About scouts refusing "time off".

[AmIreallyBeverly]

TLDR: Should scouts hold a place for 3 months if we keep paying subs and have a good reason not to attend?

Son has done cubs/beavers/scouts at the same group. We've always actively supported them including volunteering occassionally. There are no other suitable groups.

He's got a very rare opportunity to do a 3month ice hockey course. He's been talking about similar stuff for ages and is desperate to do it. Of course it clashes with scouts.

We told scouts he wouldn't be coming for a 3 months and why but we would keep paying subs to hold his place. They said they won't hold his place because of their waiting list.

I'm so angry. We kept paying during lockdown when about half of parents stopped because they weren't doing anything. They all kept their places (I know some (not all) was due to the financial impact on some families. It was a local decision, not from regional). There are also families that turn up inconsistently or just for the good bits who keep their places.

He (and us) have already shown years of commitment so I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for 3 months "off". They won't be worse off for it.

My son doesn't want to give up scouts so has turned down the ice hockey but is really upset and it's made me not want to support them in any way going forward.

We did think lying to scouts and saying he was ill/we were on holiday/he has a Dr's appointment etc during those 3 months but didn't feel it was an appropriate thing to teach our son.

YANBU - as long as you pay subs and have a definate date you'll be returning, they should keep your place.

YABU - there are people waiting to join and 3 months is a long time.

I think it is a bit lousy to be honest. You show up all the time, pay the subs and are willing to pay the subs when he is gone. 3 months is not a long time especially for such a good opportunity, you would think they would make an exception.

You can’t BUY a place.

The kid that your child would be denying a place to might not have a pot to piss in. It doesn’t make them less worthy of a space than your child.

I can see both sides. He's been committed for years. But the waiting lists are a balancing act (you need to ensure you have enough spaces for kids moving up, while making sure you gave enough kids to cover bills)

How old is he?

(We lose most of ours at 13ish to cadets... the cadets do a better range if activities than the local explorers.)

YABU of course

Again it is about all scouts not just your child, you can justify it anyway you want

It doesn't change anything but to me personally you are coming across worse than your op

I have to agree with this.

I think it's a very strange way of looking at it that you're 'supporting' them by making use of their group for all this time. Loyalty and commitment, yes; but 'supporting'?!

It's not a business: paying subs is the necessary auxiliary part, but the main purpose of running the groups is to provide the experience to the children. The volunteers who run it give up their time because they want to make a difference to the kids, not just to shuffle subs money around. It's not like an actual business where they would bite your hand off if you committed to paying them regularly but only turned up when it was convenient (if at all) - thinking most gyms in January!

As PP, I would question whether this was going to be an isolated one-off three month experience - three months is a long time - and then they all say their farewells; or if the hope/intention/potential is for it to be extended or become permanent. I can completely see why Scouts wouldn't want to be paid off and treated as a constant second-best, in reserve for when the 'better' hobby might not be running on the odd week - when there are other kids who are desperate to do it as their one hobby week in, week out.

I get this though OP. I'm going through similar with DS's sport, where the Club he's played for, for 8 years, (and DH has given up his time to coach) is slowly dropping him, for kids who've been playing for 6 months. I'm muttering to myself about how unfair it all is too.

Ahh so you want to buy your son a place?

Massively unreasonable sorry. And you have missed the point of scouts those people are volunteers the subs is payment for hall and sundries paying them shouldn’t hold your slot. You are being like one of those sun bed people at dodgy hotels! .

Definitely go for the sport - most teens I know leave scouts / guides in early secondary but the sport might be for life.

He's not committed to scouts if he's going to drop it for 3 months

I didn't mean it like that. I just meant that it shows we take it seriously and know and appreciate the work that goes into it. Some parents do see the volunteers as child care, rather than understand what they do.

I know children have to make choices and that is why we didn't lie to scouts about why he couldn't go. It would have been really, really easy to have done that and nothing would have been done. He would have been allowed back after 3months if we'd lied.

Anyway, I have well and truly been answered (in a way I didn't want! 🤣).

Well as I said in my OP, he chose scouts despite the opportunities the ice hockey could have given him and how much he's wanted it for years. I reckon that shows commitment don't you?

I'm a scout leader and I think they are being ridiculius. Obviously our group ia not as popular since we don't have waiting lists. But it's very shortsighted to give up on kids that are committed and families that are committed. They are so valuable and important for the growth and continuation of the organisation. I would not skip the sports camp for this.

You can't hold places, imagine if 80% of the group did this. You'd have 4 kids there each week....

On balance I think YABU. It just doesn't make sense to keep a place empty, and who knows whether he will really come back? He may want to stick with the ice hockey, and he's at an age where lots of people move on from scouts.

I do think it would be reasonable to put him at the top of the waiting list at the end of the 3 months, if he does wish to return.

The “subs” are peanuts

I think they were absolutely correct

they weren’t interested in fact you would continue paying subs

They instead wanted to open up the space to give another child the opportunity

My managers son does ice hockey. It's all consuming and very expensive! Hope you are prepared for that. It rules her life outside of work.

And they didn’t give you any favour because of anything g in the past

I like the sound of this scout group!!!

I guess I'm cross because he has attended pretty much every week since he signed up when he was 6. Much more consistently than many others

But he's done that because he wanted to, for his benefit, not for the benefit of the scouts!

We did think lying to scouts and saying he was ill/we were on holiday/he has a Dr's appointment etc during those 3 months but didn't feel it was an appropriate thing to teach our son.

that was your only reason for not lying?

Yanbu, particularly due to:
A - length of membership and continued reliable support of the club

B - the fact you paid throughout lockdown when not receiving club facilities whilst other members stopped paying

C - it is a predetermined timescale and one off situation during which you are prepared to continue paying subs.

You have made it sound like him attending regularly and doing “the boring stuff” was a feat of endurance rather than just part and parcel of scouts

Given we are still on a waiting list 3 years after moving here and applying for scouts, I'm torn on the right way to go about this.
I can see both points of view.