worked more. The Tories have tried to change this but it is very difficult once it has been ingrained by Labour.

Butitsnotfunnyisititsserious · 06/03/2023 12:49

All these people willing throw the whole country under the Tory bus just because they hate and fear a tiny, tiny minority who are trans.
I fucking despair.

I don't hate or fear trans individuals and that's a childish argument to throw out. I'm not willing to throw womens rights under the bus for a tiny minority. Women's rights are important to me, and many many others.

2bazookas · 06/03/2023 12:51

A succession of bad party leaders.

FourTeaFallOut · 06/03/2023 12:52

IcakethereforeIam · 06/03/2023 12:43

Isn't the women's rights activist Kellie Jane King talking of standing against Starmer in his constituency?🍿

Kellie Jay Keen, yeah she did suggest that might be on the cards in order to force a debate on the topic. That would be interesting.

Fabled · 06/03/2023 12:52

The ‘throwing under the bus’ is coming from any party that won’t protect womens rights and provide adequate safeguarding for children.

Labour have lost my vote after 30 years for this utter failure.

sst1234 · 06/03/2023 12:53

TWAW

Shadow cabinets made up of clowns. Only marginally worse than the actual cabinet but still.

The meaningless nonsense KS spouts. Again only marginally worse than than government but still.

He backed Jeremy Corbyn. Enough said.

Intransigentcat · 06/03/2023 12:55

Why would I vote for someone who cannot recognise that my biological sex makes me vulnerable? They clearly can't put my best interests first it they don't know what a woman is or what the impact of being a women is. My very fundamental existence effectively denied and derided by them. Can you imagine a politician saying that anyone can be black? No of course you can't. That would be horrific. So how can anyone who chooses to possibly be a woman? It shows that they are too easily swayed and influenced as a party by what is a la mode.

Besides that, the Jewish question. Have they really purged antisemitism from the party? They clearly haven't purged misogyny so why would I believe they've tackled antisemitism. Watch any factual documentary about the final solution and the pain, terror and enormity of the crime against Jews should leave a normal person breathless. Antisemitism is a scourge.

Would they actually represent working class people? Us schmucks who spend out lives toiling to ensure the filthy rich stay filthy rich. There is a massive, absurd, immoral disparity in the wealth of individuals these days. How will they halt this trickle up effect? What are they going to do about the super wealthy handing their super wealth down from generation to generation.

They don't seem to represent their traditional core voters these days. I don't give a shit what some middle class hipster bro in London thinks about anything but that is whom the Labour party seem to represent these days. Labour went from being unelectable under Neil Kinnock to desperately cool under Blair. They attracted a raft of new voters and really lost something during that process. They lost their heart.

They would need to step up and say biological women are women, acknowledge the damage done by their previous standpoint before Kier could have my vote.

Oh and making tertiary education free for the brightest and best wouldn't hurt either, especially if admissions were done on a blind basis to ensure fairness. Yes it would be costly, but the long term benefits of a well educated populace can't be understated. Where are their true socialist policies that provide actual, tangible benefits? The super wealthy just fuck off if Labour tax them too much and the benefits system is already bloated beyond recognition yet also fails to deliver. What are Labour actually offering as a solution to those key issues.

Given the absolute shitshow that Brexit has been, I'd like to see a party brave enough to say that we need to revisit the issue. But I doubt any party have the steel ovaries needed for that and Sunak is pro Brexit anyway. It weighs heavy on me that given that Kier isn't brave enough to stand up for women, I very much doubt he's brave enough to say that as a country we made a massive mistake leaving the EU and need to fix it. Although I do believe the issue will be revisited in time, it may not be during my time but Brexit wasn't what young people wanted.

I really hoped Kier would be better than he has been so far tbh. I don't feel I know him, I don't feel I trust him. I don't think he has the answers to a fairer society.

Sigh.

SummerWhisper · 06/03/2023 13:00

The Labour Party was built on the trade union movement. It is now turning its back on strikers, so essentially supporting the Tories' low wage economy and union-busting laws.

Starmer is a liar, has broken all of his election pledges and is moving towards a privatised NHS. He is taking money from lobbyists.

More Jewish people are being suspended or expelled under Starmer. I cannot vote Labour under his leadership. He is sinister.

CremeEggQueen · 06/03/2023 13:01

TheBadLuckOfTeelaBrown · 06/03/2023 12:34

TWAW? Are they?

If labour think that, they cannot have my vote. 50% of the population shouldn't be ignored and subsumed by other categories.

50% of the population? Where are you getting that from, do you have a source for that please?
Or are you doing that thing again that seems so popular on here that all women (your 50%) all think the same as each other and are a hive mind?

Brazilagogo · 06/03/2023 13:01

My natural political home is Labour but their stance on transwomen is a big concern. I would not vote for any other party but I may have to spoil my vote - in a swing seat, in a crucial election that has to get the Tories out. It does not sit well with me, and may depend on the person standing in my area.

Lilifer · 06/03/2023 13:03

Kier starmer and their gender ideology

Makegoodchoices · 06/03/2023 13:03

Attitude to women’s safety - TWAW

other than that - I actively WANT a party with a boring leader - boring people get things done and look at detail. Boring people do more work than charismatic ones. I don’t need a celebrity running any political party, I want serious people who get shit done!

IcakethereforeIam · 06/03/2023 13:03

50% of the population are female, women and girls. It's not difficult. That some of that 50% are happy to be colonised by men is not relevant to the point.

CremeEggQueen · 06/03/2023 13:05

That some of that 50% are happy to be colonised by men is not relevant to the point.
🙄🍪

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