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AIBU?

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Original poster

Cyclists - Dan Walker

190 replies

lookluv · 22/02/2023 10:10

No high viz clothing
No lights
Cycling cross lane
Car driver in lane does not chnge direction
Lights on
Cyclist comes across his lane
Cyclist does not give enough clearance
Back wheel hits car.

True interpretation : Cyclist hits car NOT car hits cyclist

Driver of car plastered across media for doing nothing wrong

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
OntarioBagnet · 23/02/2023 18:00

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 23/02/2023 17:48

@OntarioBagnet

EH? That’s completely the opposite direction from the train station. He’s pedalling away from the city not towards it. If the station is at 12.00, he’sgoing in the absolute opposite direction at about 25 past.

Well it definitely said in the paper he was on his way to the station. If I was cycling from Ecclesall rd to the station I’d want to turn right at that roundabout and go down the side of st Mary’s gate? I’d go through the decathlon car park, down sylvester street and then brown street. I wouldn’t go straight on at that roundabout . That’s a better cycling route than going straight on, and it’s the way I always went to the station.

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 23/02/2023 18:06

He’s heading up Hanover Way towards the university. This is away from the station. Those flats at the side are the ones in Sharrow/ Broomhall near Washington Road.

Dymaxion · 23/02/2023 18:08

I followed a bloke on a bike the other night, very busy road, dark clothing and no lights on his bike, trees at the side of the road meaning he wasn't very visible at all. I hope he got home safely, I indicated to overtake and went really wide like you are supposed to, in the hope that it would warn drivers behind. I think they don't realise how invisible they are in this situation to other road users, your vision is nowhere near as good in a car in the dark or at dusk, as it is if you are outside the vehicle.
Saying all that the only time I witnessed a car hit a cyclist was during the first lockdown in broad daylight !

OntarioBagnet · 23/02/2023 18:09

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 23/02/2023 18:06

He’s heading up Hanover Way towards the university. This is away from the station. Those flats at the side are the ones in Sharrow/ Broomhall near Washington Road.

Ah got you now, I thought he was the other side! Guess he could have come from the town centre and have turned right? I always took the underpass so am not sure of which lane you’d be in if coming from the town centre.

lljkk · 23/02/2023 18:31

Are PP honestly saying now that it's a cyclist fault for using a roundabout, that means cyclists shouldn't be allowed to use busy RABs, and if they do it's the cyclists fault (morally if not legally) if some oblivious driver drives into the cyclist?

Funny how few people drive into tractors on busy RABs, really. It's almost like drivers give a lot more time, patience, space & respect to John Deeres than they do to vulnerable road users.

Saywhoo · 23/02/2023 19:02

Construction workers wear Hi Viz in the daytime, why? To make it them more visible to dangerous machinery etc therefore making themselves safer.
Same reason cyclists should wear hi viz even in the day, every driver can have a lapse of concentration its not only 'bad' drivers that cause accidents, cyclists need to make themselves as safe as possible therefore wear hi visibility clothing.

lljkk · 23/02/2023 19:30

tbh, considering the accident rate on construction sites, I'm not sure there's a lot to laud in that industry. Anyway, Construction workers are paid to be there and are onsite for 6-10 hours a day.

jcyclops · 23/02/2023 19:38

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 22/02/2023 16:31

I just wonder why DW was in the centre lane? I know that road, all lanes lead in the same direction, the lanes don’t lead off anywhere.

Seems to be some confusion about lanes and directions. The photo shows an aerial view. DW's path in yellow (broken to show his intended exit). Car's path in indigo (broken to show intended exit). Car ended up in the wrong lane and had to switch lanes late to make the exit. DW was in the correct lane throughout, car should have followed the red line and ended up behind DW.

Cyclists - Dan Walker
SinnerBoy · 23/02/2023 20:11

ivykaty44 · Yesterday 16:57

But then I saw the thread about the poster who got 6 points for being on her phone and the police van was behind her...

My awful SiL pulled up next to a marked Police car, chatting away on her phone. The points are off now and although she has a Bluetooth set now, she still thinks it was unfair, as the traffic was quite slow. The year before, she crashed into a stationary transit on a slip road, waiting to ease onto a motorway.

My niece (11 at the time) told me she was on the phone. She wrote her car and the van off, thank goodness for modern safety features. She was lucky that the Police didn't find out she was in mid conversation at the time of impact.

BogRollBOGOF · 23/02/2023 20:54

The car was in the wrong. DW was well placed and consistent in the lane that he was travelling in.

It is a possibility from the angle of DW being struck, that he was obscured by blindspots from the A frame of the car, particularly if the driver has switched their gaze from the road ahead/ signage/ mirrors. That doesn't remove responsibility from the driver though. It is also likely that the driver was distracted or inattentive.

Hi-viz is not some magical talisman of invincibility, but when running or cycling I always wear something bright that will stand out according to conditions. Anything that improves your odds of being spotted is a good thing, but is only useful if other road users are looking and attentive. I use sidelights when driving in daylight as even a tonne of metal can be awkward to spot in dull conditions, shadow or glare. Again, that doesn't exonerate motorists from their responsibility to look out for other road users.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 23/02/2023 21:13

It's completely a case of 'Sorry mate, I didn't see you there'.

As somebody who is well aware of the fundamental laws of physics/soft fluffy cloud of invisibility that seems to obscure you even if lit up like an 80s Christmas Tree on acid (and as such, gave up the motorbikes after the 2nd time the lid literally saved my life), I do think that having the moral and/or legal high ground is of no consolation when the paramedics are scraping you off the tarmac - and as such, he didn't help the situation by being dressed in dark clothes and wavering across the lane from the blind spot when some drivers have limited awareness and fuck all peripheral vision.

Fundamentally, though, it is the driver's fault. The driver should have looked behind as well as to the front before changing lanes.

BankOfDave · 23/02/2023 21:24

Stupid thread. But well done OP on getting a little attention, you got to page 7 👏

Augend23 · 23/02/2023 21:52

I am a regular cyclist (for transport).

I have a helmet with a light and a fluorescent back. I have lights on my bike, day and night. I have reflective wheel edges, as well as the usual pedal reflectors. I have reflectors on my panniers.

About 70% of the time I wear a hive vis jacket or a bright-ish burgundy coat or brightly coloured clothing in summer. The rest of the time I wear a navy or olive Barbour or dark summer clothing. I find there is no discernable difference in the number of near misses I have as a cyclist. Maybe I should start recording a dataset to see if there is, but not a noticeable one.

OntarioBagnet · 23/02/2023 22:22

jcyclops · 23/02/2023 19:38

Seems to be some confusion about lanes and directions. The photo shows an aerial view. DW's path in yellow (broken to show his intended exit). Car's path in indigo (broken to show intended exit). Car ended up in the wrong lane and had to switch lanes late to make the exit. DW was in the correct lane throughout, car should have followed the red line and ended up behind DW.

Show quote history

So he was heading from Ecclesall rd to the train station

SnackSizeRaisin · 23/02/2023 22:33

Saywhoo · 23/02/2023 19:02

Construction workers wear Hi Viz in the daytime, why? To make it them more visible to dangerous machinery etc therefore making themselves safer.
Same reason cyclists should wear hi viz even in the day, every driver can have a lapse of concentration its not only 'bad' drivers that cause accidents, cyclists need to make themselves as safe as possible therefore wear hi visibility clothing.

The fact is it makes no difference what you wear. Drivers who are looking at the road and driving according to the law see you anyway. Drivers who are using phones or otherwise distracted, don't.

I know this from years and years of urban cycling. Including in the dark, with and without lights, wearing various amounts of high viz. It only really makes any difference on roads with no streetlights after dark.

Of course people may tut and say "I almost didn't see him" or "he was difficult to see in the dark" which just proves that actually they did see the cyclist. If people said "I've never seen a cyclist without lights at night", that would prove that they are, in fact, invisible.

Skodacool · 27/02/2023 06:56

Spacemountain · 22/02/2023 10:29

We must have watched different footage. The car changed lanes and hit him from behind. He is not at fault, the car is at fault for moving into a lane that was not free.

It looks 50/50 to me. Cyclist drifted across the front of the car.

Skodacool · 27/02/2023 07:03

Dis626 · 23/02/2023 12:50

The driver was completely at fault! He changed lanes and hit him.

No he wasn’t, DW drifted across the front of the car.

ILiveAt64ZooLane · 27/02/2023 07:52

Dan Walker is the victim here completely. Rather than being glad to be alive he should be furious that he was nearly killed. If the driver concerned couldn’t see a 6’6” man on a bike then they weren’t looking. A lapse of concentration is bad driving and as an average of 2 cyclists die per week hi viz isn’t the problem, the driver not looking is the problem. Hi viz won’t protect you from the impact of a car the same way that if you get T boned by a car when you’re on a bike your helmet is not protecting your internal organs. I say this as someone who has worked with collision investigators for over ten years.

ILiveAt64ZooLane · 27/02/2023 07:59

Skodacool · 27/02/2023 07:03

No he wasn’t, DW drifted across the front of the car.

Show quote history

The point you’re missing was that he was in lane, in front of the car. He could have been weaving left to right and back again in the lane for all I care the driver should have seen him in front and slowed behind them accordingly.

SinnerBoy · 27/02/2023 08:20

Skodacool · Today 06:56

It looks 50/50 to me. Cyclist drifted across the front of the car.

It really wasn't like that. The car changed lanes and hit his back wheel, as Walker stayed in his own lane.

God help anyone if you're ever on a jury.

gettingolderbutcooler · 27/02/2023 08:25

Clearly car drivers fault.

SkiingIsHeaven · 27/02/2023 08:37

Ultimately it is the car driver's fault but realistically it is very difficult to see the cyclist in all that black clothing.

SinnerBoy · 27/02/2023 08:41

No more difficult than seeing the dark coloured cars. He's completely visible.

Xol · 27/02/2023 08:54

Skodacool · 27/02/2023 07:03

No he wasn’t, DW drifted across the front of the car.

Show quote history

Can you really not see the car changing lanes in that footage? Whilst DW stays in his own lane?

Xol · 27/02/2023 08:56

SkiingIsHeaven · 27/02/2023 08:37

Ultimately it is the car driver's fault but realistically it is very difficult to see the cyclist in all that black clothing.

How can it be difficult to see someone in black on a bike in daylight?