To be horrified by these ‘baby boxes’?

[TheObstinateHeadstrongGirl]

This just came up on my newsfeed and I’m absolutely horrified by the whole concept of women abandoning their newborns in the US:

www.newschannel10.com/2023/02/10/newborn-surrendered-baby-box-installed-less-than-3-months-ago/?fbclid=IwAR1qz7BbrIeF390b6YXl4mAscw82cTvt-Bzwnp_LMaZMMCjBcpltEZGHav0#ldzrvrvoa7ecauugx04

Im NOT having a go at these women, and this is supposedly to prevent newborns being abandoned in unsafe places.

But surely the answer isn’t “Hey brand new mum with raging hormones, probably depression, who is tired, stressed and not thinking straight - put your baby here for a nice new family” - it should be about supporting mums with PND, improving practical support, healthcare and rights of new mothers and reproductive rights. Not just “Oh well you don’t feel OK today so probably best you don’t be a mum, here’s a little box to pop your baby in”.

My spidey senses were tingling so when I did a bit of further research, the woman who started these is, of course, fiercely anti abortion. So that’s what it’s all about. it’s about not allowing women their reproductive rights but making them go through a birth they don’t want, have the trauma of having a baby they don’t want but it’s OK, and the heartache of giving them away - no harm done ey 😡

women fought to have abortions yet there are still children brought up in toxic situations breeding more gen Z kids.

I've checked the stats on abandoned babies in the U.K. again and I can't find an accurate number.

ONS records those in England who's birth was subsequently registered ie, those that survived. Other stats show those that were abandoned and then adopted, ie those that were not subsequently reunited with their mothers, and a third figure, those that were believed to be abandoned at full term.
I can find numbers between 15 and 500 per year.

Anyone have a more accurate number?

The UK government doesn't keep stats on newborns, whom it lumps in with babies under age 1 for statistical purposes relating to abandonment.

It's hard to gauge the extent of the problem.

From a quick check on ONS it seems like it is exceedingly rare in the UK.

This is for England and Wales, see below.

Averaging about 1 baby per year.

I'd be interested in seeing some statistics in the places these Safe Haven boxes have been introduced, to see if child abandonment increased overall or stayed the same.

As OP has pointed out, the head of the baby box org goes round lecturing teenagers about abstinence and the evils of sex outside marriage. Thus increasing the risk that any of these girls who finds herself pregnant will feel so ashamed that she might consider abandoning the child anonymously in a baby box rather than accessing healthcare.

These boxes just seem designed to perpetuate the stigmatisation of unmarried mothers.

I suspect the boxes aren’t used enough to do any statistical analyses on their effect. I think it’s more a case of if they save just a few lives, then they are worth it.

To offer support Mums have to be identified. At least with a baby box the child has a chance of life.

Locally to where I live in the U.K. a full term newborn was found dead in the bushes near a golf course. Surely a safe haven box would be a better alternative?

I think you are reading too much into the provision of the ‘baby boxes’.
They are there as a last resort for those who will have genuinely tried their hardest, persevered & come to the realisation that they are not able to parent due to extenuating circumstances.
They are not an anti-abortion device at all & any parent struggling can contact the places where the baby boxes are located to ask for help & support.

They have been around for some time in my home country and other countries around the world I imagine. There isnt a huge amout of babies put in there. It doesnt make any mother to give up her baby, its for the mothers who are so desperate that they would abandon the baby anyway but somewhere not safe.

It’s such a desperate situation.

It makes me think of an SNL sketch around the time of the reversal of Roe v Wade. I couldn’t comprehend that the case for withdrawing family planning services in the US was that it’s better to force a woman to continue with an unwanted pregnancy (no matter the circumstances).

This is the sketch. m.youtube.com/watch?v=D3pF5FhOmKU

They aren’t making fun of women or babies who are in this situation, they’re pointing out the ridiculousness of this attitude that women should just ‘do their nine’ and leave the baby somewhere to be collected for adoption. It beggars belief.

No doubt the woman (or girl) was doing what she thinks is best for the baby without many other choices.

I don't think the woman who invented these boxes forced anyone to have babies instead of abortions, and they aren't aimed at only parents who were anti abortion or forced to have babies. I've only read one story about a box that was used for the first time, and the infant was collected within minutes of being deposited. Personally I think anything that saves a life, is perhaps one of the better things we have. Without the box who knows what extreme a parent could have gone to in desperation. We don't know the circumstances, could be drugs, extreme poverty, homelessness, anything... but a baby is safe and will be looked after which is the main thing right?

YANBU in that women in a Western country should not feel the need to give up their baby in this way. They should have easy access to healthcare, benefits, contraception and abortion. But US women don't, especially poor ones, and therefore this is making the best of a bad situation.

It's a bit like foodbank paradox in this country. They shouldn't exist but it's good that they do.

Can't believe people think you're being unreasonable, OP! I agree completely. The USA has made unbelievable laws against women in many states. Surely everyone already knows that leaving a baby at a church, hospital, council building etc means they'll get found? But of course, none of that means they'll be safe....

Abortion is controversial, especially in the states where religious peer pressure still holds a lot of influence.
The more that a woman's right to choose is taken away, the more that these baby boxes will be used.

This is another “choice”, just a safer one for the baby.

Thousands of babies have been left in safe haven boxes over the years even before Roe vs Wade was overturned.
The reason we don't have them in the UK is that there are numerous safety nets, charities and networks for mothers or pregnant women who are struggling. We have the NHS and a benefits system. . . although not for much longer if the Tories continue the way they're going.

The priority is the baby being safe, not supporting a mother who has made a (good) choice to leave it there.

These boxes are for babies at risk of abandonment and serious harm, not your average mother who is a bit depressed post partum

If someone pro-abortion had started the baby boxes, would you be ok with it OP? Because when you start calling people 'loons' simply because they are involved in a system that has saved thousands of babies over the years, you seem overly partisan and not really concerned about women and babies.

I think some posters are not fully getting that some women will not be able to keep the baby rven if you have long maternity, support, benefits etc. Whether it is because they don't want to or different reason doesn't matter. Baby boxes are in countries with all than named in place as well.

Uk seems to not want them? Well the officials. I am sure the mother of the mentioned baby would have welcomed it (old article though but it talks about concerns about them in here)
www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-22123366.amp

Some places changed abandonment laws to exclude leaving baby in these hatches. I think they are in like 25 countries and not all have issues with unwed mothers or no benefits.

Obstinate - the babies won’t ultimately be okay! How would you feel if you had been put in a box as a newborn and didn’t know who your biological parents were? For some people this is a lifelong tragedy, like a piece of a jigsaw that is missing and they search for years to find out who their parents were. Years ago in the UK adoption was done via the church and all birth histories were destroyed before a baby was adopted. I knew somebody who had been adopted via that process and all of her life she constantly searched and wondered about her ancestry, any health issues she might have inherited, and why she was given away. How sad it must be to live with that.

It’s very important for an adopted baby to know it’s birth history and if that’s an option with the boxes then they aren’t such a bad idea. But I’m pro abortion anyway and this is just another element of the American Christian Far Right.

They've had these in Japan for a time now to deal with these issues and it's worked well.

OP I think you have more of a point than the first few posters allowed. These boxes give moral cover for prohibitions on abortion since 'well if a woman doesn't want her baby she can just leave them in the box.'

Completely discounting the hardship of pregnancy, birth and of giving up a baby.

They get strikingly little use in most places, AFAIK. Suggesting they're no solution to anything.

You are being so unreasonable!!! I can’t imagine for a second what goes through someone’s mind and heart when they’re in that dilemma but to know they have a choice to leave their child somewhere that they know it will be looked after is surely a good thing.

Yes, I'm horrified about several facets of this idea. TG I've never been in a situation where I've been 'driven' (if that's the word) to make that kind of choice.
Moral, ethical, religious reasons and pressure from family, all play a part and it must be dreadful to have to make or FEEL you have to make challenging decisions when your mind is in turmoil, hormones raging.
I feel heartily sorry for any woman in that position as either way, it will change your life.