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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

About scouts refusing "time off".

197 replies

AmIreallyBeverly · 28/02/2023 09:47

TLDR: Should scouts hold a place for 3 months if we keep paying subs and have a good reason not to attend?

Son has done cubs/beavers/scouts at the same group. We've always actively supported them including volunteering occassionally. There are no other suitable groups.

He's got a very rare opportunity to do a 3month ice hockey course. He's been talking about similar stuff for ages and is desperate to do it. Of course it clashes with scouts.

We told scouts he wouldn't be coming for a 3 months and why but we would keep paying subs to hold his place. They said they won't hold his place because of their waiting list.

I'm so angry. We kept paying during lockdown when about half of parents stopped because they weren't doing anything. They all kept their places (I know some (not all) was due to the financial impact on some families. It was a local decision, not from regional). There are also families that turn up inconsistently or just for the good bits who keep their places.

He (and us) have already shown years of commitment so I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for 3 months "off". They won't be worse off for it.

My son doesn't want to give up scouts so has turned down the ice hockey but is really upset and it's made me not want to support them in any way going forward.

We did think lying to scouts and saying he was ill/we were on holiday/he has a Dr's appointment etc during those 3 months but didn't feel it was an appropriate thing to teach our son.

YANBU - as long as you pay subs and have a definate date you'll be returning, they should keep your place.

YABU - there are people waiting to join and 3 months is a long time.

OP posts:
Original poster
AmIreallyBeverly · 28/02/2023 11:05

I have to go to work now but comments taken on board. Thank you.

OP posts:
Jelly0naplate · 28/02/2023 11:05

it's not about just 'holding' the place though is it - an active group means they can book activities and if they have people holding spots they can't do this as they then don't have people turning up.
Our scout group waiting list for all sections is so big that we're turning people away - someone could be making good use of that space.

While it's a tough decision to decide between the two activities that's life.

Viviennemary · 28/02/2023 11:10

I think the scouts are right. There is a waiting list. And it's not just about the money. Its a voluntary organisation and many people give their time for free.YABU.

titchy · 28/02/2023 11:11

OK, so what about the effort we've put in? I KNOW VOLUNTEERS DO MUCH MORE (in capitals so no one can say I'm devaluing, don't appreciate the work they put in or think I'm comparing myself).

So you only volunteered to curry favour with the leaders then? Really?

AnneElliott · 28/02/2023 11:12

Op I agree with you and I'm a beaver leader. If he's been a consistent member since young and it is just 1 term then I would hold the place.

How far off explorers is he? As generally explorers aren't over subscribed as kids get into other stuff around that age. So if they hold firm then maybe he could leave scouts and just rejoin explorers?

sanityisamyth · 28/02/2023 11:14

titchy · 28/02/2023 09:51

It's not what I would call a good reason though is it. A good reason is medical treatment, bereavement, counselling. This is another hobby activity. Not really fair your kid should take two hobby places at the same time when kids off the waiting list can't even have one.

This. We have a massive waiting list to join our group because we're awesome and I'd feel very uncomfortable agreeing to this.

Derbee · 28/02/2023 11:15

AmIreallyBeverly · 28/02/2023 10:17

Just to add as well, I managed to get work to donate over £500 to them to pay for new tents so again, it shows commitment. It involved a full business case and a lot of work (albeit nowhere near as much work as the volunteers do).

Your updates each make it sound more and more like you genuinely believes it’s reasonable to take a place from another child on a waiting list, to hold a space for your son to rejoin a quit activity 3 months later….

The sheer entitlement is astounding. If you’re saying he won’t get another place in Scouts, then the children on the waiting list have been waiting a long time, and it’s not fair that you can keep them waiting even when your son has given up his place for 3 months.

FoxInSocksSatOnBlocks · 28/02/2023 11:18

YABVU. 3 months is way too long and it isn’t unfair on you at all.

It would be unfair for you to hog a place you’re not using.

Blueyandbingooo · 28/02/2023 11:19

Continuing to pay subs is irrelevant really as they will get the same from someone else joining. If its anywhere like here wait lists are exceptionally long and as lots who volunteer do so as they are passionate about giving children the opportunity to join and do these things, of course they're more likely to want to offer the space to someone else rather than keep it open. Good for them

LlynTegid · 28/02/2023 11:22

I'm with the scout group on this one. As mentioned, it is not because of illness or an operation, for example.

soleilblue · 28/02/2023 11:23

AmIreallyBeverly · 28/02/2023 10:26

Well as I said in my OP, he chose scouts despite the opportunities the ice hockey could have given him and how much he's wanted it for years. I reckon that shows commitment don't you?

Show quote history

Yeah but when you asked them they assumed he was going to drop it for 3 months which wouldn't have been commitment. If hed dropped them then he wouldn't have been. Which is OK.

Personally I think he should do the icehocky

soleilblue · 28/02/2023 11:25

And who is to say another kid wouldn't be as committed if they were given the chance

SimplySipping · 28/02/2023 11:31

It's worth asking where he would slot back into the waiting list. The might put him high on the list given the commitment he has shown previously. If so it might not be too much of an issue as kids will be moving up to leave other spaces all the time.

I am not at all surprised they want someone to use the space though. The culture is literally about helping others.

PuttingDownRoots · 28/02/2023 11:32

Re commitment... it could well be the top of the waiting list is 10.5yo Cubs waiting to move up.

Bearoflittlebrain · 28/02/2023 11:35

Yes, sorry. I understand why you’re annoyed given how responsible you’ve been over a long period of time and how you’ve valued the place. Yes, others should do the same and they don’t and the scouts need to take that up with them.

But you’re asking for a whole term off from a volunteer run organisation with big waiting lists. The top thing leaders are concerned about is the children turning up, learning and enjoying themselves. It’s a big ask and pretty much any group that’s got a waiting list would say no because they’re denying another child the chance to be involved.

Explorers rarely have waiting lists, could your son not do the course and then return to that section? The alternative way to ensure he can do both is for either you or your other half to become a leader (could be with one of the other sections) or to take up a role with priority on the group’s executive, so your son gets a priority place back at scouts after the course.

(Yes, I’ve been a leader in the past. It’s generally pretty good fun.)

lieselotte · 28/02/2023 11:39

afinishedkiss · 28/02/2023 10:18

I think it is a bit lousy to be honest. You show up all the time, pay the subs and are willing to pay the subs when he is gone. 3 months is not a long time especially for such a good opportunity, you would think they would make an exception.

I agree with this. I think you will have to just sit in a corner and mutter that it's not fair.

But if I had a child on the waiting list I might be miffed that I couldn't get a place when someone was "hogging" a place. So I can see both sides, but given your commitment I'd have thought they'd make an exception.

budgiegirl · 28/02/2023 11:45

So I can see both sides, but given your commitment I'd have thought they'd make an exception

But the problem is, what if it's not an exception? Perhaps they've had this issue before and refused the time off. Maybe they don't want to set a precedent of this being acceptable in the future.

I get that it's frustrating, but sometimes these things happen. The OP could look for another scout troop on another evening. Or offer to volunteer as a leader or exec member, which, in most groups, would mean an automatic place for her child when he wants to return.

S72 · 28/02/2023 11:45

Maybe offer to volunteer as a parent helper/assistant leader when your child's hockey thing has finished. Then, the scouts could expand the group with the correct ratios. So your child could return and hopefully a couple more off the waiting list. Win-win!

shockthemonkey · 28/02/2023 11:46

I think Scouts, and many on here, are being harsh.

I spent years as a Scouts leader and would have really appreciated the support you've given over the years. I would have shown more flexibility, had it been my decision.

TutiFrutti · 28/02/2023 11:46

We had the same situation with our ds. He got selected for county cricket training squad which clashed with scouts. At the end of the training there's no guarantee of selection to the team.
We sat him down, talked through his options and he chose the cricket. He understood he couldn't do both and it wasn't fair to hold a place when there's a waiting list.
Sometimes you just have to make that choice even when it's hard.

bigbluebus · 28/02/2023 11:47

Your son has learnt a very important lesson in life - that he can't have everything he wants and life isn't always fair.

And regarding your volunteering efforts (whilst those are admirable) you don't give to receive. You should never hope to gain an advantage over others just because you volunteered.

shockthemonkey · 28/02/2023 11:48

OK but where does OP say she only volunteered in a calculating frame of mind in order to curry favour?

mixedrecycling · 28/02/2023 11:48

On the whole I agree with the Scouts (and most posters here). Three months is too long when there is a waiting list.

Sometimes you just have to make that choice even when it's hard.
^^This - tough choices are also important life lessons.

MrsRosieBrew · 28/02/2023 11:48

They wouldn’t agree to it and you are BU to expect them too. For one thing, the leaders would receive criticism from other parents once they heard that a place had been kept open for your son. And I’ve been a scout leader and I know how demoralising it is when you give up your time to entertain other people kids only to be criticised by the parents (none of whom are willing to give up their time to entertain other people’s kids)!

SpyouttheLand · 28/02/2023 11:49

Your son has a great opportunity that you rightly want to support, but in doing that you want to prevent another child having the opportunity at Scouts?

Actually that level of selfishness/unawareness is quite staggering.

He gets to make a choice whether to keep the place at Scouts, but he can't hold it if he's not going to use it. IMO

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