Page 7 | Asked to be guarantor for DS who wont save - WWYD?

wonderingannie · 2023-01-23T14:12:54+00:00

I just need some perspective hear - I'm not sure if I'm being unreasonable or not DS 20 in the 1st year of university started late due to covid so had a good 15 months off before, after much persuading and pushing, helping write CVs and application form etc finally got a job for around 6 months before which he saved half his wage (gave this to me to bank), to keep for when he started uni (I will add I never charged any board). He only gets the minimum loan which just covers costs of halls. Has been there for 5 months and has barely applied for any jobs, money is running out and I'm worrying! any spare money he got for xmas has been spent on games, clothes, trainers etc. Money just burns a hole in his pocket and if I hadn't pushed him to get a job pre uni he would literally not have a penny to his name right now. He now needs to secure accommodation for next year and his loan no where near covers the cost of this, he has just this week secured a job (hooray), I'm really pleased but he is point blank refusing to send me part of his wages to save towards the astronomical rent next year (he says its embarrassing? I'm not sure who would know or why saving to ensure you can pay your rent is embarrassing). Yet he is expecting me to sign as a guarantor for this rent which if he defaults on I just cannot afford to pay. He has since said if I don't sign he will have to drop out! He will be earning more than double what I send him weekly now (out of his savings), so saving a portion of it will still see him much better off than he is at the moment whilst ensuring his rent will get paid. He tells me he will save it but I just don't believe he has the will power to do so speaking from experience! we are kind of at a stalemate at the moment and both likely feeling a bit blackmailed by the other YANBU - I should trust that he will save it and sign as guarantor? YABU - I should not sign until he agrees to send me a portion of his salary to save for rent. If he refuses let him quit.

orchid220 · 23/01/2023 17:08

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 16:52

Thanks @BlahBlahBlah098 I wished I lived in this ideological world some of these posters describe!

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It would be very rare to be on benefits for 18 years and then suddenly be on an income of £110k. Given that you managed on a very low income for 18 years you would think you could manage to give your DC some of the sudden huge increase. You would be left with a lot more than you previously had afterall.

Original poster

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 17:11

orchid220 · 23/01/2023 17:08

It would be very rare to be on benefits for 18 years and then suddenly be on an income of £110k. Given that you managed on a very low income for 18 years you would think you could manage to give your DC some of the sudden huge increase. You would be left with a lot more than you previously had afterall.

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My income is no where near 110k

OP posts:

MoneyPrize2283 · 23/01/2023 17:11

Wow OP you really are a piece of work. I feel incredibly sorry for your son, who is in the very unfortunate position of getting the minimum student loan while also having parents who are not prepared to do what is expected of them.

Your orignal post is very judgemental towards your son and his "poor finances", but it's YOU that has the irresponsible approach to finances which is causing you to fail your children. How dare you judge him for not being able to save up for university when its you that is the one who has failed here and isnt doing the bare minimum. You've presumably known for years that the government expects you to provide financial support to your son, so what have you managed to save up exactly? Why is it your son's responsible to cover the £5000/year which YOU are expected to be paying?

Your son is working much harder than most kids that age -- he has a job, and has been saving up for university (which he wouldnt have to do if you were actually taking on your responsibility). In return, you are demanding he gives you all his money and then returning it him,w and making out that you do are somehow doing him a favour. And then you have the audacity to nag and judge him

Being guarantor is the absolute minimum that you should be doing (in actuality, you should be paying his rent yourself). Maybe try having a look in the mirror at your own approach to financess and being less judgemental of a young man who is doing his best in spite of parental failure

orchid220 · 23/01/2023 17:14

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 17:11

My income is no where near 110k

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BlahBlahBlah098 said that was their income but despite that can't give their DC any money.

Original poster

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 17:15

MoneyPrize2283 · 23/01/2023 17:11

Wow OP you really are a piece of work. I feel incredibly sorry for your son, who is in the very unfortunate position of getting the minimum student loan while also having parents who are not prepared to do what is expected of them.

Your orignal post is very judgemental towards your son and his "poor finances", but it's YOU that has the irresponsible approach to finances which is causing you to fail your children. How dare you judge him for not being able to save up for university when its you that is the one who has failed here and isnt doing the bare minimum. You've presumably known for years that the government expects you to provide financial support to your son, so what have you managed to save up exactly? Why is it your son's responsible to cover the £5000/year which YOU are expected to be paying?

Your son is working much harder than most kids that age -- he has a job, and has been saving up for university (which he wouldnt have to do if you were actually taking on your responsibility). In return, you are demanding he gives you all his money and then returning it him,w and making out that you do are somehow doing him a favour. And then you have the audacity to nag and judge him

Being guarantor is the absolute minimum that you should be doing (in actuality, you should be paying his rent yourself). Maybe try having a look in the mirror at your own approach to financess and being less judgemental of a young man who is doing his best in spite of parental failure

Wow you are so rude. He did not work for 12 months whilst he decided what to do. I didn't take a penny off him other than helped him get a job when he decided uni was what he wanted to do. I did help by taking him to work and collecting him not charging rent to enable him to save. I explained our financial commitments and he was fully aware of how much we could help. How dare you say I have failed my child. You are low.

OP posts:

strivingtosucceed · 23/01/2023 17:17

MoneyPrize2283 · 23/01/2023 17:11

Wow OP you really are a piece of work. I feel incredibly sorry for your son, who is in the very unfortunate position of getting the minimum student loan while also having parents who are not prepared to do what is expected of them.

Your orignal post is very judgemental towards your son and his "poor finances", but it's YOU that has the irresponsible approach to finances which is causing you to fail your children. How dare you judge him for not being able to save up for university when its you that is the one who has failed here and isnt doing the bare minimum. You've presumably known for years that the government expects you to provide financial support to your son, so what have you managed to save up exactly? Why is it your son's responsible to cover the £5000/year which YOU are expected to be paying?

Your son is working much harder than most kids that age -- he has a job, and has been saving up for university (which he wouldnt have to do if you were actually taking on your responsibility). In return, you are demanding he gives you all his money and then returning it him,w and making out that you do are somehow doing him a favour. And then you have the audacity to nag and judge him

Being guarantor is the absolute minimum that you should be doing (in actuality, you should be paying his rent yourself). Maybe try having a look in the mirror at your own approach to financess and being less judgemental of a young man who is doing his best in spite of parental failure

MN is so weird about financial topics, on another thread, it was a race to the bottom about how not everyone has the money to cook from scratch and here we have a poster laying into the OP for not being able to save up £5k a year for their (presumably not only) child to go to uni. You're totally wrong about everything you've said btw most students in Uni have jobs and are perpetually skint. I had to be guarantor for my sis while she was in uni because my parents were so skint, a few years before that she was in private school. Circumstances can change in a flash so there's no need to pile onto OP.

@wonderingannie i'd back other posters who suggested receiving the maintenance loan and disbursing it for him, or be a co-signer for one of those guarantor companies. You can offer to pay the guarantor fees as an expression of goodwill but the tattoo showed he likely can't be trusted with money.

Original poster

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 17:21

strivingtosucceed · 23/01/2023 17:17

MN is so weird about financial topics, on another thread, it was a race to the bottom about how not everyone has the money to cook from scratch and here we have a poster laying into the OP for not being able to save up £5k a year for their (presumably not only) child to go to uni. You're totally wrong about everything you've said btw most students in Uni have jobs and are perpetually skint. I had to be guarantor for my sis while she was in uni because my parents were so skint, a few years before that she was in private school. Circumstances can change in a flash so there's no need to pile onto OP.

@wonderingannie i'd back other posters who suggested receiving the maintenance loan and disbursing it for him, or be a co-signer for one of those guarantor companies. You can offer to pay the guarantor fees as an expression of goodwill but the tattoo showed he likely can't be trusted with money.

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I sense we are in that "middle squeeze" category that is often mentioned on MN. We do have other children and childcare costs. I am also paying back a student loan, I would love it support all my children through uni, I think people are thinking I'm saying this to be cruel when I'm just trying to save guard his future he's loving uni and wants to stay. I cannot magic money up so we need to compromise

OP posts:

L0bstersLass · 23/01/2023 17:22

strivingtosucceed · 23/01/2023 17:17

MN is so weird about financial topics, on another thread, it was a race to the bottom about how not everyone has the money to cook from scratch and here we have a poster laying into the OP for not being able to save up £5k a year for their (presumably not only) child to go to uni. You're totally wrong about everything you've said btw most students in Uni have jobs and are perpetually skint. I had to be guarantor for my sis while she was in uni because my parents were so skint, a few years before that she was in private school. Circumstances can change in a flash so there's no need to pile onto OP.

@wonderingannie i'd back other posters who suggested receiving the maintenance loan and disbursing it for him, or be a co-signer for one of those guarantor companies. You can offer to pay the guarantor fees as an expression of goodwill but the tattoo showed he likely can't be trusted with money.

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Her son is getting the bare minimum maintenance loan as the household income is over £62k p.a.
The expecation from the government is that parents provide £5k p.a. to students in this situation.
See this 5 minute video from Martin Lewis -

MoneyPrize2283 · 23/01/2023 17:25

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Original poster

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 17:26

L0bstersLass · 23/01/2023 17:22

Her son is getting the bare minimum maintenance loan as the household income is over £62k p.a.
The expecation from the government is that parents provide £5k p.a. to students in this situation.
See this 5 minute video from Martin Lewis -

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I'm not disputing that but sometime life doesn't quite fit into boxes

OP posts:

Cormakorma · 23/01/2023 17:26

To add to what everyone else is saying. A lot of people in this thread don't understand how modern student finance works. When I was a student my dad had a decent income but chose not to support me through uni. I was able to get a loan that covered my living costs and was skint but could survive (working during holidays). Now that simply isn't possible because students are treated like dependants and the loan is based on their parent's income. His parents are expected to contribute and this is built into the loan system. It is not him that's at fault here - he has worked, earned, spent his own cash and got another job, while being a student, which is a lot more than a huge number of students do. What he's asking from his parents is perfectly reasonable and indeed an expected part of the system and they should have budgeted for it.

orchid220 · 23/01/2023 17:26

EMUKE · 23/01/2023 16:11

Many children go to university, many with or without loans. IT IS NOT financially down to a parent or guardian to pay for this. Not in the UK. I appreciate the system and yes it’s broken! But a child going to university should not depend on if mummy and daddy can pay or substitute payment. I am proud I went and supported myself through university and onwards. Did I struggle?!? Yes! Did I learn financially how to budget and control my income and outgoings? Yes! Did mummy or daddy help me? NO… it can’t be all take take take.

Whether or not you agree with it, it is actually up to mummy and daddy to top up the student loan if their income is high enough. This has always been the case. When I went to university in the 80s parents were expected to contribute the entire grant amount if they had over a certain income. I wouldn't want to put my children in a position where they are worse off because of me but that's what OP is doing effectively.

Original poster

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 17:29

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You absolute cheeky sod you have zero idea what I have done in my life and are ill advised to make any judgement on my efforts! Stop trolling people and get a life

OP posts:

Theluggage15 · 23/01/2023 17:29

I feel sorry for him, he’s not getting the loan because of your income, you’re refusing to top it up properly, refusing to be his guarantor, unless he sends you money. You’re moaning he’s irresponsible when he’s been managing pretty well on probably a lot less than his friends. Surely university didn’t come as a surprise?

Solmum1964 · 23/01/2023 17:30

Nw22 · 23/01/2023 14:41

If he gets the minimum loan you should be paying his rent anyway

I agree with this. DH refused to declare his income so DTs were only eligible for the minimum loan. He did, however, pay rent in full for their undergraduate years.

Onnabugeisha · 23/01/2023 17:30

YABU

You should be topping up his loan to the maximum, not requiring him to top the loan up for you from his earnings. If you did not plan for this, that’s you’re failure to save not his.
He needs the income from his job to pay for food, transport, books and supplies
He’s old enough to control the money he earns

Onnabugeisha · 23/01/2023 17:31

Least you could do is be guarantor, which btw is standard practice. All my DC needed a parent as guarantor.

icelolly12 · 23/01/2023 17:34

Zipps · 23/01/2023 16:26

No way. Time for him to brace himself for the real world. You have supported him enough. Leave him to it.

In the real world a guarantor is needed for students. Most parents understand this and sign on the dotted line.

Sceptre86 · 23/01/2023 17:38

You are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Is there anyone else in his life other than you who cam give him a good talking to? I'd be inclined to talk him that if he drops out he will still have to find somewhere to live as you won't be having him home.

Is there a reason for his lack of get up and go?

u

WallaceinAnderland · 23/01/2023 17:39

OP my 2 dc supported themselves through university as we could not afford to subsidise even though our earnings meant they only got minimum grants/loans. They got jobs and paid their own way.

Forget what he says and focus on the facts. Can you afford to pay his rent? If not, then you can't be guarantor even if you wanted to. It really is that simple. You can't give what you don't have.

icelolly12 · 23/01/2023 17:39

Is there a reason for his lack of get up and go?

Am I missing something? He's studying full time, going to Uni to better himself and has secured a job. What more get up and go do you expect?!

Theluggage15 · 23/01/2023 17:40

Sceptre86 · 23/01/2023 17:38

You are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Is there anyone else in his life other than you who cam give him a good talking to? I'd be inclined to talk him that if he drops out he will still have to find somewhere to live as you won't be having him home.

Is there a reason for his lack of get up and go?

u

Umm what?!!!

Onnabugeisha · 23/01/2023 17:40

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 16:08

I haven't had years to save for this
We have been on a low income for along time bettering ourselves gradually through training and working hard, I saved £3000 and gave it to him when he was 18 years old, this was before he had decided to go to university at all.
I saved every bloody month for that since he was a child and it was a huge undertaking for me to do.
Have you seen the increase in mortgage rates, gas and electric bills, food, council tax, petrol! if I had the money of course I would pay to help out and I do as much as possible.

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You’ve had twenty years to plan and save for this. 🧐

titchy · 23/01/2023 17:41

I'm not disputing that but sometime life doesn't quite fit into boxes

And your ds is the one you are making suffer for that.

On top of that you're refusing to support him as guarantor.

AND you think he should send you what he earns from his job so you can give it him back, rather than saving from your own income!

You posted asking for perspectives, but seem to be trying to defend yourself all the ones saying you've let your child down. Perhaps we're right, and you should have had some foresight here.

orchid220 · 23/01/2023 17:42

wonderingannie · 23/01/2023 17:21

I sense we are in that "middle squeeze" category that is often mentioned on MN. We do have other children and childcare costs. I am also paying back a student loan, I would love it support all my children through uni, I think people are thinking I'm saying this to be cruel when I'm just trying to save guard his future he's loving uni and wants to stay. I cannot magic money up so we need to compromise

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How many children do you have? it seems rather hypocritical to choose to have several children and be financially squeezed as a result but then criticise your child for his financial planning.