Is threatening illegal immigrants going to stop them coming?

[LadyGAgain]

Channel migrants face lifetime ban on returning to UK www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64848101

I read this with horror. I know we are a tiny island with limited resources but this legislation seems callous and cruel. These people are risking their very existence getting on these small boats and to then be locked up and shipped off again to who knows where. Plus the cost to us as tax payers. AIBU to suggest that I don't have a solution but this one seems extreme.

our service like dental and Nhs and education benefit hugely from being staffed by qualified and experienced refugees, who we didn't even have to fund the training of!

So all those coming over in small boats illegally are doctors, dentists and teachers ?? Who knew.

Oh and if you mean those absolute monsters demonstrating outside hotels, yes they are all wrong.

Rosula - France is 1.5 times larger than the UK yet we have 1 million more people living here.

Cont’d This government loves to turn asylum seekers, particularly off small boats, away. The 62% allowed to stay have good reason.

You clearly have no idea how the visa system works in this country. You can’t just pay some money, apply for a visa and you get it. You have to either have someone who will sponsor you (like a partner), be a student, or a job offer for a skilled job in a shortage occupation where income must be £25,600 min. People fleeing war or persecution don’t have time to wait for a visa to come though, they take months! If you had to flee the UK because you fears for your life would you apply for some jobs and hope you’ll get one then wait for a visa to come through?

We recently changed the law to allow HK settlement here.

But its still a potential 5m extra people who are coming from a very safe place relatively speaking, many of whom are old.

Plus they clearly are not British as they are barred access to public funds, its a contrived citizenship.

Yes it is a completely different situation because its utterly stupid to have allowed this, i don't think many people realise the implications of this policy change.

BUT the point is if we can make room for millions of HK Chinese, then 40k x channel migrants is nothing at all surely?

Wouldnt any visa work? Fly in and claim asylum when you land? That said, it can be difficult to get any visa at all if you don't have the right papers, or are of certain nationalities.

@GPTec1 There is no war in HK either but we have invited in 5m HK Chinese.

Please do not spread Left Wing rubbish.

The figure is more like 88,000.
These people have skills, can speak English, are law-abiding and are prepared to work.
Hong Kong was once one of our Colonies and we owe them some support.

Some people forget that under Tony Blair we had 2.2 million immigrants (that's the equivalent to the population of Leeds/Bradford) entering the country due to their policy on mass migration to boost Labour votes

Research into voting patterns conducted for the Electoral Commission after the 2005 general election found that 80 per cent of Caribbean and African voters had voted Labour, while only about 3 per cent had voted Conservative and roughly 8 per cent for the Liberal Democrats.
The Asian vote was split about 50 per cent for Labour, 10 per cent Conservatives
and 15 per cent Liberal Democrats.
We should not underestimate the power of ‘community leaders’ who have strong influence in constituency Labour parties and who, of course, benefit from a growth in numbers.

Since 1990-2022 Germany's population has increased by 4.6 million, France by 9.86 million and the UK by 10.26 million.

how many are natural births, how many normal immigration and how many refugees.

Germany took in, for eg, 1 million Syrian refugees not that long ago. UK?

And that isn't to say that France and Germany don't have issues, because they do. We have seen what the ghettoisation of parts of Paris has led to, and Germany is having some similar volatile eruptions (not on the scale of France yet)

And yet: Births to "ethnic" Germans is right down. Immigration is key, and the Germans are involved in a lot of handwringing and discussion about it.

Unfortunately it’s not skilled people coming over like doctors and nurses you know people that we actually need it’s more likely to be unskilled individuals who will no doubt be claiming of the system with little English skills. Even if these immigrants could legally work they would be forced to take on low paid work so will be taking more from the system than giving back.
We are overcrowded no doubt about that just come to the south east and see the amount of homeless people we have it’s shocking.
Every day posts on here from people who can’t get GP appts or access health care and you want to add even more ppl into the mix. Tory’s may have underfunded services for years but bringing boat loads of families over here is not going to help the situation is it?

That isn't what she meant, and I'm pretty sure you know that.
The point is that we cannot write off a huge number of people as illegal and send them away when we know absolutely nothing about them. Surely everyone who wants to claim asylum in the UK should be able to make that claim? It's up to the government to process those claims property and see who actually qualifies for asylum.

My heart goes out to the genuine cases but I fear we have a lot more just trying their luck with the system.

I think this issue is incredibly complex and I'm fed up of people criticising a proposed course of action but saying they don't have the answer either. That's because there is no answer that will allow all the poor and desperate people who would like to seek refuge in this to settle here and other rich countries whilst also maintaining the quality of life current citizens of these wealthy countries enjoy. Pretending otherwise is just virtue signalling and empty.

The reality is those in the worst positions will not be able to get close to even attempting a channel crossing as they simply don't have the means or ability to get to France in the first place.

So the people of Knowsley, a solid Labour area with much poverty and social issues, were wrong to stage a peaceful protest (against asylum seekers having accommodation and 3 meals a day while they were using foodbanks - and spending money)?
It is legal right to peacefully protest in this country against anything.
If you did it in France one of Macron's goons would crack your skull with a baton.🙄

Clearly something needs to happen re smugglers and having some basic level of organisation

but shipping people off to Rwanda isn't going to help. Nor is ignoring testimonies from refugees from the Middle East who have been through hell.

Well the point is it's illegal and they are breaking the law. Proper channels fine. But if you ignore law there then you might as well free the people from our prisons who are in there for other reasons like council tax or benefit fraud

I housed a 14 year old fleeing the war in Kosavo 20 odd years ago. He'd lost most of his extended family, came in on a lorry. His mother had sold everything to get him here.

THERE WAS NO SAFE ROUTE TO APPLY

He was granted indefinite leave to remain and went on to get a 1st from the LSE and has paid more tax than I ever will.

Who would be better off if he'd been fucked off to Rwanda?

You? Me? Him?

Loose, loose, loose.

MrsSchrute - What is your cut off point for anyone wanting to claim asylum in the UK? Where are they going to be housed whilst their applications are processed? Should they be put up in hotels whilst they are waiting? Given houses whilst they wait?

The Hong Kong point is massively uninformed but the point about the black economy is a good one. There were plans for ID cards going back 15 or 20 years - the lack of which are one reason it's easier to disappear into the black economy here than in countries that have an identity documentation system.

no, no-one thinks it realistically is either but it's a good PR front for the Tories.
It's not going to stop people trying to come here because of their connections to the UK - which is most of the current immigrants.

It is apparently absolutely fine to accept asylum seekers with open arms as long as they are white and coming from Ukraine and deserve all the support but others must be a threat to our small island and should be sent to Rwanda. And then they say Britain is not racist

But these are not normally children. It’s overwhelmingly young men. Who arrive here and end up in hotels with nothing to do and nowhere to go.

we can’t afford to keep paying for them and services like health and housing and dentistry cannot cope.

@Surplus2requirements you do have a point about opportunities to excel but I think a first from LSE from an unaccompanied minor is quite rare. Most people coming over won't be able to work for a long time/will be in low wages jobs/retraining.

Not saying there's anything wrong with having a less skilled job but that boy (and well done him) isn't a standard case at all.

I expect this would actually be very effective in deterring illegal migrants. In Australia, asylum seekers who arrive on boats are placed in detention centres and given the option of returning home or remaining indefinitely in a centre on a remote island with minimal resources.

The boats have stopped.

What airline is going to carry you without the right visitor visa to get on the plane in the first place?

And even if you do make it through, and get a tourist visa by lying on the application form about the purpose of your visit, the minute you make it clear that actually, you're here to claim asylum, you're guilty of deception on your visa application. Which is also illegal.