To not allow BIL unsupervised access to my DS

[Hennyspennies]

I am seeking advice on this as I want to be sure I am doing the right thing by my DS and not for selfish reasons.

Warning : May be triggering, mentions sexual assault.

Back story - Strained relationship with BIL for the past 7 years. This was due to a breakdown in family relationships after BIL's DD sexually molested my DS. She was 11, DS was 1. My DS doesn't remember this, as he was unable to talk, we never found out what fully happened.

I believe there was no real responsibility taken, other than a quick sorry from my S & BIL when the incident happened. DN never spoke to me about it, or said sorry.
I believed DN needed help (another red flag incident when she was 6) but as far as I know never received any. It was swept under the rug.

Family were expected to get on as normal. My parents expected everyone to meet up as usual with no safeguarding issues re the kids or respect for my families difficult feelings at this time.
Things were strained.

I tried to speak with them about our feelings and concerns respectfully but nothing changed so I kept my distance.

Fast forward 7 years. My S & BIL have been in our lives on and off more frequently. Months in-between visits (they live near by). I still feel uncomfortable in their presence as they I've noticed they usually spend time with us when they want something.

My DS is really into football at the moment and BIL coaches a local kids team. Without asking me or my DH he told my son that he would take him to see football matches, teach him how to play etc. Has already bought him a football shirt.

Since BIL hasn't been involved in my DS life much and because of failure to safeguard him in the past, I feel uncomfortable with the idea of my DS going anywhere with him unsupervised. This applies to my S too. My DH agrees with me.

DS was super excited his U wanted to to all this with him of course. However, he is unaware of what happened when he was younger.

I felt it appropriate to agree to football trips and training so long as myself or DH are present. AIBU?

BIL keeps pushing for alone time with my DS. (He has 4 DD so appreciates my DS love of football).

I also have 2 older DD which he shows little interest in.

Any advice or thoughts welcome.

100% this

Yes, I'd say go with your instincts. As others have said, an 11 year old girl sexually offending is unusual in the absence of other issues.
I don't expect you to go into further detail and your AIBU was about unsupervised access, so no you're not unreasonable however.....
Your niece is now and adult. Do she live with your sister still? Have you ever considered speaking to her about this and seeing if there's more to it. There are other younger cousins too who may be at risk. Why is it all being swept under the carpet?
I'd also be ensuring your son had a good understanding of what is and isn't appropriate so he's confident how he would handle anything inappropriate.

I wouldn't even be in speaking terms with them never mind letting him take him to football. Get your DS into another team and you and / or H take him to watch and play. Don't involve that side of the family into anything you do.

I don't understand how you don't know what happened? Or how your 1yr old wasn't in the company of an adult. How long was she with him to have abused him?.

Surely you would scream until you're blue in the face to get answers.
You ensure SS investigate the abuser etc etc

This whole thing sounds so passive over a huge issue.
But anyway, no I'd not be even having any iota of a relationship with BIL etc. Fuck that.

You keep being the black sheep. I know that's easier said than done, but you're quite right to protect your children from being around BIL. Do the football elsewhere, and as PP said, make sure BIL doesn't carry out private communications with your son when he's old enough for a phone.

This is grooming and I would explain to your child he can't be trusted. I would go no contact with them

They would be permanently blocked by me.

Hennyspennies "I personally do not get the vibe that BIL is an abuser. However, you never really know. I do not know his side of family well either. DN was cared for alot by his parents and siblings when my S and BIL worked."

So I assume you have doubts about his parents and siblings as well as your BIL. Any one of them could have abused your DN.

Quite agree
Id be asking the question why his daughter assaulted your son and why your BIL and SIL didn’t seek help
Possibly because they’re hiding something.

Exactly. That's what anyone would do. this is all slavery strange

Sign him up to a different team and say sorry, we already have a plan for his football.

“I personally do not get the vibe that BIL is an abuser.”
They very rarely give out abuser vibes @Hennyspennies . They are usually much more clever than that. Look at all the high-profile cases: trusted teachers, priests, people you never would have looked at as pervs. Savile was a rare exception, he did give off vibes but people were scared to say anything.

Good point by @GenExer - do not allow BIL any way to contact your son privately. And teach your son to know that it’s not right for anyone, not even Fun Uncle, to contact a child without their parents knowing.

I’m appalled that 3% are saying YABU. Some people are insanely naive. Others are willing to put a child at risk for the sake of avoiding family disharmony, it would seem. Like my family were.

I’ve said this before on other threads, because this scenario comes up horrifyingly often on MN and I feel very strongly about it: when I was little I was raped by a family member. It’s no exaggeration to say I truly hate the people involved, not just the rapist but the family who allowed him to be alone with me, and then made everything ok for themselves by pretending it didn’t happen. Don’t let this happen to your child and to you. It affected my whole life.

@Lego well done for being strong. My parents weren’t.

You need to go No Contact.

This first post says it all.

Plus - if an 11 year old (particularly a girl) has sexually assaultedababy, then she has learned this behaviour somewhere. She has seen something she ought hot to, or something has been done to her.

DO NOT let this man have access to your child unless there is an adult that you can trust present as well.

Why the hell is he so keen to get your son alone? This is a red flag the size of the former Socialist Soviet Republic waving here! Any normal adult might suggest taking a nephew to football, but wouldn't be bothered if a parent/grandparent came too. I would be worried that he is attempting to groom your child.

Get the fuck out of here bil. His own daughter was displaying sexually inappropriate behaviour at a young age. She didnt make that stuff up herself. She'd been exposed to something inappropriate herself somehow.
Nrtft but really hope ss was involved.

I don't understand what happened with the incident with your son - I don't mean the actual assault (obviously not asking about that!) but did your S and BIL not believe it happened? Or did they think it didn't matter/was innocent/was "just kids being kids" etc? Were they not concerned? The best thing you can say about them here is a shocking lack of judgement and a dismissal of the assault of a child. And those aren't two traits I'd want around my child. And that's without considering what PPs have said about who their daughter may have been a victim of.

That's a big leap. But OP needs to err on the side of caution and maybe joining another football team would be sensible. Or could Dad or OP go, parents tend to watch training and matches.

Its been said before but i’ll say it again…

Why does anyone want alone time with another persons child!!!!

I have literally only heard of this on Mumsnet! It screams red flag to me (surely if BIL is a busy dad, the only alone time he would want is without kids??). I wouldn’t let him anywhere near my kids on his own.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking.

YANBU, OP. Trust your instincts.

Nope, get your DH to take him to the football and find another team not coached by BIL.

Given the incidents and the atmosphere and the lack of close relationship, it is extremely weird that your bil is suggesting doing things with your ds one on one.

He's either incredibly, spectacularly obtuse or something else.

It would be overstepping even if you had a better relationship and there was no history. He's needed to have cleared it with you two first.

No way. Your niece was a damaged child, (and this is the fault of somebody), but she is now an adult. Their disregard for what happened to your baby (who is no longer a baby) is revolting.