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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Who is AIBU me or DH in regards to DD punching girl in her year.

287 replies

Pointlessworrying · 03/02/2023 20:20

Our 14 year old DD is a wonderful, intelligent and happy girl, she is in Y9 at an independent all girls school and has a lovely bunch of friends.

She does however have quite a short fuse and like most teenage girls can be at times be quite grumpy, she also takes no prisoners and is quite good at putting up heathy barriers when it comes to her peers.

I would say she has a good sense of worth which we obviously encourage and the following is an isolated incident.

I caught the tale end of her telling her DS at the dinner table that a girl in her year had slapped her, the 1st time she had turned round she thought it must have been an accident, the 2nd she had asked her to stop the 3 time she actually caught her head and DD had turned round and punched her in the Jaw.

The girl was initially quite shocked and then had ran off an told a teacher supported by her friends. DD was asked by the teacher to have a chat she had explained the situation, teacher was really kind about it and just spoke to to DD about managing feelings and to come and talk to her in future.

However what has came out in this is this DH has fully supported DD in her actions, told her she was absolutely in the right and to do the same thing again.

Talking it over tonight he said that DD has the right the defend herself and couldn’t be punished for doing so, he also said that if she hadn’t retaliated in the way she did in found of a group of mean girls she would have opened herself up to bullying…

I however feel that DD has enough about her to do this without using her hands and worry that if this became more than a one off incident the repercussion it would have for her.

Mostly it’s highlighted that DH and I are obviously on quite different pages to how our DC should act in this kind of situation and wondered what people thought.

OP posts:
Offensiveapprently · 04/02/2023 15:26

I got to 15 before I hit anyone. He pulled my hair so hard banging my head against the bannisterat school. I turned round and smacked his head off the walll. He never did it again and I've never hit anyone since. She was right to lamp the other girl, it doesn't mean she will become like Tyson Fury.

anya21 · 04/02/2023 15:34

Onnabugeisha · 04/02/2023 15:20

Yep. Slaps can kill too. I know three open hand “slaps” that can kill with one blow.

It’s not whether you are hitting open hand(slap) or closed fist (punch) but how hard you hit and where you hit that matters. Men most often kill with a single punch, and women do a dainty slaps to a cheek and so there’s this cultural association with punches being more dangerous than slaps.

Show quote history

quite possibly the stupidest comment of the week.
look at all the martial arts known for their slapping techniques!

anya21 · 04/02/2023 15:36

what if the other girl had punched her back twice as hard?

lobeliasb · 04/02/2023 15:37

To those saying one punch can kill etc - usually, the deaths are caused by a brain injury from falling and cracking their heads on the concrete ground after being hit by a grown man - It's not from the actual blow itself, and again, how likely it it that a quick jab from a 14 year old girl is going to be devastating?

SinnerBoy · 04/02/2023 15:38

anya21 · Today 15:36

what if the other girl had punched her back twice as hard?

What if the moon were green cheese? She didn't and the correct and desired effect was the result of her defending herself against the cowardly, whining bully, who started the incident.

Onnabugeisha · 04/02/2023 15:45

anya21 · 04/02/2023 15:34

quite possibly the stupidest comment of the week.
look at all the martial arts known for their slapping techniques!

Show quote history

You haven’t a clue what you are talking about. I’d be happy to demonstrate these techniques on you (with control so not harming you), but yes, I know three open hand slaps that can kill. One of them does involve the assistance of gravity.

Onnabugeisha · 04/02/2023 15:47

lobeliasb · 04/02/2023 15:37

To those saying one punch can kill etc - usually, the deaths are caused by a brain injury from falling and cracking their heads on the concrete ground after being hit by a grown man - It's not from the actual blow itself, and again, how likely it it that a quick jab from a 14 year old girl is going to be devastating?

Exactly right, except doesn’t need to be a grown man to make this happen. In fact a smaller, shorter opponent can use gravity to do this a lot easier than a big, tall opponent.

Branleuse · 04/02/2023 15:54

Im with your dh. I think id explain to your dd that obviously its important to keep your cool and not resort to physical violence, but in the circumstances I dont blame her at all, and hopefully that girl will back off now

Truckinghell · 04/02/2023 15:56

Onnabugeisha · 04/02/2023 15:45

You haven’t a clue what you are talking about. I’d be happy to demonstrate these techniques on you (with control so not harming you), but yes, I know three open hand slaps that can kill. One of them does involve the assistance of gravity.

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Stoppppp 🤣🤣🤣

Who is AIBU me or DH in regards to DD punching girl in her year.
TheLadyofShalott1 · 04/02/2023 23:51

Genegenieee · 04/02/2023 11:09

Have you not sent your kids on self defence courses?

If you had you wouldn't be asking this question.

A punch in the head would not be a proportionate response (and therefore would like fail reasonableness test for self defence) if you retaliated in response to a few slaps. You should ensure your child understands that a punch to the head can kill, and if it did or caused serious harm, it is very hard to establish that the defendant met the reasonableness test for self defence if charged with murder/ gbh.

So, if potentially fighting for your life, arguably reasonable. A few slaps v unlikely to meet the threshold (based on case law)

To defend yourself if slapped, consider defusing situation, deflecting blows, perhaps punching the attackers arm to prevent them doing it. Which was an example given above by a parent whose kid had had martial art training.

Stop telling your kids they can punch someone in the head and it will all be ok. They could end up I serious shit.

Get them on a self defence course. Both my DDs can get a man on the ground in seconds - they have been taught to do more if fighting for their life, under serious attack.

But for fuck sake anyone on here saying punching in the head is a good thing for kids to learn to do - give your heads a fucking wobble before your kid punches someone in the head and wobbles that persons brain around their skull.

Inform yourselves and your kids on how to protect yourself legitimately and safely.

If you insist on suggesting that a punch in the head is a good step, at least try to read up on the defence of self defence where used in response to force and violence. The lead cases on self defence will open your eyes to the reality of what you are recommending.

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@Genegenieee Where and when did I suggest that anyone should punch anyone in the head?

In fact I suggested boxing as a form of self-defence, unless it is not a legal requirement to always where a helmet. This is because I know how dangerous hits to someones, anyone's, head can be.

Just for your interest, when one of my son's was a teenager (all my children are now adults), a lad from his school punched him in the face as he was just walking pass him in the street near our home, I called the police, the policeman came out - they used to in those days - and after speaking to the thug (he was later given one of the first ASBO's, but for something else), the policeman spoke to me and my son, and told my son in front of me, that he should have thumped him back on the chin. I remonstrated with the policeman about that, asking him what would happen to my son if he did that and the other one fell and hit his head on the curb, the policeman said it would be ok because it would be in self-defence! I just shook my head, and left it there, but after he left I told my son that he shouldn't hit him in the head, because whatever that policeman had said, if there were no witnesses, he could be prosecuted for murder.

One last thing @Genegenieee you go on at me about self-defence classes, which is what most of my post was about, suggesting to the OP that her DC went to self-defence classes. Are you sure it was my post that you wanted to have a rant at? Hitting anyone in the head is the last thing that I would ever recommend...

ItsNotReallyChaos · 04/02/2023 23:54

I'd be proud of her for sticking up for herself.

Having suffered at the hands of other school kids i wish I'd had the strength and courage to deliver a short sharp punch.

LimeTwists · 04/02/2023 23:56

Three slaps from a vile little brat of a child means that particular child needs to learn a lesson. One that involves a hard dose of it, right back. Well done to your daughter. She won’t get slapped again.

Teaandtoast3 · 05/02/2023 00:12

I’m sorry I’m with your DH on this one

CalmBeforeStorm01 · 05/02/2023 00:20

I brought my kids up to hit back, but harder, if anyone seriously hit them. None of this pc parenting bollocks so I'm with your DH.

Justforthissnippet · 05/02/2023 00:56

You haven’t a clue what you are talking about. I’d be happy to demonstrate these techniques on you (with control so not harming you), but yes, I know three open hand slaps that can kill. One of them does involve the assistance of gravity

But let’s face it, most people won’t know how to or be using those if they dish out a slap!

MavisMcMinty · 05/02/2023 01:09

Self-defence, your daughter didn’t start it. Not the best way to solve every future disagreement, but OK on this occasion.

mathanxiety · 05/02/2023 01:54

Agree with your DH here.

I doubt your DD will have any more trouble from the girl who started it.

There are double standards when it comes to how girls are expected to respond to extreme provocation. Well done to your H for casting that nonsense aside.

Nat6999 · 05/02/2023 02:06

If your dd had battered the other girl she would have been in the wrong, but she punched her once to stop her slapping her, it was self defence.

blubberball · 05/02/2023 03:30

Might be good for her to go to a self defence class to learn proper techniques, but good for her for not taking any shit.

PaperFun · 05/02/2023 04:17

I used to think like you OP. My kids left school without hitting anyone or being hit. I abhor violence and would be so shocked if they punched someone.

But I have since realised it’s partly due to luck. That they have not met anyone rough enough to punch or hit others. My kids have not been bullied and have not bullied. So it’s a privileged position. I have read enough threads to see that schools are often powerless and the only way to treat a bully is apparently to fight back. I was told that despising violence is a ‘class’ thing and I needed to get in the ‘real
world’.

So perhaps your daughter did the right thing. Though maybe a slap back rather than a punch would be the right thing in the first instance?

I would be horrified if a seven year old swore. But again that might be a ‘class’ thing too.

Poor kids dealing with this physical violence in their lives.

Reclaimtheoutdoors · 05/02/2023 05:19

Hellsmovie · 04/02/2023 13:23

I dont agree with the last bit about being prosecuted for assault.

I've seen police watch back cctv of a male shouting and swearing at another male . Then the male who was being shouted at punched the other male . The police just said looks like self defence to me.

I've also seen a security officer punch a male for pushing him . Then the police arrested the male that pushed the security officer .

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yeah I was assaulted at a bus station and I fought back and got the better of the woman. The cctv went to CPS and the woman was charged and I wasn’t. It’s about proportionate responses. Eg. If someone pushes and you take a hammer to their head that is obviously assault but if you push them back it’s considered reasonable self defence. But it is a fine line and I think if I’d went too hard on the woman I’d have been charged also.

Hellsmovie · 05/02/2023 09:46

Reclaimtheoutdoors · 05/02/2023 05:19

yeah I was assaulted at a bus station and I fought back and got the better of the woman. The cctv went to CPS and the woman was charged and I wasn’t. It’s about proportionate responses. Eg. If someone pushes and you take a hammer to their head that is obviously assault but if you push them back it’s considered reasonable self defence. But it is a fine line and I think if I’d went too hard on the woman I’d have been charged also.

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" I felt scared ,I felt intimidated, i felt fearfull they were going to hurt me , i used what I felt to be reasonable and necessary force at the time "

Is a great phrase when dealing with the police in these situations.

Obviously you dont beat the shit out of someone in self defense.

BlackeyedSusan · 05/02/2023 09:57

Yeah, I'd be worried about one punch can kill and the consequence for dd. It can go horribly wrong. Also getting in big shit from school because they don't always take all circumstances into account.

OldFan · 05/02/2023 14:49

My son wasn't prepared to take the risk of a knife being pulled on him so punched the other boy hard enough to drop him on the floor then immediately went to the nearest staff member.

Myself and DH absolutely stand by our son punching the other boy;it was certainly better than getting a visit from the police to tell us our son had been stabbed

To be fair @Duckingella , if the boy had genuinely had a knife, this move would just've got your kid stabbed immediately.

A punch can never beat a knife. So he really shouldn't do this if he thinks someone has a knife- it's exactly what you shouldn't do.

DonnaBanana · 06/02/2023 10:08

@OldFan Depend if the knife is out, in hand, or not. If it’s still in someone’s pocket, it’s a heck of a lot quicker to knock someone with a punch than it is for them to get their knife out.

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