Page 7 | Breast feeding in baby change room

CreativeCreature · 2023-01-28T20:41:21+00:00

Today, our local supermarket has one baby change room. DD desperately needed changing before it became a whole outfit change. Lady was in there 45mins breast feeding, I had to use disabled toilet & change DD. AIBU to think she was selfish? I knocked on more to check she was okay, she came to the door shouting she’d only just started feeding her baby & slammed the door. She was then in there for another 30 mins. So a total of 45 mins.

mummyh2016 · 29/01/2023 14:18

fitzwilliamdarcy · 29/01/2023 14:01

But you can’t blame parents for using the assigned facilities for what they are assigned for.

No, I absolutely can and I do. Not as much as I blame the stores for making parents think they can override the legal entitlements won by disabled people, but I absolutely judge the parents who are going along with it.

Okay so what are you doing about it? Other than judging other people I mean. Please share the information about your campaigning to move baby changing facilities from disabled toilets.

Emmamoo89 · 29/01/2023 14:24

fitzwilliamdarcy · 29/01/2023 11:36

@Emmamoo89 And you’ve since complained to the store/business, right? You’ve started a campaign because you realise that it’s not ok to just use facilities that aren’t for you? You’ve recognised that the way to get the facilities you need is campaigning, (like disabled people did for decades, only to find that now they have them they’re back to square one because mums keep nicking them)? Right?

Well then the baby changing table shouldn't be in there then. The other toilets didn't have one. So did yog expect me to leave my son in a shitty nappy then?

Emmamoo89 · 29/01/2023 14:25

And no I didn't complain. I was in and out in less than 5 mins

Emmamoo89 · 29/01/2023 14:28

And tbf the other toilet would be too small for a changing table. No room. And I don't see an issue.

Emmamoo89 · 29/01/2023 14:35

fitzwilliamdarcy · 29/01/2023 11:36

@Emmamoo89 And you’ve since complained to the store/business, right? You’ve started a campaign because you realise that it’s not ok to just use facilities that aren’t for you? You’ve recognised that the way to get the facilities you need is campaigning, (like disabled people did for decades, only to find that now they have them they’re back to square one because mums keep nicking them)? Right?

It's a dual purpose room. And do you not expect disabled people to have babies?

SouthCountryGirl · 29/01/2023 14:38

Emmamoo89 · 29/01/2023 14:24

Well then the baby changing table shouldn't be in there then. The other toilets didn't have one. So did yog expect me to leave my son in a shitty nappy then?

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Do disabled people not have babies?

Emmamoo89 · 29/01/2023 14:41

SouthCountryGirl · 29/01/2023 14:38

Do disabled people not have babies?

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I know they do. My mind was blank as I have just woke up. Look at my comment further down

Scottishskifun · 29/01/2023 14:46

fitzwilliamdarcy · 29/01/2023 12:08

@Scottishskifun It doesn’t need to say that they have to be provided for that sole use because that’s inherent in the concept of being provided. If you provide a disabled toilet but then say “oh it can also be used by a mum if she wants to spend an hour in there changing her baby and reading a book”, then you’re no longer providing a disabled toilet. You’re providing a toilet that can be used by disabled people as long as there’s not a mum in there. That’s not what the Eq Act sets out.

I don’t know why so many shops do this (I suspect it’s not made clear in planning applications that they intend to discharge their obligation to provide disabled access by providing a multi-purpose space). But I really hope that one of them gets sued. It’s the only way that these facilities are going to be left for the people who they’re for and not used as conveniences by everyone else.

That's not how legislation works!

I suggest given you seem to blame parents for doing as is provided that you campaign for a change in the legislation rather then attacking parents.

sanabria · 29/01/2023 14:54

Sometimes I feel like I am expected to use the baby feeding room if there is one available rather than feed in public.

I was once feeding my baby at a cafe and the waitress came up to me and asked if I was comfortable feeding there and to let me know there was a parent room with chairs for breastfeeding etc. I thanked her for letting me know but assured her I was happy where I was.

Only after did it dawn on me that perhaps they were hinting they would rather me feed in there rather than at my table.

She may have interpreted the "breastfeeding room" the same way.

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 15:14

Slowingdownagain · 29/01/2023 12:43

She was selfish, the purpose of the
changing room was to change babies. I’m sure you could have done it elsewhere but it’s not super hygienic to be changing a baby in eg a cafe. Especially a slightly older one.

she should have found a quiet corner to bf or if she really felt uncomfortable being seen then sat in her car.

Not every one drives 🙄

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 15:17

WineDup · 29/01/2023 13:49

It was me who initially mentioned tampons - you suggested that parents could use the toilet while holding a child - I’m really curious as to how you think this would be possible? Again, it’s abundantly clear that you do not have your own children as you are unable to understand how that would be difficult/impossible.

Disabled toilets do not have to be exclusively for use by disabled people. Many places ONLY offer a disabled toilet, for example. Should I just shit myself next time there is no other toilets?

And actually, you can be fined for using parent and child spaces if you do not have a child under the age of 12 who is travelling in a car seat. They are rarely enforced (similar to disabled spaces in supermarkets and other private car parks) but they are enforceable.

I can’t believe someone would be cruel enough to say that a baby should have to stay in a shit filled nappy until they get home, or be changed on a bathroom floor, because disabled people don’t want to wait 5 minutes.

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The point you're missing is, is it better your nappy clad child sit in a shit filled nappy or an adult mess themselves in public?

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 15:21

Nosleepforthismum · 29/01/2023 05:58

I think she was being a bit selfish tbh and I wouldn’t have stayed in there to feed my child if I knew another mum was outside waiting to change hers.

Yes, much better to stop feeding the hungry baby and let him scream holy murder for an hour until you could get home. They should learn to only want to breastfeed twice a, day at a convenient time.

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 15:39

fitzwilliamdarcy · 29/01/2023 01:23

There’s a third option: campaigning for your own bloody facilities.

I realise that you can’t be bothered because the ideal facilities already exist and it’s easier to just nick them and then argue that disability somehow includes having a baby, but one can dream.

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Actually my much better plan is I can't use tampons because they hurt, but yes, I've clearly just posted that having twins is a disability 🙄🙄.

Most places have ONE toilet which is accessible for people in a wheelchair but is an accessible toilet for all. Perhaps you should start a legal campaign to get Starbucks and the like prosecuted for not keeping their sole toilet for disabled people only.

I have zero issue with having a wee with the loo door open if I can get my buggy into the actual toilet and I've been known to ask someone to wait and watch my children outside in the corridor because of shit design.

But toilets they are clearly labelled as multi use will get used by people who need them. Saying ooh well just balance your kids on your and use your fourth arm to pull the tampon our is pointless.

People aren't going to pee or poo themselves in public, or let menstrual blood leak over their clothes whilst the toilets are designated for their use also.

I've looked, and can find nothing to suggest these people or shoes are breaking the law
"Whilst there is no law to stop this (aka same as none disabled parents can use baby change in accessible ones even though guidance suggest it shouldn’t be located in it) the EA still applies to keep toilets available". Legal response to a query about transgender people using the disbaeld loo

It comes down to good practice and reasonable adjustment.

Slowingdownagain · 29/01/2023 15:48

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 15:14

Not every one drives 🙄

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Well then, in the cafe. Or a stall in the women’s bathroom if she really wants to sit on a loo. An option that doesn’t prevent others from using necessary facilities for almost an hour.

🙄

DappledThings · 29/01/2023 17:17

sanabria · 29/01/2023 14:54

Sometimes I feel like I am expected to use the baby feeding room if there is one available rather than feed in public.

I was once feeding my baby at a cafe and the waitress came up to me and asked if I was comfortable feeding there and to let me know there was a parent room with chairs for breastfeeding etc. I thanked her for letting me know but assured her I was happy where I was.

Only after did it dawn on me that perhaps they were hinting they would rather me feed in there rather than at my table.

She may have interpreted the "breastfeeding room" the same way.

I've had this too. In a John Lewis cafe. She was definitely trying to get me to move but drsssing it up as faux concern and I was having none of it. I'm not interested in a "breastfeeding room". Any room I'm in is a breastfeeding room if the baby is hungry (*was hungry, my bf days are behind me now).

Only a toilet or specific changing room is appropriate for changing a nappy though. Nappy changing trumps feeding any time given that one can be done anywhere and the other can't.

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 18:19

Slowingdownagain · 29/01/2023 15:48

Well then, in the cafe. Or a stall in the women’s bathroom if she really wants to sit on a loo. An option that doesn’t prevent others from using necessary facilities for almost an hour.

🙄

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There's a huge difference to feeding in a room where nappies are changed on one side but not presently, and feeding sat on an actual toilet whilst someone next door is pooing. Sorry, but anyone who thinks a baby should be fed in the loo so they don't have to be inconvenienced is ridiculous. Op had options. Perhaps SHE could have changed her kids nappy on the toilet. You know, the place for poo not lunch.

Slowingdownagain · 29/01/2023 18:21

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 18:19

There's a huge difference to feeding in a room where nappies are changed on one side but not presently, and feeding sat on an actual toilet whilst someone next door is pooing. Sorry, but anyone who thinks a baby should be fed in the loo so they don't have to be inconvenienced is ridiculous. Op had options. Perhaps SHE could have changed her kids nappy on the toilet. You know, the place for poo not lunch.

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The breastfeeding mother had options. There was only one changing table. Presumably it was also the accessible loo so people who needed that would have options.

you can’t place a baby on the toilet. It’s unhygienic and unsafe. How ridiculous.

are you the woman bfing in loo?

DappledThings · 29/01/2023 18:42

The breastfeeding mother had options.
Indeed. She could have chosen to provide her baby with its food in the place where people have food, rather than the place people change shitty nappies. A decision I'll never understand.

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 19:02

Slowingdownagain · 29/01/2023 18:21

The breastfeeding mother had options. There was only one changing table. Presumably it was also the accessible loo so people who needed that would have options.

you can’t place a baby on the toilet. It’s unhygienic and unsafe. How ridiculous.

are you the woman bfing in loo?

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Nope, I'm a failure who never got my twins to take to it.

But I can still understand why she -
a. Maybe couldn't afford to sit in the cafe
b. Didn't feel confident to potentially get her whole breast out, make a mess etc if it's early days in front of gawping strangers
C. Possibly didn't have a car
D. Didn't want to sit outside a supermarket in a corner in January trying to bf.

I do think it would have been reasonable to share the space.

I can imagine lots of reasons why, such as possibly having just got a good latch, then the door is being hammered and someone's shouting at you so you have to get up and then baby is off and you've had a few hours sleep and it's a bit much and you just end up being snappy and a cow and then crying behind your locked door, that she wasn't all "hey yeah mama, come in and bond with me!!"

And clearly I didn't mean prop your 4 month old on the seat and tell them to pee 😂😂 but she could have put baby on her lap whilst sat on the loo, used the space in the loos like she did the disabled loo, used an area of table top in there, used her car, etc.

She actually changed her child then sat in the cafe monitoring how long it took bf Mom so she could start a thread on MN shaming her.

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 19:03

DappledThings · 29/01/2023 18:42

The breastfeeding mother had options.
Indeed. She could have chosen to provide her baby with its food in the place where people have food, rather than the place people change shitty nappies. A decision I'll never understand.

Lack of cash to sit in the cafe not eating or drinking the food you've brought because you can't work out free hands?

Lack of "skill" in getting baby ont othe breast easily and shame over flashing her breasts, being seen to struggle etc.

It's not like she's lying baby on a pile of nappies for goodness sake.

Slowingdownagain · 29/01/2023 19:07

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 19:02

Nope, I'm a failure who never got my twins to take to it.

But I can still understand why she -
a. Maybe couldn't afford to sit in the cafe
b. Didn't feel confident to potentially get her whole breast out, make a mess etc if it's early days in front of gawping strangers
C. Possibly didn't have a car
D. Didn't want to sit outside a supermarket in a corner in January trying to bf.

I do think it would have been reasonable to share the space.

I can imagine lots of reasons why, such as possibly having just got a good latch, then the door is being hammered and someone's shouting at you so you have to get up and then baby is off and you've had a few hours sleep and it's a bit much and you just end up being snappy and a cow and then crying behind your locked door, that she wasn't all "hey yeah mama, come in and bond with me!!"

And clearly I didn't mean prop your 4 month old on the seat and tell them to pee 😂😂 but she could have put baby on her lap whilst sat on the loo, used the space in the loos like she did the disabled loo, used an area of table top in there, used her car, etc.

She actually changed her child then sat in the cafe monitoring how long it took bf Mom so she could start a thread on MN shaming her.

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I bf for 4.5 years between my two. No bfing woman would be kicked out a supermarket cafe for not purchasing anything.

she was selfish because she was using - for a really long time - the one facility available for, and purposely designated, for nappy changing. And I assume accessible toilet. For something that could easily and more appropriately be done elsewhere.

MagAmberson · 29/01/2023 19:14

She could have explained she was still feeding but you could use the changing table if you didn't mind sharing the room with her. I say this as someone who is breastfeeding my third baby at the moment, 45 mins is an excessive time, even feed the baby for 10/15 mins so you know the baby isn't starving and then try to get home or find a cafe to feed.

WindscreenWipe · 29/01/2023 21:42

Swiftswatch · 29/01/2023 08:27

Why would they have very long legs? You put the child at 90 degrees to you, not length ways along your legs.

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I know… My thighs aren’t even remotely long enough to be a wide enough surface to rest a baby on…

SwingandaPrayer · 29/01/2023 21:50

Most baby change/feeding spaces are perfectly able to cope with two mums in at the same time. I've been bfing before and another mum has come in to use the changing facility at the same time. Surely they're not mutually exclusive?

SleepingStandingUp · 29/01/2023 22:25

Slowingdownagain · 29/01/2023 19:07

I bf for 4.5 years between my two. No bfing woman would be kicked out a supermarket cafe for not purchasing anything.

she was selfish because she was using - for a really long time - the one facility available for, and purposely designated, for nappy changing. And I assume accessible toilet. For something that could easily and more appropriately be done elsewhere.

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But does she know that? Does she have the confidence to walk in and sit down, get baby latched and start feeding? Or are they worried someone will come over and tell them off? We've already had people say they've been "offered" somewhere else to feed and thankfully they had the confidence to say no thanks. There's also the "exposure" thing of getting your breast "out" in public.
I'm not saying bf Mom covered herself in glory, she should have offered to share the space, I'm just saying there's a reason she's hiding in a baby change and it's unlikely to be neckar she's a selfish cow who likes babies to wallow in poo.