To think dp is too harsh on 2yr old?

[Whoissit]

Please help me settle the never ending debate, sleep.

I'm perfectly fine with being told I'm the one being unreasonable but I really don't think I am.

Dp has become increasingly frustrated with dc, who is 2yrs 3months, not being able to fall asleep on his own. I keep telling him he has unrealistic expectations that aren't fair to put on dc given his age. That I remember my parents sitting with me reading a book, singing, or rubbing my head until I fell asleep in primary school. I'm getting annoyed at the constant arguments we are having about it because dp thinks dc should be able to lie down at night and just go to sleep on his own. I don't think it's unnatural for him to need soothing/comforting at night.

Once dc is asleep he may way once or twice, most the time he sleeps the whole night through.

Dp thinks I'm being too soft on him and wants to let him cry it out. I generally don't believe in doing that unless it's crucial, example being we are sleep deprived or he is. I think it's drastic measures and causes unnecessary stress to dc.

So who is being unreasonable here? It's our first child. Maybe 2 year olds all do just go to sleep on their own without a problem and I'm pandering....

i can completely understand you not wanting to leave him to cry it out, have you tried something like a Tonie box? They do bedtime stories and white noise etc that don’t have any screens so can be really good for situations like yours? Also it could be challenging but maybe he’s getting ready to reduce his nap? We dropped the nap and moved bedtime forward with a very fixed routine (CBeebies bedtime hour, bed time episode of Blue Clues and then bed) and our 2 and a half year old really took to it!

Unless you are being abusive your parenting is your business - I don't know if I would have your amount of patience. That said I was lucky in that mine went down easily.

interesting post, didn’t realise so many parents choose to sit with children after bed time.

we don’t for all the reasons outlined by others, but I found it interesting all the reasons and I’m sure some of the older children will remember all that time and care when their teenagers and beyond.

You think parents “don’t want to spend time with their children” because they dont want to spend an hour and a half ‘putting them to bed’?

There are so many better opportunities to spend time together during the day

OP YANBU in wanting to avoid cry-it-out methods but equally I do have sympathy for your DP. I have three DC and it would have driven me absolutely nuts to have to lie with them for hours on end at bedtime. Much as I love and adore them all. Story time and cuddle time was a nightly routine in our house and we still have nightly hugs and chats even though most of mine are teens now - but settling themselves to sleep was the norm right from the early days.

It's not unrealistic to want a toddler to be able to self-settle. But you can gently teach them how to do it, not leave them to scream. There are so many gentle sleep training methods - they require patience and consistency but they will work if you are persistent. We found a regular routine, stories, white noise, lullaby lights etc all worked really well. I would also try dropping the daytime nap if a toddler is taking ages to fall asleep - lots of DC need to drop a nap somewhere between 2 and 2.5.

Sleep threads always tend to bring out a few extremist 'you can ONLY raise secure children if you cuddle them to sleep every night and if you don't cuddle them to sleep every night THEN THEY WILL NOT KNOW THEY ARE LOVED AND YOU WILL HAVE FAILED AT PARENTING' posters. But you know what, it is absolutely possible enjoy spending time with your children, and to raise happy, confident, secure individuals who know that they are loved, WITHOUT needing to cuddle them to sleep every night.

Equally, of course, if you enjoy lying with your DC and cuddling them to sleep every night then that is absolutely fine. But your DP is not wrong to find it frustrating, either. It's not selfish to want free time in the evenings - it's healthy. There has got to be a balance between reassuring your toddler and having time to yourself. Martyrdom doesn't help anyone, least of all your child.

CIO isn't actually a method at all, controlled crying is leaving for a few minutes then going back in to settle them. Who leaves a child crying for hours? That sounds like something people have made up when someone has called controlled crying CIO to be honest.

I haven't seen any posts suggesting this at all though. There's a massive difference between laying with a child for 1.5 hrs or letting them cry for hours, both to me are crazy. Do you think someone who doesn't lay with their child till they are asleep doesn't make their child feel loved and secure? A child who feels loved and secure to me is one who knows a parent is there if they need them but also feels secure enough to go to sleep without someone laying with them the whole time.

In real life this is normal IMO. I really don't know many people who sat for hours with their kids, the only one i can remember had kids who didnt sleep well as couldn't settle themselves if they stirred in the night and then were up at 5am as they couldn't lay in their beds alone at all, she was permanently exhausted. Self soothing/settling is a skill all children need IMO.

I still lie down with my 3 and 4 year old whilst they fall asleep. I like spending that time with them at the end of a busy day and enjoy been close to them. I know one day they won’t need me so I like to make the most of it whilst I can. I know some people would say I’m mad but I don’t care. Do what’s best for you and your child.

As an afterthought if it is taking an hour and a half for him to fall asleep maybe he isn’t tired. Maybe try adjusting bedtimes to see if that shortens the amount of time it is taking.

My daughter is 18 months and I do a bed time routine… give a bath, read a book, say good night and leave her to fall asleep. My partner has another child and they used to read MULTIPLE books a night to her and lay with her until she went to sleep. Our whole evening was taken up from it. She was 3 at the time before I said he needs to make it quicker. Took 2 nights to get her to go to sleep on her own after with 2 books and we had our evenings!
I know someone who has a child who is 8 and he HAS to have someone laying there until he’s asleep. Makes it a complete nightmare for babysitters and family members.
I feel like your husband has a point. He would want to be spending the evening with you

I don't think people should be saying whether you're mad at all, no their business, it would worry me that some people on the thread have said only they will do, not DH, so they would be so reliant on one person to lay with them and get them to sleep that if that person had to go into hospital what would they do.

Whatever people want to do is fine but it always feels on these threads that unless mums martyr themselves and give every waking moment to their child that they can't be close to them or make the child feel loved and secure, or are selfish for wanting some adult time in the evenings. Not suggesting you are saying that but earlier posters definitely are.

I think this is one of those topics where people are really divided. Each to their own is what I say. as long as your child is happy and healthy nothing else really matters ☺️

What we are starting to do (well actually just me, because like I said DH is softer) is doing the usual story, song and then sitting with her until she’s fairly settled but if she’s not completely asleep by then I’ll say ‘mummy just needs a wee/ to brush her teeth/ to put this washing away - you try to sleep and I’ll come back and check on you in a few minutes

This is really good advice, and basically what worked for us. We also have a night light he likes, and use a Tonie box (I also listen to podcasts to sleep, so perfectly reasonable DS might want to).

DS still tries to drag out bedtime as late as possible (his favourite tactic is “interesting questions” just when the light is about to be switched off - “Mummy why is it dark here when it is light in Australia” etc, which I then fall into the trap of answering). But he is usually asleep within ten minutes of the light being turned off.

Exactly, I feel the same. I definitely don't practice all the things I believed in for young children with my dog though, he is totally spoiled, if he needed my to stroke him to sleep for 1.5hrs I'm fairly sure i would 😂

My kids dad was like this - just couldn’t be arsed to read to them and did the absolute minimum. (Ex)

Same here. There’s no way I’d be sat with my DS for 1.5 hours every night. We do a 5 min story then kiss/cuddle and I leave. I think if it’s taking that long he may need to stop napping during the day.

I have a 3 year old and an 19 month old. We do bath, story and bed. They get a kiss and a cuddle and then I leave the room. No way would I routinely sit for up to an hour and a half patting them. I need the evening to decompress and have some adult time.

I obviously wouldn't leave a child crying for hours but I don't think your DP is in the wrong here. There's a middle ground. And just because the routine works for you and you don't mind doesn't mean he's wrong. He's a parent too, he should also be doing the bedtime routine (alternating nights or whatever).

@Forgooodnesssakenow Don’t try to gaslight people, it makes you look sad and insecure! It’s ok if your kids don’t self soothe and you are happy to mess about in an evening for as long as it takes (glad it works for you!) but that certainly isn’t ‘spending time with your children’ and you bloody well know it! It’s completely reasonable and healthy that people don’t wish to go down that route!

I help our 6 year old DS to go to sleep in his bed every night. My husband thinks he should go to sleep alone but I'm not willing to do that. At 2 years my DP wouldn't have even suggested it!

It's weird to me people don't want to spend time with their children,

Don't be ridiculous. You are just making stuff up here. No-one on this thread has said they "don't want to spend time with their dc".

However, loosing an hour and a half every night sitting on your own in a dark room whilst teaching your child that it somehow isn't okay for them to drift off to sleep on their own, after a lovely bedtime routine involving bath, stories and a chat, is not benefiting anyone. Including the child.

I get into bed with my 9yo and cuddle her to sleep if she asks me to (which she hardly ever does btw!) I was chatting with other P4 Mums recently and it turned out this wasn't that unusual. Also quite a few 9 yos still wandering through for a cuddle in the night (mine doesn't, despite cosleeping til she was 5). I think it's all more common than people think.

That's quite different from it being an every night routine though, I imagine that would be extremely unusual for 9 yos.

I’m not going to claim lying in the darkness for an hour patting your child to sleep is “quality time” (though I personally used to take the opportunity for a lie-down myself).

But there are many parents (DH for one) who also try to dodge or rush through the bath/stories/cuddles part too - I do think it is a bit sad if people don’t value that part of bedtime, I personally think it is lovely.

@QforCucumber

we’ve found it’s the time of day where ds1 opens up about his day at school and things which have happened and asks questions.

we sleep trained our now 3.5 year old very early and so he knows the drill. Bath bed story or two and lights out. But after story (maybe partly because he wants to string it out a bit) he always wants to talk to me about his day. Just commenting that we have a similar experience that it’s that time of day he opens up. Just before sleep. I like taking that opportunity to chat with him for 5/10 minutes because he sure as hell doesn’t tell me what he did at nursery when I ask straight out earlier in the evening!

I think they are saying only you do it because mum wants to continue and dad wants to move on so effectively do it if you want but don't force dad....isn't that more fair than either being forced to do what they don't want?