Dad and women's changing room.

[BubbleMachine]

I have name changed for this just incase the dad in question is on here - I am maybe being paranoid but a little shaken up from this confrontation.

I go to toddler swimming class. It is in a school and there are 2 small communal changing rooms, one for women and one for men. I have to go in the pool with my child.

Today after class I was trying to get dressed but a Dad had the door wide open to the women's changing room, standing in the doorway, trying to "help" his wife with their four year old child. This Dad is not a regular and I have never seen him or his family before. The door to the changing room opens up to the lobby area so there is zero privacy if the door is open.

I asked to please move and shut the door as I was trying to get dressed. He looked me up and down and said that he was just trying to help with his child. I repeated that I wanted to get unchanged so he had to leave and shut the door. He then said that he was not some sort of pervert and that I need not worry, no one in their right mind would want to look at me anyway. I, at this stage start to get angry and say "I don't care if you want to look or not, I don't want to get undressed in front of you". He then shouted a bit more that I was mental and slammed the door and left.

Then there was an uncomfortable few minutes while I changed next to his wife and child in total silence. I hurried to get dressed and out asap as it was really awkward. My husband was changing our child in the men's changing room.

I leave the women's changing room to the foyer to put my shoes on and wait for my husband. This man is there and he is still angry. He starts attacking the way I dress and look and keeps repeating in different ways how I am too ugly for anyone to look at. I keep repeating over and over again that I don't care if he want to look or not, I have a right to my privacy. He is adamant he has a right to change his child and that he was not technically "in" the changing room, just at the door.

Then my husband comes out with our child. The guy looks at him and says "awww, I am so sorry for you Mate, having to be married to that". I say to my husband he is angry because I asked him to leave the changing room, and my husband responds with "don't speak to my wife like that".

My husband is an extremely calm and mild manner man, he tired to explain to him that when men are asked to leave female spaces they should do. The guys starts mocking him, "what is this fucking woke bullshit" and laughing. He then gets his phone out and starts phoning me and calling me a Karen and "look at the state of this bitch thinking I would give her the time of day - don't flatter yourself love". I just keep repeating all the time that all I wanted was to get dressed not in front of him. I then say it is extremely entitled of you to think you have a right to be in the women's changing room and he explodes at the word entitled. "Don't you dare call me entitled, I am going to find your car and hunt you down at a service station".

At this stage, we have our coats and shoes on now... I know there is a lot of text here but all this happened in just a couple of minutes. I say let's just leave. And he says, if you ever speak to me like that again I will have you.

We get back to the car and I bust in to tears and we drive home. Aibu to be worried he is going to upload that video to social media and make me look like some mental "Karen" (I hate that word, I am only using it as he did). Also should we just leave the class now? I don't want my child and husband to be put through that again. I don't know what the swimming school would say or do if I reported it. Should I report it? Sorry for being so waffley and for the many typos, I am very shaken up and really needed to get it all down and clear my head and work out the next step here.

Is there another swim school you can move to? Their response is shit. I would not want to give them my money.

I would write or email them the following facts.

1. You did not accuse the dad of being a pervert
2. You simply asked him to give you some privacy for changing
3. He insulted your appearance
4. He threatened you and your husband with violence

I would ask them to watch back the cctv and ask them to consider all of this in their response.

That is a very disappointing response. If they do not own the premises the swim school won't have access to the cctv. Indeed op can only view it if the police make a request to the school. Op, I would set out the facts and your complaint in writing. Do they have a Safeguarding and Complaints policy you can refer to?

Oh my goodness this response is absolutely appalling.

How on earth can anyone possibly defend him? You did NOT call him a pervert but his behaviour could be construed as such, who in their right mind would do what he done, it is outrageous.

He then goaded you by filming you, he felt you implied he was a pervert because of his own actions but you didn’t.

Definitley go ahead with reporting him to the police and I would take the report to the swim school further if possible as well.

Also, if you don’t want to be called a pervert get the f**k out of the female changing room.

YANBU. I wouldn't be surprised if the wife is being abused as he sounds as if he was keeping tabs on his her, like he didn't trust her. I mean, who stands in a changing room doorway...so weird.

The swim school run back and have said they have banned him from the site and will make sure that we aren't in the same lessons again as the mum and child just to avoid any cross overs outside the venue with dropping off etc. They said the Dad said he was in the changing room because their child has additional needs and he needed to be there to support them. I said I appreciate child may have additional needs but that shouldn't come at the expense of a women's privacy. Ultimately though, they said they can't allow such aggressive behaviour he is now banned.

That's an about face in attitude! Wonder what changed 🤨 Good that he's banned.

Thanks for the update OP.

What a disappointing response from the swim school.

You know you didn't call him a perv, but even if you did, he had no right to abuse you! Surely they will have cctv of the incident and they should be able to see that his behaviour was threatening towards you?

What did his wife do while he was shouting and abusing you at the time? I would think if she was silent the whole time, then it would suggest that she's scared if him. [:(] The holding the door open to "help" his wife with the child is such controlling behaviour.

I hope the police will have a more helpful response.

I think the swim school viewed the cctv & realised the hot water (pun intended) they'd now be in if they didn't respond appropriately.

Congratulations on standing your ground OP.
Are you going to follow up with the police, or does having him banned give you the reassurance you need?

Seen your update just now @BubbleMachine . At least that is something and hopefully you won't ever run into him again.

I hope no-one else has to endure his abuse either.

So his child has additional needs that require both him and his wife to change them. Does the site have facilities for this then or will they just let him hold the door of the women's changing room again.

That's a good outcome OP. Well done for being assertive!

That is a better outcome. Leave it with the police, who knows what else they have had reports of.

Even if the additional needs is true, how does standing in the doorway shouting into the changing room help??? He wasn't exactly assisting the wife and child...just shouting abuse.

So his child has additional needs that require both him and his wife to change them

I don't believe that to be true.

The dad wasn't helping - he was stood at the changing room entrance, observing.

This is just the bullshit he came up with after being challenged.
It's about as accurate as him claiming OP called him a pervert.

The dad is suggesting I was insinuating he was a pervert and that is why I didn't want him in the changing room. The swim school said that is a big and nasty allegation to make and of course it would make him angry. I explained I didn't call him a pervert, I just asked him, politely at first and then more firmer later to leave. They are trying to suggest we are both as bad as each other and "not a pleasant situation for him or you".

What a nightmare, OP, the whole thing. You were very brave to speak up, and then to continue to defend your position and report the thug to the swim school and to police.

I'm glad he's been banned. But I'm disgusted by the management's first response, to try to minimise his abuse and accuse you. They wouldn't have backed down if you hadn't strongly defended yourself. Well done for not letting them slide out of their responsibilities. The swim school's actions would have left the place much less safe for women and children; yours has increased their safety.

Exactly. Unpleasant men feel absolutely entitled to invade our spaces and are enabled by many.

Well quite. Seems convenient.

He knows that he's in shit.

They said on the call they have now seen the CCTV and the dad hasn't denied any of what I said but he seems to think it was justified because I called him a pervert when he just wanted to help his SEN child get dressed. I am just glad they have taken me seriously after investigating it and letting us both "have our say".

Agreed. But the pool isn’t gas lighting the OP. It’s thrown about on here completely out of context and drives me BONKERS

@BubbleMachine, I've only just found your thread, but I just wanted to say that it sounds like you did all the right things, and I'm glad the school have banned this horror of a human! It must have been incredibly scary for you, but good for you for standing up to him.

Great update. What an absolute cock he is.

I hope the pool banning him (and hopefully the police giving him a talking to) will mean he now stays under his rock.

Of course you do not leave the lesson. You complain to the swimming company that a male participant insisted on staying in the female changing room, even when politely asked to leave, and the insulted and verbally attacked you, and threatened you. He also filmed you without your permission.
you do not feel save in the lesson’s environment- what will they do to ensure the safety of the participants?hope you are ok

Clearly he behaved like a knob to them too. Glad he has a consequence for his outrageous behavior.

The dad is suggesting I was insinuating he was a pervert and that is why I didn't want him in the changing room. The swim school said that is a big and nasty allegation to make and of course it would make him angry.

Given that he has come to that conclusion all by himself, I'd agree with the PP who said that if any other man had done the same, he'd have been the first to complain. "Other men doing it = pervert; me doing it = fine". Clearly being (rightly) challenged hit a nerve.

This doesn't sound like open-minded evidence gathering, it sounds like a coward doing their level best to make the incident go away.

OP please continue with the police report, he sounds dangerous!