Was it my fault she died?

[howcaniknow]

I really love my mum. However I did not grow up with her, I grew up with my grandparents (saw my mum every week) and we did not have a conventional mother daughter relationship as a result. There was pain and hurt there when I was a young adult at times, although we had loads of fun together too.

She preferred to have firm boundaries around me, I think. I was always welcome for visits but her house wasn't my home. I am ashamed of this because it's childish and pathetic but I craved being 100% fully wanted by her and felt such deep shame that she didn't want me living with her. My siblings lived with her and it's like a blank space in my mind that can't work out why I was not "worth it" on the same level as they were.

I know this is just nonsense obviously as an adult and don't believe that has anything to do with my worth - but sometimes it still hits me over the head and I just feel so ashamed and distressed. It embarrasses me.

We developed a great relationship later on. However, by this time I had grown up and learned how to enjoy the relationship for all the good things it was, and let go of the rest.

But a big part of this was never, ever arguing with my mum or pressing my opinion on her - I think she always felt I was too pushy and demanding and put my own wants and needs first. I reckon I was guilty of that for years as was demanding, always needing support. I am 100% aware that I was a shit person in that respect.

When she got sick she was very appreciative of my support which I was glad to do, but I was always too afraid to argue with her and push her. She was very keen to explore all options which we did together and did a virtual appointment with a very good doctor, but I didn't push her to move to a bigger hospital.

Maybe if I had REALLY pushed her, she would have gone and even if she had stopped talking to me, she might still be alive?

The other thing is maybe I should have been pushier about going to her town and actually going with her to appointments but again I was afraid. There was nowhere for me to stay and due to my own disability I can't drive.

But really - I prioritised my own disability and my own health. Having no access to my own doctors and things I need to manage my own health makes my own disability worse so I just put myself first. Again, if I had navigated things in a better way, would she possibly still be alive?

Am I just a shit daughter?

If you access a grief therapist and are allocated a set number of sessions they will only stay with your grief . If you move into childhood trauma they will refer you , as it would be unsafe to work with you on trauma when you only have limited sessions. The work can be very painful for clients so requires long term open ended therapy.

Sounds like you have experienced early childhood trauma , which is very powerful in our early years and sounds like you are carrying this with you .
Good luck OP

@howcaniknow

From reading your posts and what you’ve said about your mother, if I had to guess your mother’s feelings and intentions I would say the following.

Your mum clearly loved and wanted you, to keep the pregnancy at a young age and in less than ideal circumstances she obviously wanted you, but at 18 she probably still wanted a life for herself and a decent future for you. This culmination of age and circumstances meant that you were raised by your grandparents whilst she worked on herself and her future. Sadly by the time she thought and felt she was stable enough to parent you properly you were already very attached to your grandmother, settled in your home and doing well in school, your grandmother was also obviously very attached to you and had grown used to parenting you and didn’t want to let you go. Essentially they fought over you and your grandmother won, and likely because your mum was actually putting you first, didn’t want to traumatise you by taking you away from all you knew and loved. She clearly felt you should be with her hence her arguing with your grandmother over you, but ultimately she went against what she wanted and instead did what she must have thought was best for you at the time.

As for her moving away and keeping very strong boundaries, I would imagine she did this because it was too painful. She loved you and wanted you but essentially couldn’t have you. Her keeping that little bit of distance may have just been her protecting her own heart. Imagine having something you want so so much, so so close, but also just outside of your grasp. I would think this must have been incredibly emotional and painful for her. I am guessing she will have assumed that you were fulfilled with your relationship with your grandmother and that you were happy. She may never have suspected otherwise until much later when you were much older.

For you as a child having had that main parental relationship with your grandmother and not your mother I imagine like most children do, that it was your grandmother you wanted when you were sick, injured or upset. When you were tired and wanted to curl up on the sofa or in bed, you will have wanted to do that at your home that you shared with your grandmother. Whilst you won’t have been rejecting your mother, your mother will have experienced hurt at each of these instances. As a mother it hurts when your child doesn’t want you, but you did want her, she just didn’t know and I would guess she saw that as her penance for the choices she made however painful it maybe.

I could of course be completely wrong but from reading all that you have about your mother and what you have said, it sounds to me as though she did want you, and wanted you very much, but I also think that perhaps she loved you so much that she also let you go, because she thought it was what was best for you.

Sending you some very big hugs. From someone who had a difficult relationship with my mother and also felt rejected and then my mother died I do understand how unresolved these things can feel and how much it take take up space in your mind. Ultimately my advice would be now that your mum has passed is to choose the narrative that gives you the most peace and go with that. 💐

Actually she doesn’t.

She sounds like a you g woman who realised she couldn’t give the OP what she needed and changed the circumstances so that she did get that.

That’s a far better mother than someone like mine who was a shit mother, knew she was a shit mother, but her wishes to have us around sometimes (despite neglecting and abusing us the rest of the time) were more important than our well being.

Life isn’t always simple and comments like that don’t help the Op in any way shape or form.

I also agree that people need to read the OPs posts. She made it clear her mum was not “toxic” or “bad”. From what @howcaniknow has said so far, she was very much a wanted baby and it sounds like it was a family decision that she stay with her grandmother while her mother finished university. The fact that your mum wanted to have you and your grandmother refused has a lot of unanswered questions.
Was it a free decision of your mother to leave you with her mum?
Did she always expect that she could come and get you once her life was stabilized?
Did your grandmother have concerns about whether your mother could parent you at that time?
Also your grandmother was effectively your main maternal figure at this point and maybe she just couldn’t hand you over due to her own attachment to you.
If you seemed happy and thriving it may well have seemed best not to disrupt your life.

The fact your mum felt she had to move away because your GM and her’s relationship was difficult could have meant she was devastated that you would not be coming to live with her.
She had to grow up very fast, having a baby and feeling for whatever reason that she couldn’t raise you could have been very difficult and depressing for her. She may have had to suppress her natural instincts to carry on while leaving you with her mum.
She came back for you so there was obviously a conflict with her own mother when she didn’t get to leave with you.
Perhaps she felt her own mothering had ended too quickly and she was trying to figure out what was best for you.
There are so many unanswered questions that casual readers of a thread can’t possibly know.

For others here to claim your mother had mental health problems or a personality disorder is completely inappropriate.
Your mother did love you and wanted you. I think she had to suppress and block a lot of her own natural material urges and was probably trying to balance her own desire to have you with her and what was best for you if you had always been with your grandparents.
Instead of being a terrible mothers as some claim, she may have been sacrificing her own desires and trying to do what was best for you.
It definitely sounds like your GM decided it was better you stay with her.

There are a lot of layers to this story. Are there other family members who may know more, such as great aunts, uncles, cousins, siblings etc?

You are not responsible for any of it. Not your mother's actions when you were a child, nor what happened at the end of your life. I hope that you can get the help that you need, and that you find peace OP.

That should have read *her life!

I x-posted with @Lillygolightly and we are basically saying the same thing, I agree with all she said.

I say this kindly, but you're talking utter bollocks

I don't know why your Mom didn't want you at home, but I can tell you, it was about her not you. There's NOTHING my children could do from a young age to make me not want them and to raise them. Unless there was something going on with me.

Where were your siblings in all this? The ones she chose to raise? They owe her more than you ever will and even then, it's not their responsibility to make those choices.

Please, please op look at getting some real support because yo u deserve real love

I think it would be incredibly useful to unpick this with therapist. There seems to be lots around your mum being a teen mum.

You said your mum wanted to take you with her but your grandmother wouldn't let her - I think there's your starting point.

Your mother perhaps wasn't allowed to prioritise you. She might have felt that she didn't have a say in your life as you grandmother was raising you which had allowed her to go to uni ect. She may have felt she wasn't good enough to be a mum and that yoir grandmother was doing a better job.

I know so many older women who were teen mums who have so much guilt around being teen mums

Its totally OK to be sad you didn't have the more traditionally viewed upbringing of your siblings and to grieve the more traditional mother daughter relationship your siblings possibly had.

I'm sorry, OP, I think guilt just comes with bereavement. You couldn't have extended your mother's life. She made her own choices and you would never have been able to override them or push her in the way you've described. Your relationship wasn't perfect but you loved her and she loved you - and you miss her. I hope you find a way to come to move forward. It's not easy, I know.

I know it’s easier said than done but what ifs doesn’t help. Speak to your gp, try a counsellor to get this off your chest.

What an incredibly sad story and what a huge burden to carry on your shoulders. You must really try to stop this way of thinking. It is not your fault your mother died and you are not a bad daughter. My goodness, this must be so exhausting for you. You really should consider seeing a therapist. They will help you work through these complex emotions so you can begin to think more clearly and get on with living your life. I had to see a therapist due to my relationship with my mother and it helped me enormously. I think more clearly and rationally, and I realise that many many things weren't my fault. Your only obligations are to your immediate family and yourself. Everyone else can do one, so NEVER feel guilty about putting your own needs first. I hope everything works out for you. X

There is nothing about what you say that is nonsense. I'm from an extremely dysfunctional family of origin, so I get what you're saying. My heart goes out to you.

I suggest you seek out Family of Origin therapy. It was really useful for me to find peace

Also, a book called "Family Secrets: What you Don't know can hurt you" by John Bradshaw. This book was really helpful in my recovery

it isn’t really that we want to insult your mother, at least that is not what I read in most of these posts. It is that many of us have gotten to the point that we understand what having a flawed parent does to us in terms of people-pleasing and trying to take responsibility for others. Until that moment clicks for you, it seems like people are insulting your parent.

we really just want you to see what we can see because we have been there and are still there. I am almost 50 and I still have to remind myself every day that I am not responsible for my father.

No your human with feelings, seems to me you’ve had a rough deal
and sound a lovely person, don’t beat yourself up
be happy x

Of course her death isn’t your fault.
It’s great you built a relationship with her as an adult, and sorry for your loss… but she wasn’t your responsibility alone, you have siblings, where were they during her time of illness? Sounds like they should’ve been pushing her to go to hospitals and supporting her, she chose not to have a full daughter/mother relationship with you… because of this you were the least likely to push her into getting any help needed… sounds like the others should’ve stepped up!

And I totally get it…
Your mum was young, not settled, had university in front of her… It’s great she never just aborted you like many would’ve, instead choosing to allow her loving parents to raise you, and it sounds like you had n amazing relationship with your grandparents… it isn’t greedy to have that amazing relationship and still want your mother to prioritise you… we are all told our parents are the 2 people who should always put us first… it messes with you, knowing you’re loved but questioning ‘am I though - because she isn’t mum full time’… or why Can’t I be part of the ‘family’… I suspect your outburst in your twenties was a test (subconsciously) of whether she would stick around and still love you unconditionally if you were awful and told her a few home truths… she stuck around and you rebuilt your relationship to something special - so you have your answer… I think she loves you every bit as much as your siblings, but the relationship was different - not through your fault, or hers… but just because she hadn’t been there for the first teeth, first steps, nursed you through childhood illnesses or wiped your tears when you fell out with your first best friend or been there for your first breakup, first period etc…. She also probably felt a huge sense of guilt and shame when with you (not shame because of you) but because of how she’d left you to be raised by her parents… I suspect she felt huge guilt about it and maybe she kept firm boundaries because she felt unworthy of your love!…. Definitely not because you weren’t worthy of hers… I think guilt paralysed her ability to be ‘mum’ to you.
Maybe her inability to allow you to ‘care for her’ in her final days was also lead by guilt … maybe she felt that she hadn’t fully been there for you, so you shouldn’t have to be there for her… She wouldn’t have told you this because a parent shouldn’t push this feeling of their guilt into their child and she wouldn’t have wanted to put you in a position where you had to reassure and comfort her - she probably felt she didn’t deserve that from you… She knew how much you loved her, and she loved you too!! I’m glad you built happy memories and a good relationship in later years… Her passing is very sad, but you can’t force someone to except medical help, It’s not your fault xx
You all did your best with what you knew and had at the time, Please except that she loved you and did her best, even if her best wasn’t everything you desired, and you did your best, even if at times that was anger and resentment, it was what you had to work with at the time and you worked through it….. I hope you find peace with all this and I hope you have the support of your mums husband and your other siblings. Be kind to yourself OP ❤️

You poor love, none of this is your fault. It wasn’t your fault as a child. It’s not your fault as an adult. Her death will stir up lots and lots of feelings, that is to be expected

Op I hope it's not too forward of me to ask..but is there any mental health or your disability the reason she felt she couldn't give you her full attention and therefore uour gran could ? Meaning in their minds almost her kids got the attention they needed? Thenbits not rejection its making sacrifices for everyone's benefit although hard. Fwif you didnt fail her ...your siblings had a responsibility too....

I misunderstood @howcaniknow when I posted a few days ago. Apologies. I hadn't realised the circumstances of your birth and early years. Your Mum was young and your grandparents looking after you was the best solution they ( including your Mum ) thought at the time.
I think you were loved. By them all.
Did you write that your grandmother, in hindsight, thought it might have been better for you and your Mum to have moved into a flat together after you were born.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing !

Alot of people say that your mum wasn't your responsibility alone as you had siblings. It's important to realise that your parents are not your responsibility and you don't owe them anything whether you've had a good or bad upbringing. The majority of people do take care and help their parents in old age but this is usually done out of love, not obligation (and how it should be in an ideal world). Love and obligation are difference.

If you haven't had a good relationship with your parents because of their behaviour/choices, why would you commit to looking after them in old age especially if you have your own life and commitments. You get back what you put in. Without going into detail, my mother is not a good mother, and through therapy I have come to realise that I have no obligation to her. The weight this has lifted off my shoulders has completely transformed the quality of my life as I was struggling with my feelings about it i.e - feeling guilty all the bloody time. It takes time to change your mindset and your choices won't be popular with everyone but screw everyone. This is your life.

You're slightly different in that your mother has already past but the principle is the same - let go of the guilt. A therapist can help you with this.

Don't be hard on yourself. She was a grown adult and it could even be that nothing would've changed the outcome.

I completely agree with this.

Also - it is clear your grandmother considered education and stability as very important factors in your upbringing. So it may be that, when your mother was pregnant with you, your grandmother was very active in promoting your mother’s decision to go to uni and for you to stay with her so that she could give you a stable and loving home. At 18 your mother probably felt her mother knew best - and maybe she did. Certainly she would feel her mother was more experienced at looking after a baby than she would be at that age. And it sounds like she wasn’t going to get any help from your father who was not ready to be a parent.
Later, when your mother wanted you to live with her, your grandmother prevented it.
Despite all this your mother worked hard to build and maintain a strong relationship with you. You clearly mattered to her hugely and it sounds as if she was as attentive and committed to you as she could be given the situation. Regardless of any rows and tensions you also had lots of fun and time with her and your relationship lasted all her life. Which - if she hadn’t loved you - wouldn’t have been possible.
I imagine she was hugely touched by your support when she was sick.
Grief at death (and other losses) can cause us to search for how we could have prevented it.

It’s part of our desire for the death to have not occurred. We try to change it in retrospect - I think it is a kind of magical thinking- so that maybe it won’t be true. It’s not unusual - but it can be very difficult to move through - particularly when some aspects are complicated and especially if we love and miss the person. And the loss stirs up all the other losses and we bargain with them too.
You love your mother and you miss her deeply and this stage of the grief is especially hard for you. Good therapy would help you to process all the losses.
Remember - your mother loved you and your grandmother loved you. That is real. You are clearly lovable and worthy of that love.

Remember - your mother loved you and your grandmother loved you. That is real. You are clearly lovable and worthy of that love.

Very well put and undoubtedly true.