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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To have refused to get out of my car for the police in the middle of the night?

871 replies

AngeloMysterioso · 02/03/2023 17:05

Was driving home from work at just after 2 a.m last night when I was pulled over by a pair of male coppers in a squad car after I swerved in the road to avoid a pothole.

I stopped, lowered my window a crack and then turned the engine off and made sure all the doors were locked. They both got out of the car and came over, asked about where I was going, where I’d been etc etc and then asked about the swerve- I explained about the pothole, and that I didn’t consider the move to have been dangerous as there were no other vehicles or anywhere near me (they had been some distance in front of me at the time and on the other side of the road but there was absolutely no chance of a collision) and no pedestrians anywhere around.
Then they asked if I would get out of the car and take a breathalyser test. I refused- I said I’d happily drive to the police station (maybe a mile- mile and a half away) and take a breathalyser there, but that I didn’t feel safe getting out of my car and being alone with two massive blokes in the middle of the night with no other people around, and them being in a uniform didn’t change that for me.

They asked a few more questions about my work, if they needed to would anyone be able to verify that I’d been working, gave me a lecture about driving safely and in the end let me go home with no further action taken - but I’ve just had a phonecall from another police officer basically telling me off for not just doing as I was told.

Was I BU?

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 02/03/2023 22:40

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:35

what percentage is “many”??? Is this more or less than the general make population?

Show quote history

This report might be useful.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/police-super-complaints-force-response-to-police-perpetrated-domestic-abuse/police-perpetrated-domestic-abuse-report-on-the-centre-for-womens-justice-super-complaint

SpyouttheLand · 02/03/2023 22:41

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:36

And in what logical basis does the extremely small number of cases give you to mistrust every police officer you meet?

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Extremely small numbers? It's not. It's 100s in the Met alone.

www.openaccessgovernment.org/met-police-misconduct-1000-sexual-allegations-investigated-against-officers/151516/

Benjispruce4 · 02/03/2023 22:41

Yanbu . I’ve always respected police until recent cases. Why couldn’t they breathalyse you through the window?

Frabbits · 02/03/2023 22:41

Absolutely I would have done the same thing.

I do not trust the police as far as I can fucking thrown them, and that's entirely their own fault.

gold22 · 02/03/2023 22:41

The irony that the dislike I face day to day by actual criminals is less than what I read on here

SwordToFlamethrower · 02/03/2023 22:41

You definitely did the right thing. Sounds absolutely terrifying.

I thought that male police weren't allowed to pull over lone women in England anyway!

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:41

FOJN · 02/03/2023 22:39

  1. The OP stopped. No one has suggested that a police car chase would be fun.
  2. The OP did not refuse to provide a breath test, she expressed her willingness to be breathalysed.
  3. The OP suggested she could drive to a police station, she did not demand. The reason why that was not appropriate have been mentioned several times.
  4. The OP hasn't ranted at anyone and I haven't seen anyone suggest that would be appropriate course of action but clearly the case you are referring to, along with many other reports of unprofessional/unlawful behaviour by the police has damaged trust and women feel the need to be cautious.
  5. Women should not have to compromise their own safety because the police are under resourced.

Is there a reason you felt the need to invent this narrative?

Show quote history

Oh do keep up, I referenced the advice that had been given on this thread (and presumably you’re happy for a suspected drunk driver to keep driving)

is there any reason you decided to twist what I was saying in order to meet your narrative?

Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:41

Novatherova · 02/03/2023 22:35

Out of the thousands of officers a snapshot of evil men isn't the same as saying they're all the same, which is what is coming across in these posts.

Bringing down the police who are actually decent people and tarring them all as rapists etc is awful and I stand by what I said.

I'm sure you'd all trust them if presented with a burglar or are you going to say no to the mail officers who turn up because they're men and god forbid they may turn out to be rapists so you won't let them in.

Show quote history

I posed the same question upthread and was largely ignored, which pretty much answers the question. The law is the law and if the civil disobedience that’s being advocated here were to become widespread, it wouldn’t be long before the police would hold no authority and if you were burgled in the middle of the night, you’d have to get on with it. It’s already happening in some US states.

ShutUpBaggyTits · 02/03/2023 22:41

Everyone saying she should have called the police station to verify their badge numbers.
Have you tried ringing your local police station at 2am? Do you think someone would pick up?
I've just googled my local police station and they're open 8am to 8pm. Other than that you have to ring 101 or 999.

You did the right thing OP and I would've done the same.

Maybe next time don't swerve in front of an oncoming police car though! 🤣

Hoolihan · 02/03/2023 22:42

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:36

And in what logical basis does the extremely small number of cases give you to mistrust every police officer you meet?

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Because how do we know which is which?

SpyouttheLand · 02/03/2023 22:42

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:35

what percentage is “many”??? Is this more or less than the general make population?

Show quote history

Don't you want your police force to be better than the general male population? That would include the criminals they're supposed to be protecting us from.

Novatherova · 02/03/2023 22:42

Thesharkradar · 02/03/2023 22:28

He sacrifices lots for his job because he is proud to do it and he is the kindest and caring man
He is a hero and I salute him...but how can we tell the bad ones from the good ones? The bad ones do everything they can to look like the heroic ones, how do we know which ones are predators masquerading as heroes until it's too late, like it was for poor Sarah?

How do we know that the people typing here are not male predators pretending to be women.

Answer is you don't know. You can't know.

Same as when you go out on a night out about the taxi driver who picks you up.

I get the comments and why. But it really is annoying that the police always seem to get it in the neck especially because our family sacrifices so much.

Evil men are everywhere not just the police.

And 2 am swerve on an industrial estate I'd have pulled the OP over too.

ButterCrackers · 02/03/2023 22:44

Why couldn’t you do the breathalyser test in the car? No need to get out at all.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 02/03/2023 22:44

Benjispruce4 · 02/03/2023 22:41

Yanbu . I’ve always respected police until recent cases. Why couldn’t they breathalyse you through the window?

Because the officer needs to retain control of the apparatus to ensure a compliant test is administered, an accurate result recorded, and to ensure there is no grounds for the driver to later contend that proper procedure was not followed, rendering the result inadmissible.

The police don't just make this shit up on the fly, there are perfectly sound and justifiable reasons for them asking you to comply with their requests.

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:44

Hoolihan · 02/03/2023 22:42

Because how do we know which is which?

Show quote history

You could say that about any situation though, literally everything you do is a risk. You make risk analysis hundreds of times a day.

MaidOfSteel · 02/03/2023 22:45

Male police officers can hardly be surprised if lone women are cautious around them after recent revelations.

You absolutely did the right thing, OP. After seeing many of the replies, I'd feel confident to do the same if it ever happened to me.

CarrieBsWardrobe · 02/03/2023 22:46

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

FOJN · 02/03/2023 22:47

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:41

Oh do keep up, I referenced the advice that had been given on this thread (and presumably you’re happy for a suspected drunk driver to keep driving)

is there any reason you decided to twist what I was saying in order to meet your narrative?

Show quote history

I have seen people commenting on what they would do themselves but few telling other people what to do. The only people indulging in hyperbole here are those who think the OP was unreasonable; for example that I think it's fine for a suspected drink driver to keep driving, I have addressed this more than once.

SpyouttheLand · 02/03/2023 22:48

Police officers must surely know that recent cases will make some women nervous of them. If they can't understand that they shouldn't be working in any public facing role. But it sounds like these officers did and after establishing that she wasn't actually any risk because she wasn't drunk, they decided the breath test was unnecessary. I'm sure if they'd really believed she was drunk, they'd have taken whatever steps necessary to make sure she didn't drive.

Those of you who know so much about how the police work, how likely is this phonecall? Who would have made it?

Ponderingtosk · 02/03/2023 22:48

Def nbu, I would’ve done exactly the same and have had that in mind for the past twenty years that I’d drive to a local police station but def not getting out of my car.

Novatherova · 02/03/2023 22:48

Vlunken · 02/03/2023 22:30

I think policemen are often twats. It's the culture. Sorry.

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And what do you know about the culture.

They can't afford to be t...s because every moron has a smart phone ready to film them.

They're just trying to do their job.

Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:49

Lou670 · 02/03/2023 22:36

Going by the amount of potholes everywhere, are the police stopping everyone that is swerving to avoid the holes? My husband's car has just been classed as a right off as too expensive to repair, after hitting a pothole. I am swerving (if safe to do so) to avoid the same thing happening to my car. Not all drivers at 2am are intoxicated. We are a family of 4 and 3 of us are shift workers driving at all hours of the day or night.

With all due respect, this is nonsense. In this, and I’m sure many other similar situations, the police were behind a car in the early hours of the morning and observed the driver behaving erratically. Many more things tend to happen late at night than during the day. Some people on the road at that hour are up to no good. Probably a combination of those reasons made them stop the OP, to make sure she was fit to drive, and was not up to no good.

Nicknacky · 02/03/2023 22:49

SwordToFlamethrower · 02/03/2023 22:41

You definitely did the right thing. Sounds absolutely terrifying.

I thought that male police weren't allowed to pull over lone women in England anyway!

Why on earth would you think that!?

Hoolihan · 02/03/2023 22:51

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:44

You could say that about any situation though, literally everything you do is a risk. You make risk analysis hundreds of times a day.

Show quote history

Yes. This thread is specifically about the police though.

ArabellaScott · 02/03/2023 22:52

Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:20

I asked a question earlier upthread and no-one’s tackled it. Says a lot. A lot of posters here encouraging people into what amounts to civil disobedience. If you were a female, alone at home, at night, and there was an intruder in the house, I doubt if you’d think twice about trusting the police to help you. But you wouldn’t if you were stopped while driving ? So you want help when you need it, but you’re not prepared to comply with the law when it suits ?

www.itv.com/news/2023-02-08/culture-of-misogyny-endemic-in-british-policing-itv-exposure-uncovers

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/nov/02/prevalent-predatory-misogynistic-culture-in-police-official-report-finds

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/police-trust-women-violence-met-b2270766.html

www.politicshome.com/news/article/misogyny-sexism-and-predatory-behaviour-still-prevalent-in-many-forces-warns-police-watchdog-

'The independent inspectorate of Constabulary and Fire & Rescue Services (HMICFRS) have warned that a culture of misogyny, sexism and predatory behaviour towards members of the public and female colleagues persists across many UK police forces today.'

'More than 40 per cent of British people no longer trust the police amid an avalanche of scandals over police misogyny and sexual violence.'

etc

You'd be very mistaken if you write this off as 'hatred' or 'dislike'. Or if you presume that women on Mumsnet are not representative, broadly, of the general public.

We need a police force that we can broadly trust and rely on. We need more police, police need more support and training, and most of all we need the police force to face the issues.

Browbeating women and telling them their fears are stupid or that they're wrong or hateful won't work.

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