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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To have refused to get out of my car for the police in the middle of the night?

871 replies

AngeloMysterioso · 02/03/2023 17:05

Was driving home from work at just after 2 a.m last night when I was pulled over by a pair of male coppers in a squad car after I swerved in the road to avoid a pothole.

I stopped, lowered my window a crack and then turned the engine off and made sure all the doors were locked. They both got out of the car and came over, asked about where I was going, where I’d been etc etc and then asked about the swerve- I explained about the pothole, and that I didn’t consider the move to have been dangerous as there were no other vehicles or anywhere near me (they had been some distance in front of me at the time and on the other side of the road but there was absolutely no chance of a collision) and no pedestrians anywhere around.
Then they asked if I would get out of the car and take a breathalyser test. I refused- I said I’d happily drive to the police station (maybe a mile- mile and a half away) and take a breathalyser there, but that I didn’t feel safe getting out of my car and being alone with two massive blokes in the middle of the night with no other people around, and them being in a uniform didn’t change that for me.

They asked a few more questions about my work, if they needed to would anyone be able to verify that I’d been working, gave me a lecture about driving safely and in the end let me go home with no further action taken - but I’ve just had a phonecall from another police officer basically telling me off for not just doing as I was told.

Was I BU?

OP posts:
Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:05

Gilmorehill · 02/03/2023 21:58

Well they wanted to breathlyse her. If they genuinely thought she was, they had to follow it through. They didn’t which makes them look bad.

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Why does it make them look bad if they could verify that a pothole was where she said it was ? That would corroborate her story and talking to her would give them the opportunity to assess whether she was under the influence of something.

StripeyMow · 02/03/2023 22:06

YANBU

I’ve already had this discussion with female friends and relatives. We go to the station or you wait for my husband to attend the scene. There have been too many high profile cases of murder, rape, torture and abuse of women by scores of male police officers. The culture is pervasive. You have officers giving rapey nicknames of suspect colleagues, rather than challenging behaviour, sharing misogynistic banter about abusing women, or worse still, sharing photos of dead women on WhatsApp. The brutal kidnapping, rape and murder of Sarah Everard shocked the country to the very core. Abuses are rife and trust has been shattered. I am sure the police are more than aware that women feel like this. I would be surprised if forces are not trying to tackle this, and that’s why they let you go. The solution is not for women to find.

ArabellaScott · 02/03/2023 22:06

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 02/03/2023 22:02

Quoting it is not the same as understanding it. Swearing definitely makes you seem more knowledgeable about jurisprudence tho.

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You misrepresented my post.

FOJN · 02/03/2023 22:06

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 02/03/2023 21:58

The OP did not refuse to be breathalysed. She refused to get out of her car to do it

From the OP: Then they asked if I would get out of the car and take a breathalyser test. I refused - I said I’d happily drive to the police station (maybe a mile- mile and a half away) and take a breathalyser there

She did refuse. She didn't say, "I will take the test here, but I won't get out of the car". It may well be that this didn't occur to her - I'm not blaming her: I've been pulled over by the police at 2 in the morning, and it freaks you out, even when you have done nothing wrong.

I totally get why she acted as she did, but she was lucky not to have got into more trouble.

Saying she would drive to a police station to be breathalysed is not refusing to be breathalysed. The OP suggested a solution which, for obvious reasons, was not acceptable to the police but that is not the same as refusing to be breathalysed. She refused the get out of the car in that location.

Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:07

So, you’re a woman at home alone, and you suspect there’s an intruder in the house. You ring the police and two burly male officers turn up. Do you let them in ?

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 02/03/2023 22:07

Vlunken · 02/03/2023 22:00

"The police officer has reasonable cause to suspect that you have committed, or are currently committing, a moving traffic offence;
Having stopped them, an officer has reasonable cause to suspect that the person driving/attempting to drive/in charge of the vehicle has consumed alcohol;
The police officer has reasonable cause to believe that you were the person driving/attempting to drive/in charge of a motor vehicle, which was involved in an accident.
This means that the police cannot simply stop you at any time and insist on a breath test. They are entitled to randomly stop your car, but they can only insist on a breath test in one of the cases described above"

I can't see how swerving to avoid a pothole fits any of the three reasons to demand a breath test.

Because driving erratically in the middle of the night is quite often due to intoxication. Obviously. I've seen a lot of people killed or maimed by drink drivers and I'm very glad the police are acting when they have reasonable suspicion of drink driving.

MiniPumpkin · 02/03/2023 22:08

you can phone police yourself in this situation and give their badge numbers. Police Scotland advertise it

FOJN · 02/03/2023 22:08

As others have pointed out, offering to drive to the nearest police station doesn’t cut it.

Acknowledged in the post you are responding to.

Coffeeandcatsforlife · 02/03/2023 22:08

Not a bloody chance I’d have got out either OP. You were completely reasonable in your actions.

DdraigGoch · 02/03/2023 22:08

FKATondelayo · 02/03/2023 17:13

Wayne Couzens would have passed this check.

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He wouldn't (on that occasion at least), he wasn't supposed to be on duty.

pinkstripeycat · 02/03/2023 22:10

If you had noticed there were no cars around by regularly checking your mirrors then you would have seen the pot hole in time to slow down or go round it gently/smoothly/timely. Your driving is awful, you shouldn’t be driving. See drivers like you on the road daily and you are dangerous

Leftbutcameback · 02/03/2023 22:10

There is some useful advice here - I’m not sure I would have thought about it at the time but driving to a well lit petrol station (which is likely to have cctv) could be a practical solution especially where there are fewer police stations around www.bpcollins.co.uk/what-are-your-rights-if-approached-by-a-police-officer/

78Summer · 02/03/2023 22:11

Rightfully wary. You offered to drive to the station which they did not take up.

AdoraBell · 02/03/2023 22:12

YWNBU and tell the police that Sarah Everard did as she as was told by a police officer. Ask them how that worked out?

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:14

78Summer · 02/03/2023 22:11

Rightfully wary. You offered to drive to the station which they did not take up.

Yes let’s allow a person suspected of drunk driving to carry on driving 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️. Are you surprised they didn’t take up the suspected drink drivers offer to carry on and potentially kill someone?

Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:14

Leftbutcameback · 02/03/2023 22:10

There is some useful advice here - I’m not sure I would have thought about it at the time but driving to a well lit petrol station (which is likely to have cctv) could be a practical solution especially where there are fewer police stations around www.bpcollins.co.uk/what-are-your-rights-if-approached-by-a-police-officer/

They suspected her of drink driving. Why would they let her drive anywhere until they had verified that she was sober ?

Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:15

78Summer · 02/03/2023 22:11

Rightfully wary. You offered to drive to the station which they did not take up.

Because at that point she was suspected of drink driving and as has been said about a hundred times, they weren’t about to let her drive anywhere. If she was going to the station to provide the sample, it would have been in the police car.

MoirasSaggyBundles · 02/03/2023 22:17

FOJN · 02/03/2023 22:06

Saying she would drive to a police station to be breathalysed is not refusing to be breathalysed. The OP suggested a solution which, for obvious reasons, was not acceptable to the police but that is not the same as refusing to be breathalysed. She refused the get out of the car in that location.

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The OP has also said she would have taken the test had it been offered to her while she remained in situ in her car. The police did not do this. They let her drive away. They clearly did not believe she was any risk as a driver. The follow up phone call was therefore completely unnecessary, and/or an attempt to intimidate or try to deflect from the policemen' own lack of procedural knowledge.

Ratonastick · 02/03/2023 22:17

Coming to this thread very late and haven’t read it in full. I think you were very wise to be cautious, but be aware that the pol ie have a lot of power. I was in a similar position about 10 years ago. I refused to get out of the car for a lone police officer in a country lane at around 11pm and he basically tried to force the issue when I said I wanted to see ID. It was absolutely terrifying. It was followed up with a similar phone call to tell me off and I said his behaviour was inappropriate and threatening. I got pulled 3 times for speeding in the next month, 31mph, 31mph and 33mph, no speed awareness course offered so 9 points. Then I got pulled over again and told to think very carefully if I ever fancied reporting a traffic officer again. They left me alone after that. There was absolutely nothing I could do and they were careful not to get it anywhere near court.

So basically my advice is to drive very very carefully for the next few months as their colleagues may well be looking to “punish” you. And as a particularly revolting aside, issues reported in the Met come as no surprise and I am sure they are endemic based on my own experience.

Goldenbear · 02/03/2023 22:18

A digression but why do you have to have a good reason for driving at 2am?

TerribleInsomniac · 02/03/2023 22:18

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 21:37

…and the police car? Where had that come from? Carsupermarket?

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For example

To have refused to get out of my car for the police in the middle of the night?
MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 02/03/2023 22:19

FOJN · 02/03/2023 22:06

Saying she would drive to a police station to be breathalysed is not refusing to be breathalysed. The OP suggested a solution which, for obvious reasons, was not acceptable to the police but that is not the same as refusing to be breathalysed. She refused the get out of the car in that location.

Show quote history

Under the RTA 1988, the police officer can require the test to be taken at a police station, rather than at the scene, but there is no corresponding right of the suspect to do so.

In this case, the police clearly did not interpret what the OP said as a refusal, but she was taking a risk because they could have arrested her.

I have no issue with what the OP did - I totally understand it because she was scared. What I find alarming is all the terrible advice on this thread. If you are scared of the police and they stop you at night, the last thing you want to do is give them an excuse to arrest you when you haven't actually done anything wrong. You are giving them an excuse to forcibly remove you from your vehicle, hand-cuff you, and stick you in a police car. It's the very last thing you want to do if you are worried that they might harm you.

CarrieBsWardrobe · 02/03/2023 22:19

OMG12 · 02/03/2023 22:14

Yes let’s allow a person suspected of drunk driving to carry on driving 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️. Are you surprised they didn’t take up the suspected drink drivers offer to carry on and potentially kill someone?

Show quote history

This 100 %. Completely get OP's concern but the idiots in these replies scare me. No she couldn't do a breathalyser through the window, what's to stop her starting her ignition and driving off? And no she can't stay in the car. Op admits herself she swerved so knew of the genuine reason for the stop. If she were pissed and carried on and killed someone but police hadn't stopped her there would be outcry about that too. I don't want my elderly parents driving back from mine through miles of country lanes late at night to be at risk of drink drivers, but that's how it'll end up if police can't do their jobs.

Rosscameasdoody · 02/03/2023 22:20

I asked a question earlier upthread and no-one’s tackled it. Says a lot. A lot of posters here encouraging people into what amounts to civil disobedience. If you were a female, alone at home, at night, and there was an intruder in the house, I doubt if you’d think twice about trusting the police to help you. But you wouldn’t if you were stopped while driving ? So you want help when you need it, but you’re not prepared to comply with the law when it suits ?

Thesharkradar · 02/03/2023 22:21

A friends of mine's flat was commandeered by the police for a surveillance operation. One of the policemen who was alone with her in the flat tried it on with her and was reluctant to take no for an answer. She was put in a very difficult situation - she did not report it as it would have been her word against his
awful, it's like they cant resist exploiting their power, he did it knowing he'd be able to get away with it and she'd feel unable to speak out, he'll have done it before I'd think. Sickening.