About scouts refusing "time off".

[AmIreallyBeverly]

TLDR: Should scouts hold a place for 3 months if we keep paying subs and have a good reason not to attend?

Son has done cubs/beavers/scouts at the same group. We've always actively supported them including volunteering occassionally. There are no other suitable groups.

He's got a very rare opportunity to do a 3month ice hockey course. He's been talking about similar stuff for ages and is desperate to do it. Of course it clashes with scouts.

We told scouts he wouldn't be coming for a 3 months and why but we would keep paying subs to hold his place. They said they won't hold his place because of their waiting list.

I'm so angry. We kept paying during lockdown when about half of parents stopped because they weren't doing anything. They all kept their places (I know some (not all) was due to the financial impact on some families. It was a local decision, not from regional). There are also families that turn up inconsistently or just for the good bits who keep their places.

He (and us) have already shown years of commitment so I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for 3 months "off". They won't be worse off for it.

My son doesn't want to give up scouts so has turned down the ice hockey but is really upset and it's made me not want to support them in any way going forward.

We did think lying to scouts and saying he was ill/we were on holiday/he has a Dr's appointment etc during those 3 months but didn't feel it was an appropriate thing to teach our son.

YANBU - as long as you pay subs and have a definate date you'll be returning, they should keep your place.

YABU - there are people waiting to join and 3 months is a long time.

I'm with the scouts. If there's a waiting list, another child should have the chance.

I really hope he doesn’t give up the ice hockey opportunity for scouts! Something he’s been doing since he is 6! What an amazing opportunity.

Just put his name back on their waiting list and hope a space comes up.

This.

Explorers don't have a waiting list in our district. They are struggling with getting enough numbers.

Give someone else the gift of a chance. They might decide to continue into explorers too then.

You can't have 'temporary' spaces for scouts to accomodate 'permentant' scouts. That's two tier bullshit.

All for nothing though Op if you’re doing with a cats bum expression on your face, judging those who don’t show the same COMMITMENT and basically always looking for something to complain and or be angry about 😂

Another thing to consider is how old your son is - I have double checked your updates but couldn't see if an actual age was stated.

Scouts are 10-14, if your son has been attending for at least 3 years (as you said you were paying through lockdown 2020) he's at least 13 so they're probably loathe to hold a place for a child who is more than likely going to move up to Explorers within the next year anyway.

It's the balance of keeping a space for 3 months for a 13.5year old who will then potentially not come back in September as they're now 14 and moved up to Explorers or allowing another younger child to have a longer chance of experiencing Scouts rather than waiting on the list and potentially aging out before they even step into a Scout session (I saw this happen when I was a Guide - girls would join groups for a matter of months because they'd been on the waiting list for literal years and by the time they got in they were aging out of that level)

Computers are down at work and I'd forgotten to shut this tab down. I'm surprised it's still going.

I'm genuingely not sure what you're talking about re my past posts. Yes, I literally have nothing to do and I've actually gone through them so see what the fuss is and why I'm such a shouty , entiled horrible person based on them. I'm none the wiser and don't think anything I've posted is horrendous or unpleasant, even if you don't agree with what I've said/asked.

I've got one moaning about drama class (I listened to advice on here and didn't complain but other parents did and it was changed),
one asking if lunea will work on my hairy legs. Very self indulgent.
one talking about how loud the office seems compared to WFH.
one eabout being upset about a comment a friend made (not moaning about the friend despite someone upthread purposely misinterpreting it)
one asking about lifts (and people generally thought I was OK)
one asking about ear piercing (BTW she has now decided she doesn't want it which was exactly what I was worried about),
One about.bedtime stories (the horror!)
and one about a man thinking the word "lady" is offensive.

I've commented on other threads but hopefully they've been supportive. I have never called anyone names, made fun of them or kicked them when they are down. That's not my style, especially online.

I am very obviously a moaning, demanding so and so and raising spoilt awful children.

I am definately leaving this thread now though. I acknowledge that the general consensus is that IABU.

And this thread… you are furious. You are “so angry”

does this strike you as a normal reaction? Or a pattern of behaviour that means these scout leaders had their fingers crossed ice hockey would win out

Our scout groups have a 3 consecutive missed weeks (without good reason) and you’re out policy. Places at cubs and beavers in particular are really in demand and you may be paying subs but you’re depriving someone else of an opportunity

@shockthemonkey OPs post at 10.49 where she asks "so what about all the effort we've put in" and then proceeds to list things she's volunteered for. To me that reads as though she's expecting special consideration because she's volunteered.

Without a shadow of a doubt she does

thankfully the scout group saw sense

Yes I am angry and yes I think that is perfectly reasonable. I feel let down and disappointed for my son. I feel his commitment and effort over years and various changes is not being acknowledged. I am worried about the opportunity he is missing. I am perfectly entitled to feel that way. You might say "it's only scouts, get over it but it isn't that simple".

What I would not be entitled to do is be unpleasant or shout at the leaders which I have not done and wouldn't. What would not be acceptable is to kick up a fuss or be difficult or to try and throw my weight around. What would not be acceptable is to refuse to acknowledge the volunteer who lives a few houses down.

I haven't done any of that. I have accepted their decision and worked out the pros and cons of each activity with my son so he can chose. That doesn't mean I can't be angry.

I really am finishing this here.

I feel his commitment and effort over years and various changes is not being acknowledged.

aka even though most people are telling me that I am being unreasonable (and explaining WHY the Scouts group may have refused my request), I know that I am right 😆

I don't think you're being unreasonable. 3 months out of several years of commitment to scouts is nothing. If they won't budge, maybe worth asking them if they would consider putting you at the top of the waiting list so when he can return he gets the next space.

Yes I am angry and yes I think that is perfectly reasonable. I feel let down and disappointed for my son

It's reasonable to feel a bit disappointed for your son. It's totally unreasonable to feel let down or angry at volunteers who won't run things the way you think they should, for the benefit of your child, to the detriment of other children.

Your son has options. Have you tried looking for another scout troop on a different evening? Most will do their best to accommodate a child who is already in the scouting movement. Have you asked if your DS can be placed on the waiting list now for when he hopes to come back? Have you offered to volunteer, to increase the numbers the troop can take? If your son will be
13 1/2 by the time he wants to return, he can probably move straight on up to Explorers, is this a possibility?

Yes I saw that but in her OP there was no indication that she went into this volunteering with the expectation of a payback.

It's quite different, you see, to volunteer just in the expectation of a payback, versus volunteering because you wish to help, and later being disappointed that you weren't shown a bit of consideration in return.

I feel MY his commitment and effort over years and various changes is not being acknowledged.

The crucial part is, did she volunteer only in order to then call in a favour?

There is no indication in her posts that this was the case.

She volunteered. She showed commitment, raised funds, attended regularly.

Now she would like a little flexibility.

As I say I have been a scout leader. My approach would have been to keep the place for her. The caveats being a. we didn't have huge waiting lists and b. parents who volunteer are quite precious and rare.

I've run beaver groups (supervised obviously) when they needed some support. My son had left beavers by then.
We ALWAYS volunteer when they ask for parent helpers in any of the groups. I hate it TBH but if they need support, then they need support.
We donate to every cause. I've raised money for them.
I did discuss volunteerimg in a (non child facing!) role but couldn't commit.
We don't do teacher gifts but always do gifts for the volunteers.

plus telling us about the £500 donation

This is all about your commitment. Squat all to do with your son.

And a lot of the time

it’s not how much you do

but how you go about doing it

and I suspect the latter may hold a lot of sway in this scenario op

Now imagine you did have a waiting list

and regularly contacted by parents of younger boys ie not early teens and about to leave desperate to join.

would you still be inclined to allow this place to languish until September?

I've heard, and experienced as a guide member, similar things about expectations that scouts/guides etc have to take priority over any and everything else in a person's life. The idea that you might regard something with family as more important if it clashed with guide camp was not taken well.
Yes I can see the views about volunteers etc but while these organizations are generally highly regarded, they aren't the only thing on offer. I think you were fair in offering to keep the place paid for but that must be against their wait list/attendance policy.

I actually did have a waiting list

I said it wasn't huge.

I didn't say I didn't have one.

I've heard, and experienced as a guide member, similar things about expectations that scouts/guides etc have to take priority over any and everything else in a person's life. The idea that you might regard something with family as more important if it clashed with guide camp was not taken well

I'm not sure that this is relevant here. Of course sometimes things clash, and missing the odd weekly meeting due to a family event, or not being able to go on camp because of another commitment will happen sometimes. No one is saying otherwise. This applies to the young people, and the leaders too.

But in this case, the OP is talking about missing 3 months, not just the odd meeting or weekend event. The two aren't comparable.

I think this is really cheeky of you, your child will have to choose.

As I say I have been a scout leader. My approach would have been to keep the place for her. The caveats being a. we didn't have huge waiting lists and b. parents who volunteer are quite precious and rare

That's fine, and of course, is your decision as a leader to make. But it's also ok for the scout leader to choose not to keep the place open. It's a bit much, IMO, for the OP to be so angry about this, given that it seems a reasonable enough decision to most people.