Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to think my DH sounds like an dick

230 replies

SandroSandra · 24/02/2023 09:55

Opinions on this conversation pls. We live in a small old scruffy cottage and have 2 small kids

I commented to DH that restoration isn't so much of a joy when you have to work full time and you've got kids (inspired by a thread on here i was reading this morning) and that isn't it frustrating our cottage is still so scruffy and broken even though we've been here 3 years.

He said "ah well that's the thing about feminism innit. Women want to work but guess what there isn't enough time to make a nice home too"

I said "well it's more that most couples both need to work these days to pay the bills"

He said "sure of course but just odd all these women stressing that they want perfect homes, following restoration accounts and Mrs hinch on Instagram. But no woman has time to do any of it so just make you all feel guilty. It's almost like it was a good idea to have someone stay at home because guess what making a beautiful home is a full time job and adding restoration on top of it - it's impossible"

And I said "but men could stay home if they wanted"

He said "but we don't want to really. You were the ones that wanted to change the model and set up and then you're all stressing out you don't have time to do it all"

He then started saying

"Oh course there is a theory that the Rockefella family made feminism a success just to get 50% of the working people working their arse off and paying tax. And women fell for it"

Does he sound like a dick? It really wound me up but he insists whats he's saying is just logical.

OP posts:
Botw1 · 24/02/2023 12:57

@Mark19735

No, it's not impossible to work and do housework and parent

lots of people do it.

And no, it's not OK to enter into family life and then decide you cba to do any of the work related to family life. It is not optional.

Not without consequences any way.

Weallhaveavoice · 24/02/2023 12:57

GloomyDarkness · 24/02/2023 12:19

He sounds like a dick and as PP say it economics not feminism that led to most now needing two wages as as otehr note in most past times working women worked for economic and ramp capitalists reasons.

but just odd all these women stressing that they want perfect homes, following restoration accounts and Mrs hinch on Instagram. But no woman has time to do any of it so just make you all feel guilty

I do wonder if this is an issue though* *- is this something you do ?

I do find it's other women who judge the state of my house and that seems to related just to me - even though DH and 3 teens also live here all just as capable as me of doing house stuff.

I used to eye roll when people commented on my then young kids having toys out when they came in but it's only in recent years I've managed not to go into cleaning frenzy when MIL is about to visit.

You’re right
It isn’t male visitors that give that look of ‘ judgement ‘ about the house. It’s other women.

I still go into a cleaning frenzy tho if anyones about to visit.
Even for the gas man🤣

Babooshka1990 · 24/02/2023 12:57

Could you quit your job and let him pay for everything then? I bet he wouldn’t like that either.

Also traditionally men would do al the DIY and major decorating (whilst working full time providing for their family) so what is he even on about?

ReneBumsWombats · 24/02/2023 12:58

Mark19735 · 24/02/2023 12:53

Not bullshit.

The anti-capitalist posters on here will confirm that if working 1.5 jobs was sustainable in the long run, corporates would be lobbying for a standard 60hr working week. (In salaried roles that are exempted from the working time directive, that is already the norm anyhow - hence so many people, men and women, being burnt out).

And, as a point of order, he does get to decide he doesn't want to do the 0.5. That is what autonomy means. It's the OP who wants to divorce him for it ... her choice. Her bed. She can lie in it. He still get's to decide whether or not to do the extra 0.5.

The only bullshit I'd call out is the myth that running a household really is a 1.0 role. A very diligent and fussy person could probably find things to do to occupy 40hrs, but in reality anyone who outsources this work will find that 2-3hrs cleaning, 2-3hrs laundry, 1hr shopping, and 15hrs wraparound childcare is plenty to live in a clean, respectable house. That's about 20hrs ... the bullshit comes from MN users pretending the other 20 consist of 'mental load' which is in some way equally exhausting to actual work, when in reality it's just procrastination masquerading is inefficiency.

Show quote history

I'd just like to thank you for calling yourself Mark. I was absolutely expecting FlowerLadyMarilynTheGirl when I checked the name and the honesty is truly refreshing.

FinallyHere · 24/02/2023 12:58

He is not completely wrong, is he?

However, another relevant question is what level of reward do you each receive for your work?

Very different if he is earning loads, in which case outsource the renovations.

Is your work 'just' a vanity project or are your earnings required to cover your costs. What pension contributions are you making ?

I'd want to know the answer to these questions before commenting.

Saltywalruss · 24/02/2023 13:00

Well, he's right. If one person works and one person stays at home to work on the house obviously then more work gets done on the house .

Solittletimeforwine · 24/02/2023 13:00

The issue is phrased correctly he is right.

women often do feel under pressure to do it all and have a beautiful home and men often do give less of a shit. Not all in either category by far. And of course if one person stayed home. Then yes more could be done at home.

but that’s not what he said is it. What he did was make a dig at you. Like yeah you’re living like this as you want to work so fuck you.

clairelouwho · 24/02/2023 13:01

SandroSandra · 24/02/2023 11:02

@toodlesofoodles I don't think I've exaggerated it.

If he read this thread he'd argue back and say something like

"But I'm not insisting women stay at home. I'm just saying unless you pay for cleaners and handymen all the time, it's very hard to have a nice home if you're both working. And yet women still feel pressured to have nice homes. And I think feminism has made things harder for women in that sense"

I think he would argue he's not being sexist just logical.

Is that not logical?

It’s not sexist to point out that when both partners work full time, have a kid or kids that things like having that nice home take a backseat because there simply isn’t the time for it.

Pointing out areas where things aren’t actually perfect for many women and men because of feminism isn’t sexism. feminism hasn’t been the great success for men and women that we like to pretend that it has. It’s made a lot of great leaps for women absolutely but there is some downsides to it as well. And we’re starting to see them come to fruition now.

Anyone who pretends that men have had it easy and great before feminism is talking out of their arse as well.

BertHandsome · 24/02/2023 13:03

It's almost like it was a good idea to have someone stay at home because guess what making a beautiful home is a full time job
Remind him that men used to work hard to bring in the bacon to afford a woman to stay home so perhaps he needs to buck his ideas up and be a bette rorovider for his family Wink I bet he would sharp change his tune. Prick.

AmyDudley · 24/02/2023 13:03

I think the problem (apart from his 'views' which are total wankery) is that his response was totally unempathetic. Your comment indicates frustration, feeling a bit down about the house being scruffy, finding trying to juggle all parts of your life hard and sadness that what you probably thought would by now be a lovely cottage, is still a work not even in progress because of time constraints'

An empathetic answer would have been 'I know it is really frustrating, I feel it too - we are just so busy. maybe we could look at getting someone in to do some of the work, or perhaps we could set aside a time each weekend where one of us works on the house while the other minds the kids, or the kids could stay with a friend while we worked on the house together. Lets really get going on this and make it work for us.' It acknowledges your feelings and looks for practical solutions and invite joint problem solving and a joint goal.

Instead he completely ignored your feelings and decided this was the time to deliver an ill-researched lecture on 'feminism' and his opinions thereon.
So he achieved (two things) probably deliberately.

  1. he dismissed your feelings, and indicated the blame lay with women and by definition that includes you. and
2. he avoided dealing with the problem of the cottage and its restoration by veering into an irrelevant and distracting tangent to try to stop you talking about it, and to avoid finding a solution (which I suspect he's not actually that interested in doing).

.

C4ou56 · 24/02/2023 13:03

Mark19735 · 24/02/2023 12:31

And I said "but men could stay home if they wanted"
He said "but we don't want to really."

This ^^

Everyone interpreting this conversation as the OP's DH having sexist views is completely missing the point. There is no pressure emanating from the OP's DH to have a tidy house. He is not expecting the OP to work and keep a tidy house. His position is quite clear, and fairly egalitarian.

  1. He prefers to work full time and accepts he doesn't have time/energy to keep the house tidy.
  2. He is happy for the OP to work full time (if that's what she wants); He'd also be happy for her to be a SAHM (if that's what she wants). But he recognises that there aren't enough hours in the day for the OP to do both.

For all those saying "but if he did more housework then the OP could have it all ..." see point 1. He doesn't want to work 1.5 jobs just so OP can work 1.5 jobs. He wants to work 1.0 jobs.

It is the OP (and by extension, all feminists) who wanted to add 1.0 paid work jobs to 1.0 home-making jobs but can't cope with 2.0 jobs. Which isn't surprising, because no man can, either - not in the long run. The difference being, few men expect to. The pressure comes entirely from other women.

Well said. Although it sounds like your husband may not always explain things in the most effective way he makes a valid point. Now we have a child my husband is focused on his job and providing the finances his family need. I am unable to have that tunnel vision and spend a lot of my time worrying about the house and my daughters needs etc. Having a child has really highlighted how I, as the female, am the natural homemaker and my husband, as the male, is naturally the provider.

Botw1 · 24/02/2023 13:05

@c4ou56

'the female, am the natural homemaker and my husband, as the male, is naturally the provider.'

🤢

bobbytorq · 24/02/2023 13:07

Forgooodnesssakenow · 24/02/2023 11:27

Why would you have married someone who thinks like this about women in the first place? You'd talked before the wedding right?

Show quote history

Exactly this. I can't understand how this kind of shit isn't known about before people marry.

VictoriaBun · 24/02/2023 13:07

Tell him if that's the way he feels then you will stay at home , have his dinner on the table , bake a cake in the afternoon but he will have to get another job to make it happen.

ReneBumsWombats · 24/02/2023 13:07

Having a child has really highlighted how I, as the female, am the natural homemaker and my husband, as the male, is naturally the provider.

Why am I imagining David Attenborough reading a pronoun-corrected version of this in voiceover?

And does this mean gay couples are fucked?

Hairmouse · 24/02/2023 13:10

If he wants to deal in stereotypes it’s a man’s job to do the DIY. My dad is a builder and is very judgey about my DHs lack of DIY skills! He thinks it’s a man’s job!

Particularprick · 24/02/2023 13:13

Clumsy but he has a point. If women never went out to work would house prices be what they are now? No. They'd be much lower.

Pointerdogsrule · 24/02/2023 13:14

LookingOldTheseDays · 24/02/2023 10:16

When was this fictional past time when women didn't work?

Working class women have always worked. They've always had to.

THIS

You could argue he's broken the model by not earning enough so you can be the classic 50's housewife

Misunderstoodagain · 24/02/2023 13:14

Don't shoot me but I do kind of see his logic! I would love to not have to work 50 hours a week to actually do up my home, not have piles of washing mount up before I've time to do it and spend quality time with the wee one, my husband to be if great at keeping on top of things but doesn't see the details so yes it's up to me to make a nice home.... if I had the bloody time! I'm not sure what he said was sexist really. I understand that he was making the point that he actually doesn't care if the house is renovated to a certain standard, mine is the same tbh

Pointerdogsrule · 24/02/2023 13:14

Particularprick · 24/02/2023 13:13

Clumsy but he has a point. If women never went out to work would house prices be what they are now? No. They'd be much lower.

What the f..........?

AussieMozzieMagnet · 24/02/2023 13:16

GoodChat · 24/02/2023 10:34

Tell him traditionally men would decorate and do DIY and women would clean and care for the children.

I'd hazard a guess you're still doing the 'woman's work' despite both working full time.

Women have traditionally decorated their home. Not sure where you got your very wrong info there.

AussieMozzieMagnet · 24/02/2023 13:17

Misunderstoodagain · 24/02/2023 13:14

Don't shoot me but I do kind of see his logic! I would love to not have to work 50 hours a week to actually do up my home, not have piles of washing mount up before I've time to do it and spend quality time with the wee one, my husband to be if great at keeping on top of things but doesn't see the details so yes it's up to me to make a nice home.... if I had the bloody time! I'm not sure what he said was sexist really. I understand that he was making the point that he actually doesn't care if the house is renovated to a certain standard, mine is the same tbh

Agree with you totally.

UpUpAndAwol · 24/02/2023 13:17

Me and my husband talk about this a lot. His point about needing two wages to live comfortably which leaves nobody to do anything in the house is true.

But he sounds like he’s gloating. You women got what you deserved sort of attitude.

I think that reveals how he views women. Some resentment and anger there.

Goldenbear · 24/02/2023 13:18

C4ou56, that's about you as an individual though, my DH is pretty driven but he is extremely fussy about the look of stuff in the house, the positioning of furniture, he notices when the paintwork needs touching up, he hates stuff out on kitchen worktops, I do put that down to his Architectural eye for the way things look. I really don't notice as much, he has been away this week and in all honesty the place is a bit untidy not unclean but untidy. I don't really notice the paintwork the furniture, I'm obsessive about my work and detail which is needed to be good in my job but the wider picture is not there for me. I actually find housework overwhelming as I can never do things quickly, one job leads on to a much more detailed job like cleaning out a cupboard! I find it dull as well being overly fussed about homemaking (cringe).

Suzi888 · 24/02/2023 13:19

SandroSandra · 24/02/2023 10:11

I told him he sounded sexist.

He said "I'm not blaming women. I'm just saying that two people working full time with kids doesn't leave enough time to restore or redecorate or do much of anything really and there is a reason we used to have on person at home. Not about it being women. I'm just being logical"

He’s right. 🤷🏼‍♀️

You either use all your free time on the house or pay got get the work done.

Swipe left for the next trending thread